Maple Leaf Hotstove - Game 7 Analysis: Where on Earth does this team go from here?

[Fogelhund]

Game 7 Analysis: Where on Earth do the Toronto Maple Leafs go from here?

This is an excellent article, well worth your time. It's balanced, gives praise where needed, and cuts hard at times too.

To me, this paragraph is really telling. A change is needed, and this is a player that is me first, and needs to go.

This all stems from Marner’s unwillingness to play the goal-line at 5v4, which you can fact-check by asking the right people. Toronto’s best version of their power play all season was Nylander and Marner rotating along the left wall, with one of them playing the goal-line as a passer. It gave the top unit more flexibility, opened up passing lanes, created more motion and unpredictability.
But their $11 million winger wasn’t willing to do it.

@stephen_burch on twitter... This is the epitome of locker room cancer behaviour. Players shouldn't be dictating this sort of stuff, particularly if they are part of a completely ineffectual unit for months. If you can't improve and are unwilling to take steps to help the team YOU are the problem. If Marner is dictating where he plays to the detriment of the team, TRADE him away.

Click to read more...

 

[TheGreatOne11]

You can't have a player dictating such a thing, its a team sport, if thats what is best for the team you stfu and do it.

I feel the experiment of 40 million on 4 forwards is over and has failed. I was willing to believe in it and see where it would get us but clearly it is not working.

We need better D and to afford better more expensive depth players than old veterans who are passed their best before dates (Spezza not included ofcourse, that one worked out, he can stay as long as he'd like) Thornton was terrible, Simmonds not existent.

We need to change the cap composition of this team, we need a #1 or #2 D and more depth scoring from real 3rd line 4th line players. Crosby played with bums most his career, Matthews should be able to handle 2 decent players and still score.

 

[ToneDog]

No worries boys. We were in a similar position a year ago and Shanny and Dubas figured it out and addressed it

 

[TMLegend]

Can't help but feel this whole debacle is gonna scramble the teams identity a bit. I don't really have an answer on where they should go from here because I just don't know, and while I don't think trading Mitch Marner is the answer in isolation, I definitely wouldn't be opposed to seeing him go.

 

[Fogelhund]

No worries boys. We were in a similar position a year ago and Shanny and Dubas figured it out and addressed it

You know what... I think they did. We played decent defensively. Upgraded in Goal. Had veterans. Had our two star elite offensive players, contributed just one goal, in either game five, or six, they'd be moving on. They didn't execute. These were and still are, young players, that need some time, and patience to figure out how to win. Some players elevate their games, some don't. Patience time is over, and it's clear Marner isn't that guy.

I'm also seeing rumours, that the Leafs put in a claim for Vatanen, but he was claimed, before we got a chance.

We had elite offensive guys, who had a great regular season, and you've got to trust that they'll perform for you. They didn't. Matthews had some bad luck, shot 3.1% in the series, compared to 18% in regular season. He hit something like six, maybe more posts/cross bars. He played hard. I'm disappointed in him, that he didn't deliver when needed. Marner.... I just believe he is me first, and doesn't have what it takes for the playoffs. If they address that, I think you give Shanny and Dubas more time. They did nearly everything conceivable that they could have. Their best players didn't deliver.

 

[ToneDog]

You know what... I think they did. We played decent defensively. Upgraded in Goal. Had veterans. Had our two star elite offensive players, contributed just one goal, in either game five, or six, they'd be moving on. They didn't execute. These were and still are, young players, that need some time, and patience to figure out how to win. Some players elevate their games, some don't. Patience time is over, and it's clear Marner isn't that guy.

I'm also seeing rumours, that the Leafs put in a claim for Vatanen, but he was claimed, before we got a chance.

We had elite offensive guys, who had a great regular season, and you've got to trust that they'll perform for you. They didn't. Matthews had some bad luck, shot 3.1% in the series, compared to 18% in regular season. He hit something like six, maybe more posts/cross bars. He played hard. I'm disappointed in him, that he didn't deliver when needed. Marner.... I just believe he is me first, and doesn't have what it takes for the playoffs. If they address that, I think you give Shanny and Dubas more time. They did nearly everything conceivable that they could have. Their best players didn't deliver.

Agreed but I do not think we have enough depth scoring as many want to believe. With JT out, Habs proved you shutdown Matty you shutdown the Leafs. Nylander and Spezza were the only other goal scoring threats up front. 65,15,24,97,71,12,20 were garbage most of the series.

It would have been more evident if they got past the worst team to make the playoffs.

 

[Fogelhund]

Agreed but I do not think we have enough depth scoring as many want to believe. With JT out, Habs proved you shutdown Matty you shutdown the Leafs. Nylander and Spezza were the only other goal scoring threats up front. 65,15,24,97,71,12,20 were garbage most of the series.

I can't argue with the idea that more depth would be better. Maybe we take that Marner cap hit, and sprinkle it around some, for better depth. Then again, if our elite guys are performing, we are easily into the second round.

65 - I wonder what's going on with him. He had decent hands last year, and plays the game very well... Did that laceration to his wrist ruin him, or is that an offseason fixable thing?

15 - SIX points, in seven games. +3... he wasn't garbage. Actually one of our best players.

12 - 4 points in six games... again, one of our better depth guys.

The rest... really didn't do much.

