Prospect Info: Lias Andersson - Part IV

[Quinnisinoverhishead]

How do we watch this game?

 

[Profet]

The Rangers are one of the best at developing talent. In almost all cases they never rush a prospect. Lias was an outlier.

Malhotra says "hi"

 

[Tawnos]

I am curious, how long have you been following the Rangers? I have been following them since 1985 and have never in that time heard anyone say they were one of the best at developing talent. Who are these talents? I am not trying to be a jerk here, I am just really blown away by that assessment of the situation. After the letter, I guess I agree because they have so many picks they can let them grow, but none of those guys are even players yet.

I think we've been pretty good in the last 15-20 years or so. Tyutin, Lundqvist, Prucha, D. Moore, Korpikoski, Dubinsky, Callahan, Staal, Girardi, Sauer, Anisimov, Hagelin, Del Zotto, Stepan, Zuccarello, Kreider, Fast, Miller, Skjei, Hayes, Buchnevich were all Rangers picks or free agent prospects that we developed into quality NHL players or varying degrees in the last 2 decades. McDonagh and Boyle were players we acquired from other organizations whose development we completed. Dale Weise is someone we got on the right track before losing to waivers. You might question Lundqvist, since he came to us as an NHL starting goalie, but Allaire has a lot to do with him becoming the best goalie in the league.

There is certainly a lack of first liners in there, and some might argue 1st pairing D as well. To me, that's not a mark against the Rangers development system. It's mostly a result of not having high draft picks, and not getting the luck of a later pick truly taking off like a Patrice Bergeron, as well as certain justifiable criticism of the drafting with Jessiman, Montoya, and McIlrath.

I don't really think development systems really improve a player's "talent" so much as they help the player learn to maximize the talent they have. I think if you're looking for a player who they never figured out how to get him to maximize the talent that should have been there, you look at someone like Lundmark. There aren't many examples like that for the Rangers, IMO.

 

[Tawnos]

Malhotra says "hi"

Dan Blackburn too. To be fair, that poster did say "in almost all cases."

 

[free0717]

Let Lias play this year in Sweden. Let's see how he feels next summer. Maybe he can be a good 3rd liner

 

[romba]

Holy shit, all the dissertation posts in this thread is wayyyy tldr

Happy there’s a game, unless I missed the posts about it amongst the scholarly articles embedded in this thread lol

 

[SML2]

I think we've been pretty good in the last 15-20 years or so. Tyutin, Lundqvist, Prucha, D. Moore, Korpikoski, Dubinsky, Callahan, Staal, Girardi, Sauer, Anisimov, Hagelin, Del Zotto, Stepan, Zuccarello, Kreider, Fast, Miller, Skjei, Hayes, Buchnevich were all Rangers picks or free agent prospects that we developed into quality NHL players or varying degrees in the last 2 decades. McDonagh and Boyle were players we acquired from other organizations whose development we completed. Dale Weise is someone we got on the right track before losing to waivers. You might question Lundqvist, since he came to us as an NHL starting goalie, but Allaire has a lot to do with him becoming the best goalie in the league.

There is certainly a lack of first liners in there, and some might argue 1st pairing D as well. To me, that's not a mark against the Rangers development system. It's mostly a result of not having high draft picks, and not getting the luck of a later pick truly taking off like a Patrice Bergeron, as well as certain justifiable criticism of the drafting with Jessiman, Montoya, and McIlrath.

I don't really think development systems really improve a player's "talent" so much as they help the player learn to maximize the talent they have. I think if you're looking for a player who they never figured out how to get him to maximize the talent that should have been there, you look at someone like Lundmark. There aren't many examples like that for the Rangers, IMO.

I think the only position we have a right to claim this at is in Goal. They consistently pull guys out of nowhere. I guess Pionk maybe.

 

[JCProdigy]

Making it in today’s NHL is tough enough. DQ has obviously from Day 1 disliked Lias.

Just like we heard on this board at various times in the past that it was obvious that Quinn didn't like ADA, Buch, Chytil etc. from day one and they were treated "unfairly".

DQ is tremendously inexperienced, he has no clue what challenges a kid faces in his draft year with everything that is going on, he has no clue how hard it is to make it in the NHL as an 18 y/o.

David Quinn is a former 13th OA draft pick who had his promising playing career derailed by a disease. Even after the diagnosis he tried to make a comeback and into the NHL by playing in the AHL (with the Rangers no less) and IHL. He's been friends with several former NHL players including Mike Sullivan, John Cullen, and Brian Leetch since high school/college. I think he knows a little bit about what challenges a highly touted kid may face in his draft year and thereafter.

Frankly you're whole post is filled with suppositions (projections?) on how Quinn thinks/feels that seem wildly outlandish and made up in your head.

I do agree though with the assertion that having him play in the NHL at a young age ended up being dumb and he should have been exactly where he is right now all along. You're right, that is a big mistake by the Rangers and I believe Andersson being their first top 10 pick in several years helped to push that mistake.

 

[Harbour Dog]

Holy shit, all the dissertation posts in this thread is wayyyy tldr

Happy there’s a game, unless I missed the posts about it amongst the scholarly articles embedded in this thread lol

This thread is brutal haha

Now that he's playing regular season games again, hopefully his interviews won't be about him leaving New York anymore.

Had 4 SOG and won 16/23 faceoffs today.

 

[Kovalev27]

Did HIs team not have any power plays for him to score on today?

 

[Ola]

Just like we heard on this board at various times in the past that it was obvious that Quinn didn't like ADA, Buch, Chytil etc. from day one and they were treated "unfairly".

