Management Thread | 5th Youngest Team in the League Edition

[m9]

Feel free to disagree. That year end conference is NOT one that a club president absolutely attends.

Sens for example it was only Doiron. The coach wasn't even present let alone upper management.

Montreal had both GM and VP hockey operations.

Caps just the GM (he does wear a VP hat as well but there is a president above him)

Jackets was just Jarmo.

Basically what I'm saying there is absolutely no hard and fast rule to the year end conference including those above the GM despite the protests of the vancouver media.

I'm not saying it's an absolute but you have to provide the proper context here. JR has attended basically all of these kind of things (if not run them) since he was hired. Then at the last one he acted like a pouty child because he was told not to talk. Then he's not even at this one. This is an obvious downward trend, especially with the context of the rumors of him being unhappy during the season & also the somewhat strange way he left his last organization.

I'm not even saying it 100% means anything - it could go either way - I just don't think it should be easiliy dismissed that he's not there. Nobody should be surprised if there is more to this story that we hear about in short order.

 

[Gurn]

Hopefully JR retires.

 

[Ernie]

If Pettersson is negotiating then he wants to sign a contract this summer. Hopefully his ask is below $12m.

Not sure I'd want to stay if I were him, the Canucks have basically been a toxic workplace for the past 3 seasons ever since Benning dismantled the bubble team. Perhaps he doesn't want to leave Hughes high and dry.

 

[gringo]

I'm fine with complaining but people are just inventing stuff to be pissy about and it's super lame.

Currently we have people inventing conspiracies about Larscheid and Rutherford feuding with the media. Every more is treated like a screwup immediately. People are whining about them not taking for Bedard when they were never even close to being a position to really do so.

Yes they were in a position to tank for Bedard and all fan bases that go through 50+ years of futility are bitter angry and complaining conspiracy theorists. Can you name another sports franchise that went through 50 years of awful play and still has the support the canucks do?

 

[bringbacktheskate604]

Sounds like you're the one whining.

And most of what you said is a bunch of BS.

Fans wanting a rebuild is not about wanting the "Arizona model".

Its about realizing that the team has zero depth and not enough assets to do anything meaningful.

Bedard or Fantilli would've been a lot more meaningful than a retool.

We don't know how the Hronek trade will even turn out so stop calling it a win without any evidence other than an injured player.

A rebuild means trading the entire young core , that makes absolutely zero sense.
Teams draft for years, often top 3 or lower mixed in and still fail to draft the core piece that every cup team needs.

Why the hell would you rebuild when we already have the key pieces in place and they are elite pieces not even in their prime ye.
Please explain to me how a rebuild makes any sense. No path is linear but the formula is pretty simple.
Try and draft a 1C, 1D, 1G and some wingers which the team has already done, surround them with some high-end players in their prime, add depth and attempt to improve in areas needed and that's exactly where this team is now.
Hronek is a stud I suggest watching him as much as I've done, Kuzmenko, Beauvillier, Brock, Podkolzin Mikhayev, JT, Hoglander, Nil, EP40
Is full of depth plus guys like Linus, Raty, Kravstov, Klimovich, all have potential.
If we can clear 10 million in cap by moving Myers and Garland and sign Barbishev and Gavrikov for example is a team not only full of high-end players everywhere, it's full of depth

I very rarely post on hf nuck boards because it's full of guys like you who despite overwhelming evidence that perpetual rebuilds don't work and the simple truth is teams need guys in their mid to late 20s early 30s far more than a bunch of 21 year-olds.

I'm not even saying we need to stand pat, hence why I added Barbishev and Gavrikov that's how you take the next step, not by giving up on a young team that has clearly improved under competent coaching and systems and the fact we got actual NHL goaltending and not the shit we got for 54 games.
With only OEL left after next season that' one could argue hasn't lived up to the contract and the fact the cap will be over 90 million soon and might jump up by 5 million this summer, it makes much more sense adding experienced players not blowing it up to spend the next 5 years trying to draft the next EP, Hughes, Demko etc.

Alvin has already shown he's capable and I fully expect him to add to what is already a promising group despite what people like you who treat life like a video game rant about.

 

[Ernie]

Is this argument going to go on for the entire offseason?

Where people are butthurt and can't let it go?

 

[Diogenes92]

A rebuild means trading the entire young core , that makes absolutely zero sense.
Teams draft for years, often top 3 or lower mixed in and still fail to draft the core piece that every cup team needs.

