Pre-Game Talk: Leafs vs Tampa game 7

[Morbo]

My opinion, if we lose this core it will take at least another decade before we have another contending team.

A decade, eh? An optimist, I see

 

[Throw More Waffles]

I watched the third and OT on my phone, so I couldn't really see much detail. What's were the refs up to exactly? I might need glasses .

The almost 2 minute long 5-3 PP is what has pissed everybody off.

The first high sticking penalty was literally a phantom call. Cal Foote waved his head back like a stick hit him in the face, but instant replay shows it never hit him.

The 2nd call, Hedman lifted Kerfoots stick into his own face. Which is not a penalty.

You know it's bad when the entirety of the r/hockey subreddit is calling bullshit on what the refs did to the leafs yesterday. I've literally never seen r/hockey so united in defending the leafs about something.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I find it hilarious when the default response to "fire Dubas" is assuming that person wants to return to the clownshow Burke/Nonis days. How about some fans want more for this team than just being eliminated in 7 games every year or worse? Would you really rather make it 7 first round losses in a row next year than actually search for a better option than Dubas?

Not hilarious when the vast majority of suggestions out there are pretty much along that Nonis/Burke vein.

Few GMs have built better teams than Dubas. That does not mean success, just like success doesn't mean you are not a terrible GM. Just look at the mess Lou created in Long Island or Bergevin going from SC finalist to fired in the matter of months.

 

[Maple Leaf]

I have seen this story before

 

[PromisedLand]

I watched the third and OT on my phone, so I couldn't really see much detail. What's were the refs up to exactly? I might need glasses .

A f***ing phantom penalty to Kampf, then tampa gets a 5 on 3 to even the score. On top of that the stupid phantom call on Rielly for tripping when the tampa player fell on his own.

Meanwhile, Mathtews' jersey being held on to for 15 seconds no call, muzzin, kerfoot and bunting got elbowed in the face no call.

Its a f***ing JOKE of a league.

you do that after the series. the refs won't be on our side when we are still playing.

It is starting to weight me down man. Its playoffs. Margin of error is very small. Its just 7 games not 82 games. Momentum swings and less games to make it right also matter.

Bruins series
- Both times Kadri suspended. If the f***ing refs did their job nothing like that would have happened.
- On top of that bruin elbowed and kneed leafs but nothing

Habs series
- the cross checking, the holding, the interference nothing getting f***ing called.

Leafs get screwed by reffing all the time. I mean if it is bad reffing it should go both ways right? both teams should be screwed. How is it that it is always Leafs who end on the wrong end? It is a f***ing JOKE. Dubas and Shanahan sitting on their stupid ass not calling out the bullshit also pisses the F out of me

 

[MapleLeafs77]

Honestly, marner and bunting have to be better. They were not good last night while matthews was and it seemed like he had no help.

 

[danron1376]

A f***ing phantom penalty to Kampf, then tampa gets a 5 on 3 to even the score. On top of that the stupid phantom call on Rielly for tripping when the tampa player fell on his own.

Meanwhile, Mathtews' jersey being held on to for 15 seconds no call, muzzin, kerfoot and bunting got elbowed in the face no call.

Its a f***ing JOKE of a league.



It is starting to weight me down man. Its playoffs. Margin of error is very small. Its just 7 games not 82 games. Momentum swings and less games to make it right also matter.

Bruins series
- Both times Kadri suspended. If the f***ing refs did their job nothing like that would have happened.
- On top of that bruin elbowed and kneed leafs but nothing

Habs series
- the cross checking, the holding, the interference nothing getting f***ing called.

Leafs get screwed by reffing all the time. I mean if it is bad reffing it should go both ways right? both teams should be screwed. How is it that it is always Leafs who end on the wrong end? It is a f***ing JOKE. Dubas and Shanahan sitting on their stupid ass not calling out the bullshit also pisses the F out of me

ya, i'm just as mad as you are. remember game 5? matthews got tripped on a legit penalty and the crowd was able to make the referee call a penalty. the crowd will be a huge factor for us next game. let's make tampa pay for not securing home ice advantage. go leafs!

 

[noo]

lmao posting about the watch party in Tampa gets me a thread ban on the main board .. yet posting pics of Maple Leafs Square laughing at those fans is ok??

mods biased?

