Recalled/Assigned: Lias Andersson - Part III (Loaned to SHL)

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Also the fact that it is pure speculation and opinion that Howden was somehow not having to fight for a roster spot. I find the idea that a bottom sixer on a two-way deal being handed a roster spot without having to fight at all for it utterly preposterous to begin with. Whether that "fighting for it" was done in camp or in pre-season is an entirely different story.

I certainly think there are behind the scenes things that we just aren't privy to. We don't see practice. We don't see what goes on socially within the team.

And we really don't know what's going on in Lias' mind.

 

[romba]

Chytil’s dad is a farmer. Not everyone has the luxury of being able to walk away from a dream job and not have to worry about putting food on the table.
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Need to incorporate the amount of privilege/adversity faced growing up when drafting. Chytil knew his back was against the wall and owned it and beat it. LA knew he had a parental parachute and it shows.

 

[charliemurphy]

Hot damn, Part III and still going strong on this kid.

 

[Thirty One]

Glad this thread finally got down to class warfare.

 

[romba]

I know this is semantics and I am not saying that it changes a ton of things, but he quite clearly say that he managed to 'grab one of the center positions behind Ziba after the camp'. That is one of three, and I think it reflects the way things were during camp when we had openings at more or less 3 center positions behind Ziba.

And the context is very clear, its on a question that is like "what now?" And the answer is that he hasn't given up on the NHL and he notes that he de facto won a spot for a NHL team out of a camp, if he did it once he could potentially do it again, in that perspective. Its really not at all about him winning a spot at one point and then unfairly losing it. Just for the record.

This is what he says. Reality can certainly be different, but I don't think his comments are unclear in that regard. His comments are quite clear. (1) He didn't leave because he was demoted or didn't get playing time, (2) he did leave because there were several incidents that made him really unsettled, (3) he hasn't given up on the NHL and think that he could become a NHL player, notes that he have managed to win a spot once and believes that he could do it again.

Do we have to believe the above? Certainly not. But I just want to point that out because the part were he notes that he de facto won a spot out of camp have been taken out of context and put into the perspective that its said as a statement in which he implies that he is unhappy about winning a spot fairly then unfairly losing it. That was just not the case.

That's different than what I've seen written which is that he earned THE center position behind Mika. What you wrote implies any of the center spots (2c, 3c, 4c), but what was actually said implies only the 2C. Could be wrong but I think you're reaching to defend him here...

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

Just for the record, this isn’t the case. He is asked if he wants to return to the NHL for another team and answer that he still believes he has that ability, he won a center spot behind Ziba out of camp etc.

Sry I'm confused. You said ' this isn't the case" but then the stuff you said here is what I was saying. We're you talking about one of the rumors? I hadn't seen anything to definitely dispel any rumors yet

Eco- Yeah and a lot is lost in translation and along the way to.

It is very clear that the comment on winning a spot is made in relation to if his NHL career is over or not, and not a complain in any way or form on that he won a spot but then didn’t get it.

Apparently that has been missed/lost along the way.

Ah so THAT is what you meant? Well to me, when you see all of the comments he and his agent have made about his spot it seems very clear like it absolutely is the case that he was upset about playing time and what spot he had in the lineup. Even just mentioning zib seems like an obvious passive aggressive way to imply he earned "a spot". Which one? Well by playing coy he's not directly saying it but the implication is he earned a better one than just the fourth center spot.

"Stuck with the team, made the team" there are a lot of normal ways to say that besides specifically name dropping the top line center

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

I will say this though. Howden never had to fight for a spot. I said this before a few weeks ago but the pre-season roster is divided into 4 groups basically

Group A: The sure-fire starters who play 1 or 2 games and make the team
Group B: The fringe players who play 3-6 games and make the team out of camp
Group C: The fringe players who play 3-6 games and don't make it
Group D: Filler. Prospects given a look, or AHL fodder never having a chance to make it

Howden played 2 pre-season games and made the team. Others who played 2 games and made the team? Kreider, Panarin, Zibanejad, Skjei, Trouba etc.

Both Lias and Howden were fringe players based on last season's performance. Neither really solidified a spot on the team in the 2-18-19 regular season. But Lias did have a better pre-season. And everyone kept saying "It has only been 3 games" etc. We could never bring it up because "It's still early in the season". Then, from one moment to the next, that changed to "stop beating a dead horse. We've discussed this at length" yet there was never really a time where the concerns were legitimately shared.

If Lias thought he was ahead of Howden based on a stronger pre-season, I can understand that. If the pre-season "doesn't count", I have a hard time explaining why it was reason enough to send Chytil down based on that same pre-season though.

At the end of the day, there's no real reason to go over this again since things have escalated to the point where he's no longer playing but when you mention Lias' lackluster regular season performance, I think it would be fair to point out that Howden wasn't any better in those same games. In the 2019-20 season, Lias was the only forward to never get a shot with different linemates or a different line. Whatever the reason behind it, Quinn never gave him a shot. We will never find out, but what didn't help Quinn in all this (and Howden to a degree) is the comment Quinn made later on where he said he gives Howden a longer leash because he has good intentions.