Why the hell would you rebuild when we already have the key pieces in place and they are elite pieces not even in their prime ye.
Please explain to me how a rebuild makes any sense. No path is linear but the formula is pretty simple.
Try and draft a 1C, 1D, 1G and some wingers which the team has already done, surround them with some high-end players in their prime, add depth and attempt to improve in areas needed and that's exactly where this team is now.
Hronek is a stud I suggest watching him as much as I've done, Kuzmenko, Beauvillier, Brock, Podkolzin Mikhayev, JT, Hoglander, Nil, EP40
Is full of depth plus guys like Linus, Raty, Kravstov, Klimovich, all have potential.
If we can clear 10 million in cap by moving Myers and Garland and sign Barbishev and Gavrikov for example is a team not only full of high-end players everywhere, it's full of depth

I very rarely post on hf nuck boards because it's full of guys like you who despite overwhelming evidence that perpetual rebuilds don't work and the simple truth is teams need guys in their mid to late 20s early 30s far more than a bunch of 21 year-olds.

I'm not even saying we need to stand pat, hence why I added Barbishev and Gavrikov that's how you take the next step, not by giving up on a young team that has clearly improved under competent coaching and systems and the fact we got actual NHL goaltending and not the shit we got for 54 games.
With only OEL left after next season that' one could argue hasn't lived up to the contract and the fact the cap will be over 90 million soon and might jump up by 5 million this summer, it makes much more sense adding experienced players not blowing it up to spend the next 5 years trying to draft the next EP, Hughes, Demko etc.

Alvin has already shown he's capable and I fully expect him to add to what is already a promising group despite what people like you who treat life like a video game rant about.

No, it doesn't.

 

[racerjoe]

I'm not saying it's an absolute but you have to provide the proper context here. JR has attended basically all of these kind of things (if not run them) since he was hired. Then at the last one he acted like a pouty child because he was told not to talk. Then he's not even at this one. This is an obvious downward trend, especially with the context of the rumors of him being unhappy during the season & also the somewhat strange way he left his last organization.

I'm not even saying it 100% means anything - it could go either way - I just don't think it should be easiliy dismissed that he's not there. Nobody should be surprised if there is more to this story that we hear about in short order.

Basically everyone? First its been just over a year, so this being the second one doesn't mean much... now its at 50%.

Second Alvin has already done many of these by himself, so you are wrong there too.

I really don't think it is a big deal. I mean how much different would any of the answers have been?

 

[gringo]

A rebuild means trading the entire young core , that makes absolutely zero sense.
Teams draft for years, often top 3 or lower mixed in and still fail to draft the core piece that every cup team needs.

Why the hell would you rebuild when we already have the key pieces in place and they are elite pieces not even in their prime ye.
Please explain to me how a rebuild makes any sense. No path is linear but the formula is pretty simple.
Try and draft a 1C, 1D, 1G and some wingers which the team has already done, surround them with some high-end players in their prime, add depth and attempt to improve in areas needed and that's exactly where this team is now.
Hronek is a stud I suggest watching him as much as I've done, Kuzmenko, Beauvillier, Brock, Podkolzin Mikhayev, JT, Hoglander, Nil, EP40
Is full of depth plus guys like Linus, Raty, Kravstov, Klimovich, all have potential.
If we can clear 10 million in cap by moving Myers and Garland and sign Barbishev and Gavrikov for example is a team not only full of high-end players everywhere, it's full of depth

I very rarely post on hf nuck boards because it's full of guys like you who despite overwhelming evidence that perpetual rebuilds don't work and the simple truth is teams need guys in their mid to late 20s early 30s far more than a bunch of 21 year-olds.

I'm not even saying we need to stand pat, hence why I added Barbishev and Gavrikov that's how you take the next step, not by giving up on a young team that has clearly improved under competent coaching and systems and the fact we got actual NHL goaltending and not the shit we got for 54 games.
With only OEL left after next season that' one could argue hasn't lived up to the contract and the fact the cap will be over 90 million soon and might jump up by 5 million this summer, it makes much more sense adding experienced players not blowing it up to spend the next 5 years trying to draft the next EP, Hughes, Demko etc.

Alvin has already shown he's capable and I fully expect him to add to what is already a promising group despite what people like you who treat life like a video game rant about.

Explain to me how trying to salvage March after another piss poor season where we are out of the playoffs since November and now picking 11th overall.

How does that make any sense ?

 

[m9]

Basically everyone? First its been just over a year, so this being the second one doesn't mean much... now its at 50%.

Second Alvin has already done many of these by himself, so you are wrong there too.

I really don't think it is a big deal. I mean how much different would any of the answers have been?

I would say that for the most part, JR has been at the important press conferences since he's been hired. I'm not going to go through every one, but I feel comfortable in saying that for the most part he's been there for the ones that go above player transactions. He certainly was at this one last year, front and center.