 

[ToneDog]

I can't argue with the idea that more depth would be better. Maybe we take that Marner cap hit, and sprinkle it around some, for better depth. Then again, if our elite guys are performing, we are easily into the second round.

65 - I wonder what's going on with him. He had decent hands last year, and plays the game very well... Did that laceration to his wrist ruin him, or is that an offseason fixable thing?

15 - SIX points, in seven games. +3... he wasn't garbage. Actually one of our best players.

12 - 4 points in six games... again, one of our better depth guys.

The rest... really didn't do much.

12 played great in game 4 with 3 points and gave away game 5.

15 got an ENG and a few apples from playing with 88. Good skater but not a player you go to war with but I agree he pulled his weight. He'll be gone to Seattle or elsewhere due to his cap hit.

 

[Fogelhund]

12 played great in game 4 with 3 points and gave away game 5.

15 got an ENG and a few apples from playing with 88. Good skater but not a player you go to war with but I agree he pulled his weight. He'll be gone to Seattle or elsewhere due to his cap hit.

12 has his warts (especially defensively).... For likely a near league minimum to $1 mil, he isn't a bad player. Had our elite players actually pulled their weight and scored... 12's mistake wouldn't have matter.

I'd like an upgrade on 15, but I think overall, he stepped up his game in the playoffs, from what he played in the regular season. He's a complimentary player, but still six points in seven games, isn't something we should complain about. As a winger, he's ok... we need a better 3C..

At least it's nice having a discussion, with some rational people.

 

[AvroArrow]

Call me crazy but we need a coach like Tortorella. With the Toronto media it will be epic.

 

[glue]

I honestly don't know where we go from here. But I'll say this, I just can't fathom going back to being so hardcore about the Leafs after this year. This one hits too hard given how favored we were to win this series and the fact that we were up 3-1. Of all the meltdowns..this is by far the one I least expected. Just not worth my time or energy. I still love hockey and will follow it for that reason, but not sure I can put my energy into any 1 team anymore. This fanbase is crazy though, how there is still such a contingent of hardcore followers amazes me. Its like an abusive relationship, at some point you gotta cut if off.

 

[Fogelhund]

I honestly don't know where we go from here. But I'll say this, I just can't fathom going back to being so hardcore about the Leafs after this year. This one hits too hard given how favored we were to win this series and the fact that we were up 3-1. Of all the meltdowns..this is by far the one I least expected. Just not worth my time or energy. I still love hockey and will follow it for that reason, but not sure I can put my energy into any 1 team anymore. This fanbase is crazy though, how there is still such a contingent of hardcore followers amazes me. Its like an abusive relationship, at some point you gotta cut if off.

I think a lot of us feel that way. Just been let down too many times.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Marner is a jackass for "refusing" but Dubas and Keefe are jackasses for allowing this nonsense
Total entitlement and just doesn't have the mental fortitude to play in this market.

 

[The Iceman]

Call me doubtful but I do not buy Marner REFUSED to change his role on the PP.
Doesn't seem his personality at all. I call BS.

And for the talk of Holl or Dermott I think Kerfoot is the new Kraken.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Game 7 Analysis: Where on Earth do the Toronto Maple Leafs go from here?

This is an excellent article, well worth your time. It's balanced, gives praise where needed, and cuts hard at times too.

To me, this paragraph is really telling. A change is needed, and this is a player that is me first, and needs to go.

This all stems from Marner’s unwillingness to play the goal-line at 5v4, which you can fact-check by asking the right people. Toronto’s best version of their power play all season was Nylander and Marner rotating along the left wall, with one of them playing the goal-line as a passer. It gave the top unit more flexibility, opened up passing lanes, created more motion and unpredictability.
But their $11 million winger wasn’t willing to do it.

@stephen_burch on twitter... This is the epitome of locker room cancer behaviour. Players shouldn't be dictating this sort of stuff, particularly if they are part of a completely ineffectual unit for months. If you can't improve and are unwilling to take steps to help the team YOU are the problem. If Marner is dictating where he plays to the detriment of the team, TRADE him away.

Thanks for sharing article .. good read overall .. but coaching and my kid playing with Mitch for a few years my gut instinct tells me it is not true .. I am not saying Paul did not make suggestions as he certainly may have done that .. but Mitch no way he would .. he is a happy go lucky smiling kid who just wants to play .. he is hard to coach because you have to re coach what Paul has told him which makes things impossible for a guy like Babs .. this is da unknown part of it which only they closest to him as former coaches could ever understand .. now Paul could never coach a house league team as he has not played and can't skate .. but he thinks he knows hockey due self coaching over years of video taping games and practices .. he and Dubie would be a great pair to be honest

 

[nuck]

Can't help but feel this whole debacle is gonna scramble the teams identity a bit. I don't really have an answer on where they should go from here because I just don't know, and while I don't think trading Mitch Marner is the answer in isolation, I definitely wouldn't be opposed to seeing him go.

Starts with a new coach because the failure is inextricably tied to Keefe and much easier to move him that a huge chunk of the lineup. Mitch out and Saad and Hall in?

 

[DanielMarois]

The team should introduce a WWE-style Auston 3:1 Blown Lead t-shirt and make millions in merch sales.

 

[tokyoite]

someone who can erase the team's losing culture.