I was part of the early "let's give it 20-30 games" crowd. Then strome solidified his spot. Then chyil came back andlike a man possessed and lias fell off a cliff, never did anything worth a promotion and seemed to decline over time. He's too slow, too passive, doesn't control the puck well or gain the zone. He was beyond useless. So I get why he wasn't promoted after ten or twenty games.

 

[Graves94]

I believe Lias earned his spot on the team after a strong preseason. I also believe that he could have been promoted off the 4th line, to see if he could provide more, but I trust DQ decision, since I'm sure he wants/wanted the best for Lias and the team.
Having said this, I believe this 21 year old kid was badly advised/managed and he's made out to look like a real idiot, potentially damaging his professional career in NA. I have a strong feeling that his entourage may have had a big role in him bolting. If that's the case I feel sorry for the kid.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Howden was competition. Both made the team, so it was that Lias lost out on a spot to Howden. But if Howden is so awful, and I'll admit I want to see more out of him, and his play is so bad, wouldn't stand to reason that it would be easy to take time away from him?

One would assume. It's almost like the coach values something about his game or something, right?

I've been on the "demote Howden so he can learn in the AHL" bandwagon for a while, but I can't help but laugh at this "Howden isn't earning anything!" mantra. We don't know what the coach is valuing with regards to that. I hate it when people are putting what is pure speculation out there as a fact.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I certainly think there are behind the scenes things that we just aren't privy to. We don't see practice. We don't see what goes on socially within the team.

And we really don't know what's going on in Lias' mind.

It appears that there truly are a few things that Excel can't tell us.

 

[True Blue]

I was part of the early "let's give it 20-30 games" crowd. Then strome solidified his spot. Then chyil came back andlike a man possessed and lias fell off a cliff, never did anything worth a promotion and seemed to decline over time. He's too slow, too passive, doesn't control the puck well or gain the zone. He was beyond useless. So I get why he wasn't promoted after ten or twenty games.

I think that this cannot be understated. Where was he going to play? He was not overtaking Strome. When Chytil came back, it became obvious that he was not going to overtake him either. So the only thing he could do was make the most with what he was given. Instead, he made the least. And then took his ball and left the playground.

 

[Ola]

Sry I'm confused. You said ' this isn't the case" but then the stuff you said here is what I was saying. We're you talking about one of the rumors? I hadn't seen anything to definitely dispel any rumors yet


Ah so THAT is what you meant? Well to me, when you see all of the comments he and his agent have made about his spot it seems very clear like it absolutely is the case that he was upset about playing time and what spot he had in the lineup. Even just mentioning zib seems like an obvious passive aggressive way to imply he earned "a spot". Which one? Well by playing coy he's not directly saying it but the implication is he earned a better one than just the fourth center spot.

"Stuck with the team, made the team" there are a lot of normal ways to say that besides specifically name dropping the top line center

Just for the record, I think that this clearly is not the case. If anything all his says is tongue in cheek to not make it sound like this.

It’s just “there have been incidents that have made me very uncomfortable” bla bla bla bla and then at the end — is your NA career over? Nah my confidence is pretty crappy but I still manage to win a spot once and hope to be able to do it again. Remember that there were three spots open and he sad that he managed to grab one of three that was open.

Again — I far from sold on that a big part of this is NOT Lias being butt hurt. That could certainly be the case. But this very comment is taken out context if assigning that meaning.

 

[Ola]

That's different than what I've seen written which is that he earned THE center position behind Mika. What you wrote implies any of the center spots (2c, 3c, 4c), but what was actually said implies only the 2C. Could be wrong but I think you're reaching to defend him here...

Yep and he literary uses the word “nypte” which directly translates to “pinched”, and if anything is used more like ‘nabbed’ a spot almost. Its very much I did it once so I might do it again.

 

[kovazub94]

That's different than what I've seen written which is that he earned THE center position behind Mika. What you wrote implies any of the center spots (2c, 3c, 4c), but what was actually said implies only the 2C. Could be wrong but I think you're reaching to defend him here...

Ok, I’m willing to even assume that I’m (and most of us here) at fault for misinterpreting Lias’ completely innocent and uninflammatory statement that he simply earned one of 3 center spots behind Zibanejad, not THE 2C spot. Fine. But he was making an argument for something - a reason for why he felt he was treated unfairly. What that other reason(s) would be? Did he mean that he was unfairly demoted to Hartford? Lias’ apologists has not given a single reasonable explanation or translation of what was his beef with the organization that made him pout, then leave, then decline a conversation with the team’s president JD. I really don’t want to start on that last point but it’s the most egregious to me because of who JD is, his reputation and legacy with the organization and the league as a whole! The man himself reached out to talk to this ingrate, man to man, and was turned away! Unbelievable!

