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Prospect Info: Lias Andersson - Part IV

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huerter said:
Well it would be a long post that I don't have the energy for but one of the keys is marginal value, rather than value.
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The sum and substance of your last few posts is, "y'all are dumb but I don't have the time or energy to explain why." I get that you're new to this forum so here is a little bit of advice: try not to be that person. It took us years to reform @Machinehead and we are still working on @Thirty One.
 
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Crease said:
The sum and substance of your last few posts is, "y'all are dumb but I don't have the time or energy to explain why." I get that you're new to this forum so here is a little bit of advice: try not to be that person. It took us years to reform @Machinehead and we are still working on @Thirty One.
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Work harder. I'm actively getting worse.
 
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QJL said:
As fans, all we can do is analyze what was earned on game day. Sure, there other factors here, but Howden only had points in 3 of the first 18 games playing 15+minutes a night with terrible advanced metrics at both ends of the ice. When performance is that detrimental to a team, you give other players a look. Based on what we could analyze, excluding the practice and locker room situation, there was never a justification to the favoritism for Howden over Lias. I think that favoritism is the root of the departure. From a hockey standpoint, it wasn’t making sense. All I can do is analyze what I saw.
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They weren't far apart in play, it was a toss up that I'm assuming went to the player willing to be part of the team and accept whatever role he was given.
 
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KreiderBomb said:
They weren't far apart in play, it was a toss up that I'm assuming went to the player willing to be part of the team and accept whatever role he was given.
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You’re missing my point. Howden was given the chance to play with better players and was demoted. He could make sense of the decision because he sucked with real opportunity. Lias was never afforded that. I think if Lias had been given that opportunity, he would’ve likely failed, but he probably wouldn’t have seen it as “being set up to fail” which led to a demotion.
 
JohnC said:
Thirty One went from being -31- and winning funniest poster awards to being Thirty One. I fail to see the improvement.
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I think there's a reason for that. I think one of Pavel Buchnevich or wenevergetagoodcoach killed off -31- and started posting as him under Thirty One to get more likes. So it would definitely explain the quality of the posting since then.....:sarcasm:
 
Between Goat, Howdie, Libor and Brendan, one of the younger players is going to get exposed. It would be between Howden and Lemeuix imo. They can protect Howden if he takes another step. I also expect two defensemen, two forwards, and a goalie to be signed. Depth options, but perhaps those guys meet the games requirement. Especially for defense. Otherwise re-signing one of Staal/Smith becomes an option, and that's a PR nightmare for management waiting to happen. No matter what.

So I'm sure they will get creative. Teams learned from the Vegas draft, is your only going to lose 1 player. You might as well bite the bullet. All of the teams that gave up those assets to Vegas just helped create a contender out of thin air.

That draft currency got them a lot of good players via the trade market. $3M for Clayton Stoner or Shea Theodore.... that's what stingy ownership can do. Same with take Alex Tuch so we don't lose a defenseman. Here's a 1st rounder, and a 40 goal scoring center, take David Clarkson off of our hands. Hey take some money off of our hands, here's two 50+ point NHL wingers in the middle of their prime in JAM and the better Smith.

I mean teams thought they were fleecing the new kids on the block, and they got it back in return. So I think that we will see fewer deals of that sort.
 
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Mikos87 said:
Between Goat, Howdie, Libor and Brendan, one of the younger players is going to get exposed. It would be between Howden and Lemeuix imo. They can protect Howden if he takes another step. I also expect two defensemen, two forwards, and a goalie to be signed. Depth options, but perhaps those guys meet the games requirement. Especially for defense. Otherwise re-signing one of Staal/Smith becomes an option, and that's a PR nightmare for management waiting to happen. No matter what.

So I'm sure they will get creative. Teams learned from the Vegas draft, is your only going to lose 1 player. You might as well bite the bullet. All of the teams that gave up those assets to Vegas just helped create a contender out of thin air.

That draft currency got them a lot of good players via the trade market. $3M for Clayton Stoner or Shea Theodore.... that's what stingy ownership can do. Same with take Alex Tuch so we don't lose a defenseman. Here's a 1st rounder, and a 40 goal scoring center, take David Clarkson off of our hands. Hey take some money off of our hands, here's two 50+ point NHL wingers in the middle of their prime in JAM and the better Smith.

I mean teams thought they were fleecing the new kids on the block, and they got it back in return. So I think that we will see fewer deals of that sort.
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Probably just marginally less trades of this sort but definitely with a rate adjustment on the currency for these exchanges.
 
Thirty One said:
Work harder. I'm actively getting worse.
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giphy.gif
 
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QJL said:
As fans, all we can do is analyze what was earned on game day. Based on what we could analyze, excluding the practice and locker room situation, there was never a justification to the favoritism for Howden over Lias. I think that favoritism is the root of the departure. From a hockey standpoint, it wasn’t making sense. All I can do is analyze what I saw.
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But this is an issue. Fans tend to discount training camp (outside of preseason games) and practice because they can't see them. The problem is that I doubt that Quinn and the rest of the org discounts it, especially when it comes to the younger players that they are grooming.