 

[HolyCrap]

I’m finding it very hard to grasp that the leafs will win tomorrow night. We learned that with officiating in Boston’s series and yesterday. Then there is the choke jobs of leafs like last year. It will be a miracle if they pull this win off. GLG

lmao posting about the watch party in Tampa gets me a thread ban on the main board .. yet posting pics of Maple Leafs Square laughing at those fans is ok??

mods biased?

The mainboards mods yes. They don’t even hide it. They are similar to the NHL Refs and DOPS.

 

[Metroid]

lmao posting about the watch party in Tampa gets me a thread ban on the main board .. yet posting pics of Maple Leafs Square laughing at those fans is ok??

mods biased?

Like the refs in the nhl lol

 

[ToneDog]

Somebody suggested already. League needs to give coaches a couple of challenges on penalties. Also stupid to give a penalty when a challenge fails because league/nobody has a clue what goaltender interference is.

Honestly, marner and bunting have to be better. They were not good last night while matthews was and it seemed like he had no help.

I thought Marner was dangerous last night but at times I think he thought he was back in the OHL and trying to be way too fancy.

 

[Flipwon]

Literally need a 5 goal lead to win this one, Tampa is unmatchable when the refs are playing as hard as they have been.

 

[PromisedLand]

Leafs know how the refs are f***ing them over.....

 

[PromisedLand]

look at Holl just being a f***ing pylon on the OT goal and Marner not pressuring the puck carrier or f***ing covering the guy taking the shot. WHAT THE f*** was Marner even doing there. f***ing LAZY as shit



Phantom call on Kampf is well discussed whats not discussed is how hedman f***ing lifts Kerfoot's stick to his own face and refs f***ing call that a penalty. f*** THE NHL and f*** THE REFS

 

[tmlms13]

look at Holl just being a f***ing pylon on the OT goal.



Phantom call on Kampf is well discussed whats not discussed is how hedman f***ing lifts Kerfoot's stick to his own face and refs f***ing call that a penalty. f*** THE NHL and f*** THE REFS

To be fair Holl did probably stop a goal breaking up that Kutcherov play.

 

[IPS]

A f***ing phantom penalty to Kampf, then tampa gets a 5 on 3 to even the score. On top of that the stupid phantom call on Rielly for tripping when the tampa player fell on his own.

Meanwhile, Mathtews' jersey being held on to for 15 seconds no call, muzzin, kerfoot and bunting got elbowed in the face no call.

Its a f***ing JOKE of a league.



It is starting to weight me down man. Its playoffs. Margin of error is very small. Its just 7 games not 82 games. Momentum swings and less games to make it right also matter.

Bruins series
- Both times Kadri suspended. If the f***ing refs did their job nothing like that would have happened.
- On top of that bruin elbowed and kneed leafs but nothing

Habs series
- the cross checking, the holding, the interference nothing getting f***ing called.

Leafs get screwed by reffing all the time. I mean if it is bad reffing it should go both ways right? both teams should be screwed. How is it that it is always Leafs who end on the wrong end? It is a f***ing JOKE. Dubas and Shanahan sitting on their stupid ass not calling out the bullshit also pisses the F out of me

I know what you mean bro. It just gets mentally exhausting watching this bullshit transpire time and time again. All I wanted coming into game 6 was the refs to keep their grubby f***ing paws off of the result of the game but they just couldn't help themselves. Truly unbelievable how much of Tampa's bullshit they buy.

I knew the reffing was gonna be bad coming into this series, but the Leafs becoming the nost penalized team in the playoffs in the last 6 years - I truly had no idea it would be THAT BAD.

 

[Rob Brown]

A f***ing phantom penalty to Kampf, then tampa gets a 5 on 3 to even the score. On top of that the stupid phantom call on Rielly for tripping when the tampa player fell on his own.

Meanwhile, Mathtews' jersey being held on to for 15 seconds no call, muzzin, kerfoot and bunting got elbowed in the face no call.

Its a f***ing JOKE of a league.



It is starting to weight me down man. Its playoffs. Margin of error is very small. Its just 7 games not 82 games. Momentum swings and less games to make it right also matter.