Not sure specifically what your second point is referring to. Yes, Allvin has done some himself as would be expected - especially tied to player transactions. This is not that kind of press conference, if that's what you mean.

It's also not about the actual answers, it's just that it's strange over the course of 12 months he's been slowly (or maybe quickly) phased out of these things.

I don't know. I find it strange that it is basically "Our President has gone from saying everything, to being muzzled and clearly unhappy, to now not even showing up to things he was doing a year ago. But everything is totally fine!".

Again, maybe it's nothing. But it's strange how quickly people are wanting to dismiss him not being there as totally normal, business as usual.

 

[Bleach Clean]

A rebuild means trading the entire young core , that makes absolutely zero sense.
Teams draft for years, often top 3 or lower mixed in and still fail to draft the core piece that every cup team needs.

Why the hell would you rebuild when we already have the key pieces in place and they are elite pieces not even in their prime ye.
Please explain to me how a rebuild makes any sense. No path is linear but the formula is pretty simple.
Try and draft a 1C, 1D, 1G and some wingers which the team has already done, surround them with some high-end players in their prime, add depth and attempt to improve in areas needed and that's exactly where this team is now.
Hronek is a stud I suggest watching him as much as I've done, Kuzmenko, Beauvillier, Brock, Podkolzin Mikhayev, JT, Hoglander, Nil, EP40
Is full of depth plus guys like Linus, Raty, Kravstov, Klimovich, all have potential.
If we can clear 10 million in cap by moving Myers and Garland and sign Barbishev and Gavrikov for example is a team not only full of high-end players everywhere, it's full of depth

I very rarely post on hf nuck boards because it's full of guys like you who despite overwhelming evidence that perpetual rebuilds don't work and the simple truth is teams need guys in their mid to late 20s early 30s far more than a bunch of 21 year-olds.

I'm not even saying we need to stand pat, hence why I added Barbishev and Gavrikov that's how you take the next step, not by giving up on a young team that has clearly improved under competent coaching and systems and the fact we got actual NHL goaltending and not the shit we got for 54 games.
With only OEL left after next season that' one could argue hasn't lived up to the contract and the fact the cap will be over 90 million soon and might jump up by 5 million this summer, it makes much more sense adding experienced players not blowing it up to spend the next 5 years trying to draft the next EP, Hughes, Demko etc.

Alvin has already shown he's capable and I fully expect him to add to what is already a promising group despite what people like you who treat life like a video game rant about.

A traditional re-tool reinvigorates a competitive team. A competitive team. Applying that same methodology here makes zero sense. This team is NOT competitive.

If you use the strict definition of what a re-tool actually was applied to in the past, like the DET team of old, it's not applicable here. This team isn't even in the same stratosphere. In the same way, a strict rebuild is not applicable here because it would require selling on most current players, including Pettersson-Hughes-Demko.

And so, fit rebuild to the team as you would re-tool, and there is likely little argument. Both methods keep Pettersson-Hughes-Demko. It's what you do around them that differs.

 

[Diogenes92]

Is this argument going to go on for the entire offseason?

Where people are butthurt and can't let it go?

What's wrong with a group of fans being unhappy about the direction of the team?

Are we expected to just conform because the team has chosen a particular path, and we just have to be happy and accept it?

I'm not saying that's what you think, but it's a really weak line of thinking and its full of holes.

 

[Ernie]

What's wrong with a group of fans being unhappy about the direction of the team?

Are we expected to just conform because the team has chosen a particular path, and we just have to be happy and accept it?

I'm not saying that's what you think, but it's a really weak line of thinking and its full of holes.

The last thing I'm going to do is jump into this argument.

Y'all are just repeating yourselves and throwing around insults.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

No, it doesn't.

Generally , a rebuild means that you're replacing your core group...Its possible that you could rebuild around Hughes and EP (they're youngish)...but a rebuild implies being more focussed on picks and prospects...more from the 'ground up'...(ARZ,CHI,DET,ANA,SJS).

Thats not where this team is at...Its a retool (as it should be)


Hughes and EP have basically flat out said, they have no interest in a rebuild..so, thats pretty much the end of story.

 

[racerjoe]

I would say that for the most part, JR has been at the important press conferences since he's been hired. I'm not going to go through every one, but I feel comfortable in saying that for the most part he's been there for the ones that go above player transactions. He certainly was at this one last year, front and center.

Not sure specifically what your second point is referring to. Yes, Allvin has done some himself as would be expected - especially tied to player transactions. This is not that kind of press conference, if that's what you mean.

It's also not about the actual answers, it's just that it's strange over the course of 12 months he's been slowly (or maybe quickly) phased out of these things.