 

[bigdog16]

Ok, I’m willing to even assume that I’m (and most of us here) at fault for misinterpreting Lias’ completely innocent and uninflammatory statement that he simply earned one of 3 center spots behind Zibanejad, not THE 2C spot. Fine. But he was making an argument for something - a reason for why he felt he was treated unfairly. What that other reason(s) would be? Did he mean that he was unfairly demoted to Hartford? Lias’ apologists has not given a single reasonable explanation or translation of what was his beef with the organization that made him pout, then leave, then decline a conversation with the team’s president JD. I really don’t want to start on that last point but it’s the most egregious to me because of who JD is, his reputation and legacy with the organization and the league as a whole! The man himself reached out to talk to this ingrate, man to man, and was turned away! Unbelievable!

The only “reasonable explanation” they can give is that “we dont know the whole story yet”. Better be a hell of a story

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

we can walk and chew gum at the same time here.

Lias definitely got the short end of the stick playing with Smith/Haley/McKegg, etc. and never getting an opportunity to show what he can do with legit NHL players. Admittedly, I really wanted to see what he could do in Howden's role, as I'm sure many of you would agree.

At the same time, he isn't the only player to ever be dealt a shit hand. He had the ability to force his way up the lineup, and instead of putting his nose to the grindstone, and improving his game, he accepted defeat. He chose to be a victim instead of working to turn his situation around. He took the easy way out.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Glad this thread finally got down to class warfare.

Isn't that the next iteration of Call of Duty? COD 5: Class Warfare.

 

[SA16]

we can walk and chew gum at the same time here.

Lias definitely got the short end of the stick playing with Smith/Haley/McKegg, etc. and never getting an opportunity to show what he can do with legit NHL players. Admittedly, I really wanted to see what he could do in Howden's role, as I'm sure many of you would agree.

At the same time, he isn't the only player to ever be dealt a **** hand. He had the ability to force his way up the lineup, and instead of putting his nose to the grindstone, and improving his game, he accepted defeat. He chose to be a victim instead of working to turn his situation around. He took the easy way out.

He thinks he got a bad deal playing in that role. Brendan Lemieux played 7:25/game in WPG last year over 44 games.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Lias’ apologists has not given a single reasonable explanation or translation of what was his beef with the organization that made him pout, then leave, then decline a conversation with the team’s president JD. I really don’t want to start on that last point but it’s the most egregious to me because of who JD is, his reputation and legacy with the organization and the league as a whole! The man himself reached out to talk to this ingrate, man to man, and was turned away! Unbelievable!

I'm not a Lias apologist because of any personal investment in Lias, I'm more like an apologist for withholding judgement prior to knowing all the facts. That I can't give you a 'reasonable explanation' has little to do with the 'reasonableness' of any explanation I could give and much more to do with your having already circumscribed what can be considered reasonable. Based on what we know, it's not 'unreasonable' to suspect mistreatment any more than it's 'unreasonable' to suspect the kid is just pouting. It's 'he said, he said,' 'behind closed doors,' 'no comment.' Just be patient, we'll learn soon enough as much as we ever would what transpired.

 

[kovazub94]

I'm not a Lias apologist because of any personal investment in Lias, I'm more like an apologist for withholding judgement prior to knowing all the facts. That I can't give you a 'reasonable explanation' has little to do with the 'reasonableness' of any explanation I could give and much more to do with your having already circumscribed what can be considered reasonable. Based on what we know, it's not 'unreasonable' to suspect mistreatment any more than it's 'unreasonable' to suspect the kid is just pouting. It's 'he said, he said,' 'behind closed doors,' 'no comment.' Just be patient, we'll learn soon enough as much as we ever would what transpired.

Well, give me an appropriate, positive potential explanation for Andersson's actions that I could buy that cannot be refuted by what we already know?

 

[TheDirtyH]

Well, give me an appropriate, positive potential explanation for Andersson's actions that I could buy that cannot be refuted by what we already know?

my point

 

[Crease]

So it's been almost a month. Amazing that we still know essentially nothing. Is Andersson skating or working out? Are his feet still allegedly crabmeat?

 

[kovazub94]

my point

What's your point? I don't have absolutely any prejudice against Andersson. I was rooting for him and exited for even glimpses of progression I saw at the end of last season when he returned from Hartford and in the pre-season. of In my previous post I even conceded a possibility of misunderstanding his point on earning a spot behind Zibanejad. So I just need something that I, or any reasonable person, would be able to acknowledge as potential facts or situations that forced Lias into his current course of action.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I'm not a Lias apologist because of any personal investment in Lias, I'm more like an apologist for withholding judgement prior to knowing all the facts. That I can't give you a 'reasonable explanation' has little to do with the 'reasonableness' of any explanation I could give and much more to do with your having already circumscribed what can be considered reasonable. Based on what we know, it's not 'unreasonable' to suspect mistreatment any more than it's 'unreasonable' to suspect the kid is just pouting. It's 'he said, he said,' 'behind closed doors,' 'no comment.' Just be patient, we'll learn soon enough as much as we ever would what transpired.

We don't know the facts because Lias won't tell anyone (including his agent). So you're apologizing for not knowing all the facts because the guy who won't tell us the facts is now the guy you're apologizing for even though you don't realize it.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

So it's been almost a month. Amazing that we still know essentially nothing. Is Andersson skating or working out? Are his feet still allegedly crabmeat?

I saw a report somewhere that he was getting some sort of surgery on his feet so I would assume he’s not skating