While it's possible that Quinn et al have played favorites with Howden over Andersson as us fans have probably all seen this happen before for various reasons in professional and personal settings, I think it is also logical to think that camp/practice has played a critical role in this. Quinn has even hinted at this regarding several players during his time here.

I think of it in a crawl/walk/run paradigm. During drills/scrimmages, Quinn is directing these guys on what has to be done to be successful. If a player can't successfully follow his instructions in practice with consistency (crawling), how can the player be expected to do so at all in actual NHL games (walking).

Hence the reason for Howden to get a bigger role and more chances than Andersson to apply what he showed in practice in regular season games. Unfortunately, it hasn't translated yet for Howden and maybe never will. As for Andersson, while we would look at putting him on the third line as a position to succeed, maybe because of his inconsistencies in practice, they would view putting him there as a position to fail. They expect him to crawl before he can walk. Rarely does one do the latter before doing the former.
 
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Mikos87 said:
Between Goat, Howdie, Libor and Brendan, one of the younger players is going to get exposed. It would be between Howden and Lemeuix imo. They can protect Howden if he takes another step. I also expect two defensemen, two forwards, and a goalie to be signed. Depth options, but perhaps those guys meet the games requirement. Especially for defense. Otherwise re-signing one of Staal/Smith becomes an option, and that's a PR nightmare for management waiting to happen. No matter what.

So I'm sure they will get creative. Teams learned from the Vegas draft, is your only going to lose 1 player. You might as well bite the bullet. All of the teams that gave up those assets to Vegas just helped create a contender out of thin air.

That draft currency got them a lot of good players via the trade market. $3M for Clayton Stoner or Shea Theodore.... that's what stingy ownership can do. Same with take Alex Tuch so we don't lose a defenseman. Here's a 1st rounder, and a 40 goal scoring center, take David Clarkson off of our hands. Hey take some money off of our hands, here's two 50+ point NHL wingers in the middle of their prime in JAM and the better Smith.

I mean teams thought they were fleecing the new kids on the block, and they got it back in return. So I think that we will see fewer deals of that sort.
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They helped build such a juggernaut that their year 1 O/U was like 68 points. Making side deals with Vegas wasn't an error in process, it was an error in execution (for certain teams).
 
JCProdigy said:
But this is an issue. Fans tend to discount training camp (outside of preseason games) and practice because they can't see them. The problem is that I doubt that Quinn and the rest of the org discounts it, especially when it comes to the younger players that they are grooming.

While it's possible that Quinn et al have played favorites with Howden over Andersson as us fans have probably all seen this happen before for various reasons in professional and personal settings, I think it is also logical to think that camp/practice has played a critical role in this. Quinn has even hinted at this regarding several players during his time here.

I think of it in a crawl/walk/run paradigm. During drills/scrimmages, Quinn is directing these guys on what has to be done to be successful. If a player can't successfully follow his instructions in practice with consistency (crawling), how can the player be expected to do so at all in actual NHL games (walking).

Hence the reason for Howden to get a bigger role and more chances than Andersson to apply what he showed in practice in regular season games. Unfortunately, it hasn't translated yet for Howden and maybe never will. As for Andersson, while we would look at putting him on the third line as a position to succeed, maybe because of his inconsistencies in practice, they would view putting him there as a position to fail. They expect him to crawl before he can walk. Rarely does one do the latter before doing the former.
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No argument, just that I’m going to analyze what I can see. That’s essentially every opinion formed on this site. We analyze and form opinions based on game play. The disparity of opportunity between Howden vs. Lias didn’t click with me. Whether that’s right or not, we now have an undesirable situation with a solid prospect.
 
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QJL said:
No argument, just that I’m going to analyze what I can see. That’s essentially every opinion formed on this site. We analyze and form opinions based on game play. The disparity of opportunity between Howden vs. Lias didn’t click with me. Whether that’s right or not, we now have an undesirable situation with a solid prospect.
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Give me a break. There is no equal "opportunity" clause in the labor agreement, is there? Why stop at comparing himself and his opportunities to Howden? Why not expecting to be given the same opportunities as Strome to center Panarin? I mean Andersson is as much of a top-10 pick, no?

The "undesirable" situation is fully on Andersson for dogging it first on the 4th line (IMHO) and then again when he was sent to Hartford before voluntarily deciding to leave it to return to Sweden in the middle of the season.
 
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kovazub94 said:
Give me a break. There is no equal "opportunity" clause in the labor agreement, is there? Why stop at comparing himself and his opportunities to Howden? Why not expecting to be given the same opportunities as Strome to center Panarin? I mean Andersson is as much as of a top-10 pick, no?

The "undesirable" situation is fully on Andersson for dogging it first on the 4th line (IMHO) and then again when he was sent to Hartford before voluntarily deciding to leave it to return to Sweden in the middle of the season.
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Absolutely. Howden and Andersson both played poorly. Howden did whatever the coach asked and Lias sulked, complained and was a PIA. Have these people ever managed a young employee? Both had/have some potential but real question marks if they are going to be effective NHLers.
Which one do you think gets the better opportunities given those characteristics? It's not any more complicated than that.
 
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