Master Plan

pspot

Registered User
Dec 20, 2004
10,241
489
Kitchener
I've always have joked that the leafs new master plan was
a lame duck coach reporting to a lame duck GM, reporting to a guy with no management experience who reports to a guy with no hockey knowledge

but honestly after the moves Shanny has made and the time he's taken to make them i do feel more confident on the direction of the franchise
 

highslot

Registered User
Jul 10, 2012
1,601
18
i don't think spott should have been elevated. he was creating a winning culture with the marlies.
 

Banic

Registered User
Jun 23, 2010
2,522
0
Toronto
Carter/Richards/and Gaborik are support players for the stars/leaders Kopitar ,Doughty , Quick

Ok so Chara and Thomas. Neidermeyer and Pronger. There isn't 1 way to win, yes the Leafs need to draft their own quality players, but just because a player has been traded doesn't make them crap, especially in the cap world.
 

forecheck

Registered User
May 14, 2007
1,656
1,074
Ok so Chara and Thomas. Neidermeyer and Pronger. There isn't 1 way to win, yes the Leafs need to draft their own quality players, but just because a player has been traded doesn't make them crap, especially in the cap world.

Ok -Let me reword for you " Our core group is crap"
 

Mess

Global Moderator
Feb 27, 2002
87,071
12,196
Leafs Home Board
Ok -Let me reword for you " Our core group is crap"

The coach was extended putting the focus on the players for the results of their own play, with management believing this is on them.

The bottom 6 depth forwards and D were then swapped out, which then isolates the team core players as what remained the same.

Now Shanny is watching closely as to how his core group performs this year in relation to the team and then methodically after a full review decide which direction to go next year.

That is the master plan.
 

The CyNick

Freedom of Speech!
Sep 17, 2009
11,364
2,032
I'm not sure what people expect as a plan.

"were going to middle around for a few years then we are targeting Stamkos as a UFA". doesn't work like that.

All you can hope as a fan is that the team continues to build up the depth of the organizing and not handcuff the team long term with bad contacts and trading away picks for short term fixes.

I've said many times on here that i think this whole process is in about year 4 of what could be a 10 year process. You got to remember every team is trying to accomplish the same thing. There isn't a switch we can turn on to acquire only great players
 

Antropovsky

Registered User
Jun 2, 2007
14,336
5,508
Constantly we hear about how playing in Toronto is difficult due to the intense fan base and the pressure that is put on it's team to succeed. Even when Stajan was our 1st line Center, Brian Burke was constantly saying how we were big blue, and how not making the playoff was unacceptable. The team was atrocious, but Burke succeeded in raising the expectations of the abysmal roster.

It doesn't matter how often you say this, if your roster doesn't match your expectations, then your just setting yourself and the fans up for failure.

This goes the same with our players, they are constantly being scolded for not performing, for not being good enough.... instead of talking about rebuilding and growing pains with young players, management says.... we expect better from our players.

I think the collapses aren't because of the players, so much as it being because of the intense pressure the players are always under to succeed.

If I was Shanahan, I would've came in and changed this. I would've said it how it was. "I'm not going to sugarcoat this team, im not going to demand playoffs, or expect them. I will however, guarantee that we will put this team on track to succeed in the future. We will let the players play, assess their abilities, and make moves that are required for this team to succeed. We will not beg the players to compete. We expect it."

Instead management puts together the roster, tells the media and fans that we expect them to make the playoffs. When the young players falter, or don't play to the style of the coach, instead of silently shopping them and moving them, they are thrown beneath the bus, publically ridiculed or benched. Pressure compounded on pressure.

Why are trying to change a leapards spots? Why when we continually don't get the effort we need from players, instead of just moving them, we continually think we can change them?

Lupul will never play like a Toews, or Kopitar... he's 30, never has and sure the heck isn't suddenly going to start.

Kessel will never go to the dirty areas. He's 27, he never has and sure the heck isn't going to start.

Phaneuf, he's our Captain, Phaneuf isn't Captain material. Sorry the guy's game isn't stable, his career is barely stable. His character is in question, as there are a lot of rumors of why he was moved. Sutter himself, said Phaneuf is the reason Phaneuf was traded, a comment that sounds more personal then a result of playing capabilities.

Gardiner, he's never going to be a defensive stalwart, or a tough player to play against. So Carlyle, take him for what he is. A puck rushing, offensive defender. By this time, Carlyle should know if he's making progress to be a effective defender.

etc etc.