David Quinn is a former 13th OA draft pick who had his promising playing career derailed by a disease. Even after the diagnosis he tried to make a comeback and into the NHL by playing in the AHL (with the Rangers no less) and IHL. He's been friends with several former NHL players including Mike Sullivan, John Cullen, and Brian Leetch since high school/college. I think he knows a little bit about what challenges a highly touted kid may face in his draft year and thereafter.

Frankly you're whole post is filled with suppositions (projections?) on how Quinn thinks/feels that seem wildly outlandish and made up in your head.

I do agree though with the assertion that having him play in the NHL at a young age ended up being dumb and he should have been exactly where he is right now all along. You're right, that is a big mistake by the Rangers and I believe Andersson being their first top 10 pick in several years helped to push that mistake.

Wow, this is a lot of complete nonsense lol.

1. I am not super impressed with DQs handling of Buch, never said a word about his handling of Chytil or ADA. The reason ADA haven’t played more from day 1 was the log-jam at RD.

2. What challenges a kid faced in 2010 is very different in 2020.

Lias was a bad pick. But we most certainly made some really bad decisions with his development. How come? DQ is a super expert according to you. Gorton has been around a long time. Drury have all the experience in the world.

If everyone knows everything — how could they make so really bad decisions?

3. DQ doesn’t like Lias, what he brings, and he really value what he doesn’t bring. If you haven’t picked that up I don’t know what to say.

 

[JCProdigy]

Wow, this is a lot of complete nonsense lol.

1. I am not super impressed with DQs handling of Buch, never said a word about his handling of Chytil or ADA. The reason ADA haven’t played more from day 1 was the log-jam at RD.

2. What challenges a kid faced in 2010 is very different in 2020.

Lias was a bad pick. But we most certainly made some really bad decisions with his development. How come? DQ is a super expert according to you. Gorton has been around a long time. Drury have all the experience in the world.

If everyone knows everything — how could they make so really bad decisions?

3. DQ doesn’t like Lias, what he brings, and he really value what he doesn’t bring. If you haven’t picked that up I don’t know what to say.

Funny enough but I feel the same of your post so I guess we're at an impasse there.

To point no 2. Really then tell me oh wise one how YOU know about the differences either a 2010 pick and 2020 pick faces!?!?! Quinn doesn't know but you evidently do with all your pro hockey experiences...Please spell out the differences that had escaped Quinn's mind since you are so in tune with it.

Never said everyone knows everything just that they know more than you or me. The difference between you and me is I accept that I'm coming from a place of some ignorance while you foolishly think you know what Quinn is thinking and start jumping to a whole bunch of ignorant conclusions as a result.

I'm not arguing that they didn't screw up by rushing him. He wasn't ready. They thought he was. They likely saw that in practice/training camp. They likely kept him on the 4th line and hoped he improved in practice and then sent him down to improve there. Why do I believe this? Because these are things they did with the aforementioned players.

Unfortunately, by his own admission, Lias was too hard on himself, got depressed and returned home to get his head straight. I do believe it's as simple as that.

 

[bleedblue94]

So what's the statute of limitations here? 1998 and 2001 are still acceptable references for how this organization handles things today? Come on, if these are the best names referenced then take it up with Smith and sather. I think it's time to let things go from two decades ago...

 

[usekakkorightquinn]

Saying Lias was a bad pick when he's 21 and was producing almost a PPG in the SHL is a moronic statement. Far too early to give up on him yet.

 

[Vitto79]

Saying Lias was a bad pick when he's 21 and was producing almost a PPG in the SHL is a moronic statement. Far too early to give up on him yet.

Pretty sure most just think he’s bailed on the team and will never come back . Doesn’t even sound like he will come back to the nhl sometimes

 

[True Blue]

He is a Rangers prospect, and it is in the Rangers best interest for him to perform well with HV71 this season in the SHL.

It's baffling how many Ranger fans fail to realize this

Ummm.....you do know that I was joking, right? It's an X Files quote. Holy Mulder and Scully, Batman!

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Ummm.....you do know that I was joking, right? It's an X Files quote. Holy Mulder and Scully, Batman!

Ah ok. Never watched that show

 

[True Blue]

Ah ok. Never watched that show

All good, AK. One never knows what movie/tv show can be recognized or not.

 

[Inferno]

Ah ok. Never watched that show

If u said that around my wife....she might have to kill you (or force you to sit and watch all our dvds).

 

[chosen]

Always felt that the argument that someone's career fell short of expectations because they were rushed is bogus.

There is zero way to prove it.

 

[Leetch3]

Always felt that the argument that someone's career fell short of expectations because they were rushed is bogus.

There is zero way to prove it.

just cause you can't prove it doesn't mean its not true.

 

[will1066]

There's always the possibility that he simply doesn't like to be in North America, the living, the surroundings, or whatever else.

 

[chosen]

just cause you can't prove it doesn't mean its not true.

At the center of the Earth, there are vast deposits of scallion cream cheese.

 

[Irishguy42]

At the center of the Earth, there are vast deposits of scallion cream cheese.

Oil rigs, but for the purposes of bagels & lox

 

[egelband]

I don't think it's impossible for Lias to carve out a career with the Rangers but when you see this sort of rift between an organization and a player it usually ends up with all parties agreeing to go their separate ways so they can have a fresh start. Sometimes these things feel like they got smoothed over but there's always a risk that it comes up later on in contract negotiations or arbitration and that's not a good thing for either party.

My concern now is that even with much of the turbulence in the past, Lias is still unwilling to ‘kiss and make up’. From everything we know, the trouble between the Rangers and Lias was not particularly personal. I don’t see why Lias remains negative on the team. Correct me if I’m missing something but by now I would have expected, at least publicly, some fence-mending.