I don't know. I find it strange that it is basically "Our President has gone from saying everything, to being muzzled and clearly unhappy, to now not even showing up to things he was doing a year ago. But everything is totally fine!".

Again, maybe it's nothing. But it's strange how quickly people are wanting to dismiss him not being there as totally normal, business as usual.

What constitutes important ones?

I mean he said it himself that he wouldn't be at these anymore.

As was pointed out other teams don't always have the presidents at these things... so why?

Its a big deal because we are making it one, not because it is or should be.

 

[Diogenes92]

Generally , a rebuild means that you're replacing your core group...Its possible that you could rebuild around Hughes and EP (they're youngish)...but a rebuild implies being more focussed on picks and prospects...more from the 'ground up'...(ARZ,CHI,DET,ANA,SJS).

Thats not where this team is at...Its a retool (as it should be)


Hughes and EP have basically flat out said, they have no interest in a rebuild..so, thats pretty much the end of story.

No, its not.



But, anyways. I am more on the rebuild around Petey and Hughes with the hope that they would have the foresight to be patient for a few years.

The retool will take at least that long for them to compete anyways.

The last thing I'm going to do is jump into this argument.

Y'all are just repeating yourselves and throwing around insults.

I'd say that's the retoolies more than the rebuild crowd.

The retoolies have been toxic since the Hronek trade.

That was the tipping point.

The rebuilders are just disappointed and fed up with the mediocrity and it has been very hard to deal with. We are exasperated.

 

[gringo]

Dan Murphy just said Castonguay was interviewed for the PRESIDENT job in Philly. L-O-L

 

[wonton15]

Dan Murphy just said Castonguay was interviewed for the PRESIDENT job in Philly. L-O-L

There are no strangers to love
You know the rules, and so do I

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Dan Murphy just said Castonguay was interviewed for the PRESIDENT job in Philly. L-O-L

You could literally hire a chimpanzee and they would be an upgrade on Chuck Fletcher.

 

[valkynax]

You could literally hire a chimpanzee and they would be an upgrade on Chuck Fletcher.

Not if said chimpanzee is a fat tub of guts who doesn't know how to talk properly without a thousand "like".

 

[Bleach Clean]

Is this argument going to go on for the entire offseason?

Where people are butthurt and can't let it go?

Amazing that someone could read the nuance in posts for and against the Hronek trade, and by way of that the direction of the franchise, and come to this oversimplified conclusion. Or, was it just meant to bait people? (It worked)

 

[gringo]

Is this argument going to go on for the entire offseason?

Where people are butthurt and can't let it go?

Just wait until we see just how good the top 5 in this draft actually are

 

[m9]

What constitutes important ones?

I mean he said it himself that he wouldn't be at these anymore.

As was pointed out other teams don't always have the presidents at these things... so why?

Its a big deal because we are making it one, not because it is or should be.

My thought is that there's a 75% chance that it's nothing. They are giving Allvin more of a voice and this is a continuation of that.

I think there's like a 25% chance that it's a sign of something bigger going on with JR. There are enough signs that you see when a a guy is getting withdrawn or phased out from his job to at least question the situation.

Not trying to make it anything bigger than that.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

My thought is that there's a 75% chance that it's nothing. They are giving Allvin more of a voice and this is a continuation of that.

I think there's like a 25% chance that it's a sign of something bigger going on with JR. There are enough signs that you see when a a guy is getting withdrawn or phased out from his job to at least question the situation.

Not trying to make it anything bigger than that.

He's not being phased out in anyway..I'm also sure that he's front and centre on the team direction and transactions.

After the Boudreau firing/no defensive structure drama..JR said that he's going to 'zip it' from that point on...No more speaking to media.

and he's kept his word....(which is a shame really, because he is very insightful).

Canucks president Rutherford holding firm on "zip it" pledge | Offside

Canucks president of hockey operations Jim Rutherford is holding firm to his “zip it” pledge and skipped yesterday’s press conference.

dailyhive.com

 

[EverTheCynic]

He's not being phased out in anyway..I'm also sure that he's front and centre on the team direction and transactions.

After the Boudreau firing/no defensive structure drama..JR said that he's going to 'zip it' from that point on...No more speaking to media.

and he's kept his word....(which is a shame really, because he is very insightful).

Canucks president Rutherford holding firm on "zip it" pledge | Offside

Canucks president of hockey operations Jim Rutherford is holding firm to his “zip it” pledge and skipped yesterday’s press conference.

dailyhive.com

More an indictment on our pathetic local beat writer media than on JR imo

I honestly can't stand these guys. Who pays them to say words? Most of them couldn't competently manage a Subway