As a fan, I just want to see progress. I don't care if we lose, so long as I think management knows why we are losing, and isn't blind to the fact that this roster isn't good enough. That the core of this team, is faulted. Lupul, Kessel, and Phaneuf were traded to us, because they had faults. Faults they still have.

This roster stinks, lets call a spade a spade, not piss and moan and act surprised when they lose, and start putting players who want to play on the ice. I'd rather watch a team full of Komarov's lose, but have the opposing team limp to their bus... then watch a bunch of prima donna's go out there, cover their faces and then come off the ice and say, "we shouldn't have covered both eyes".
 

buttman*

Guest
Okay so when we beat the bolts 7-1 then the next team 8-1 are you still going to be spouting this or are you going to be planning the parade?

The sky is not falling for me until there are a few games left and we are almost in last place.

The Leafs aren't beating the bolts 7-1. Not that I agree with his plan but let's not pretend this team is good.
 

kallaer

Registered User
Oct 7, 2014
14
0
Southwestern Ontario
the plan is to take this group of 23-28 year olds and try to win with them for the next 5 plus years..
draft your 7-15 overall players well, build a strong D core

when they dont win which is most likely
trade kessel with 2 years left on the contract, dion, lupul, clarkson, kadri possibly

in 5 years go into the tank and get your top end fw and carry on.. patience once this core is too old to compete will be the key

other than that lets just see what this core can do I dont believe they have what it takes but only time will tell the east is pretty weak so they could grow up right under our noses
 

666

Registered User
Jun 27, 2005
3,023
789
Education does not equal intelligence, in case you didn't know.

Of course it doesn't BUT:

a) Going to business school gives people the knowledge required to run a business just as doctors learn to perform surgery in medical school.

b) I don't know why you are implying that Shanahan is intelligent, I haven't seen anything to indicate his intelligence either way but even if he is intelligent it doesn't mean that he knows anything about running an NHL team. Einstein was a pretty intelligent guy but I don't think you'd want him running the Leafs either.

This team has the resources to hire the BEST. Shanahan has ZERO experience running anything. I would have thought that the Leafs could do better. Someone on the board or whoever was responsible for hiring Shanahan made a big mistake. And yes I'm quite aware that that person or persons probably has some pretty good business school credentials.
 

diceman934

Help is on the way.
Jul 31, 2010
17,338
4,149
NHL player factory
Of course it doesn't BUT:

a) Going to business school gives people the knowledge required to run a business just as doctors learn to perform surgery in medical school.

b) I don't know why you are implying that Shanahan is intelligent, I haven't seen anything to indicate his intelligence either way but even if he is intelligent it doesn't mean that he knows anything about running an NHL team. Einstein was a pretty intelligent guy but I don't think you'd want him running the Leafs either.

This team has the resources to hire the BEST. Shanahan has ZERO experience running anything. I would have thought that the Leafs could do better. Someone on the board or whoever was responsible for hiring Shanahan made a big mistake. And yes I'm quite aware that that person or persons probably has some pretty good business school credentials.

The fact that he has the Leafs job proves he is smart enough to get the job... His on the job training as a player and his years of services as a player rep makes his ability to run a team far greater then most everyone else....he has the practical knowledge to apply to the job and not simply Theory.

Shanny is the one thing that happen in the last 7 years that has been positive, lets give him some time to make the decisions that need to be made. The fact that he did not come in and make sweeping changes is a positive, you assess your assets and then make the needed changes.
 

Gary Nylund

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
30,179
22,746
The fact that he has the Leafs job proves he is smart enough to get the job... His on the job training as a player and his years of services as a player rep makes his ability to run a team far greater then most everyone else....he has the practical knowledge to apply to the job and not simply Theory.

Shanny is the one thing that happen in the last 7 years that has been positive, lets give him some time to make the decisions that need to be made. The fact that he did not come in and make sweeping changes is a positive, you assess your assets and then make the needed changes.

Do you think Shanahan gave his approval to offering Bolland a long term contract at almost 5 million a year? Or does he stay away from player personnel decisions?

Also - he's smart enough to get the job doesn't mean he will do a good job. That's obvious right?
 

Hero

Uncle Leo
Jul 2, 2009
20,826
0
heropuck.wordpress.com
Potentially....

- Give the new guys a year to learn the ropes while Carlyle/Nonis slowly burn
- Trade deadline, force Nonis's hand in dealing away the vet's who float around
- Watch as season burns to the ground, draft McDavid/Eichel/etc... hopefully top 5 pick
- Hire Babcock, replace GM with someone from within.

- Build slowly through a mix of the draft and smart and simple deals.
- Prosper.
 

666

Registered User
Jun 27, 2005
3,023
789
The fact that he has the Leafs job proves he is smart enough to get the job... His on the job training as a player and his years of services as a player rep makes his ability to run a team far greater then most everyone else....he has the practical knowledge to apply to the job and not simply Theory.

Shanny is the one thing that happen in the last 7 years that has been positive, lets give him some time to make the decisions that need to be made. The fact that he did not come in and make sweeping changes is a positive, you assess your assets and then make the needed changes.

Really? He might be smart enough to get the job but I can assure you that he isn't qualified to DO the job. But you missed my hidden point.

If a bunch of educated experienced business people on the board can hire an educated and experienced guy like Burke and he fails (assuming you think Burke wasn't very good like most people around here) then why would these educated experienced business people hire an uneducated zero experience guy like Shanahan who is guaranteed to fail?

The answer is left as an exercise for the reader. Class dismissed.
 

realgoodleafs

Registered User
Oct 29, 2006
10,648
685
SW Ontario
The plan is to ride Carlyle and Nonis into the ground this year, get a high pick again and then fire both at the end of the year. Then hire DeBoer or Babcock.
 

CalgaryLeaf*

Guest
The worst thing right now is Nonis destroyed the Marlies. There goes the culture of winning and development. Way to go Nonis. I think a winning farm team is priority 1. That should maybe be addressed eh.

Looks like Dallas Eakins should be available to coach the Marlies after he get's fired.
 

thewave

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
40,618
10,613
Looks like Dallas Eakins should be available to coach the Marlies after he get's fired.

Well whatever but tbh. That poor guy has gotten no support from the GM. What a poorly constructed team. Delusional really. They are out to lunch honestly.
 

stealth1

Registered User
Aug 28, 2009
2,926
1,435
Niagara, Ontario
The fact that he has the Leafs job proves he is smart enough to get the job... His on the job training as a player and his years of services as a player rep makes his ability to run a team far greater then most everyone else....he has the practical knowledge to apply to the job and not simply Theory.

Shanny is the one thing that happen in the last 7 years that has been positive, lets give him some time to make the decisions that need to be made. The fact that he did not come in and make sweeping changes is a positive, you assess your assets and then make the needed changes.

How is that a positive? He preached culture change and all they did was add some bottom 6 guys and hoped it would work. Even an outside would know what the Leafs have. They have a couple of top 6 players that take nights off. A high scoring winger in Kessel that won't go into the corners. If he really wanted culture change he would have either fired the GM and Coach when he started or trade one of the core players to make a point. He did neither and hoped the new signings would turn this around.
 

CalgaryLeaf*

Guest
The plan is to ride Carlyle and Nonis into the ground this year, get a high pick again and then fire both at the end of the year. Then hire DeBoer or Babcock.

+1

although not sure about DeBoer.

He kept Nonis around to be his grunt man basically,to make phone calls and to set up interviews etc....I don't think Nonis yields any real power at the moment.
 

silentbob37*

Guest
:laugh: Should we go back to last week on these boards where everything was sunshine and roses, we were discussing playoffs, etc? A tough loss to pitts which was very close, and then two bad games, and now this is the worst team in the history of everything and we need to trade and fire everyone.

Watch us win 5 straight and everyone start planning the parade again. I prefer to wait and see. IF we lose a bunch of games and are in last place then I agree. If we are fighting for a playoff spot, that's what was expected of us.

They've been a mediocre team for 6-7 years. They've played 7 playoff games in the last decade.

You're saying if they are just ok this year it's all good?
 

silentbob37*

Guest
The plan is to ride Carlyle and Nonis into the ground this year, get a high pick again and then fire both at the end of the year. Then hire DeBoer or Babcock.

No it's not. They aren't bad enigh for the kind if pick they need. Th also made additions In the off season to address weaknesses.

A high pick is in no way the goal or plan for this team right now
 

silentbob37*

Guest
The coach was extended putting the focus on the players for the results of their own play, with management believing this is on them.

The bottom 6 depth forwards and D were then swapped out, which then isolates the team core players as what remained the same.

Now Shanny is watching closely as to how his core group performs this year in relation to the team and then methodically after a full review decide which direction to go next year.

That is the master plan.

I've heard his before, I don't buy it.

Why does Shanahan need a year to see wha he has? When he was with the league he watched a tone of hockey. MLSE has tape of all their games. Everyone in the hockey world knew/knows what the leafs have and what they don't.

They wouldn't hire someone who didn't have a good idea of what the team had and what they needed.
 

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