Bruins series
- Both times Kadri suspended. If the f***ing refs did their job nothing like that would have happened.
- On top of that bruin elbowed and kneed leafs but nothing

Habs series
- the cross checking, the holding, the interference nothing getting f***ing called.

Leafs get screwed by reffing all the time. I mean if it is bad reffing it should go both ways right? both teams should be screwed. How is it that it is always Leafs who end on the wrong end? It is a f***ing JOKE. Dubas and Shanahan sitting on their stupid ass not calling out the bullshit also pisses the F out of me

I get the frustration and appreciate the passion but I think you need to just let last night (specifically the refs) go. We need to just look towards tomorrow.

 

[PromisedLand]

Even a noted Leaf hater like Whitney is calling out the BULLSHIT Reffing. Can Dubas and Shanahan grow some BALLS. If not publicly at least f***ing tell NHL to f*** OFF privately

 

[PromisedLand]

I know what you mean bro. It just gets mentally exhausting watching this bullshit transpire time and time again. All I wanted coming into game 6 was the refs to keep their grubby f***ing paws off of the result of the game but they just couldn't help themselves. Truly unbelievable how much of Tampa's bullshit they buy.

I knew the reffing was gonna be bad coming into this series, but the Leafs becoming the post penalized team in the playoffs in the last 6 years - I truly had no idea it would be THAT BAD.

Leafs went from being one of the least penalized teams in the regular season to the most penalized team in the playoffs. It tells you all you need to know about how Leafs get jobbed every f***ing year by this f***ing league and the f***ing pieces of shit refs

 

[AvroArrow]

Even a noted Leaf hater like Whitney is calling out the BULLSHIT Reffing. Can Dubas and Shanahan grow some BALLS. If not publicly at least f***ing tell NHL to f*** OFF privately

That is the craziest thing lmao, an open and known leaf hater who basically dedicates his social media to trolling the leafs is calling it out. The mains are a cesspool right now. People claiming that getting a phantom 5 on 3 to score the gwg didn't determine the outcome of the game LOL. And that the 4-5 missed calls in OT, I think 3 of them were on the gwg goal, were also non-factors. Can't make this shit up.

 

[IPS]

Someone linked this to me and it was a very interesting breakdown on the series officiating

Through 6 games there has been 246 penalty minutes distributed by the officials.

90 of those minutes were due to misconducts, leaving 156 "Penalized" minutes

20 of those minutes were for "Fighting" majors and one boarding major, leaving 136 penalized minutes

12 of those minutes were no-decision calls (Puck over glass, Too many men on the ice). 5 of the "No Decision" calls were against Tampa, where 1 was to the Leafs. This leaves 124 minutes of penalties

In those remaining 124 minutes, here is the breakdown of minutes spent penalized per game (Note: these total minutes spent penalized also include offsetting penalties):
Game 1 (Leafs win 5-0):
Leafs - 14 mins
Tampa - 16 mins

Game 2 (Leafs lose 5-3):
Leafs - 14 mins
Tampa - 6 mins

Game 3 (Leafs win 5-2):
Leafs - 6 mins
Tampa - 6 mins

Game 4 (Leafs lose 7-3):
Leafs - 18 mins
Tampa - 12 mins

Game 5 (Leafs win 4-3):
Leafs - 10 mins
Tampa - 10 mins

Game 6 (Leafs lose 4-3):
Leafs - 8 mins
Tampa - 4 mins

Total amount of penalty minutes excluding Fighting penalties, Major penalties, and "no decision" penalties:
Leafs - 70 mins
Tampa - 54 mins
All stats taken from IcyData
--------------------------------------------
Contrast this against how each team finished the season Penalties/GP.
Tampa - 4.37 PEN/GP - 2nd most penalized team in the NHL
Toronto - 3.61 PEN/GP - 17th most penalized team in the NHL

This leads to a perplexing question, why do the Leafs have 23% more penalties than the 2nd most penalized team in the NHL, in a season where Playoff penalties have increased dramatically?

One more wrinkle to add to this - here are the Referees from each Playoff game we have had with Tampa, and our subsequent regular season record with each ref:

Game 1
Brian Pochmara - TOR 0-0, TB 6-2
Dan O'Rourke - TOR 2-4, TB 3-1

Game 2
François St. Laurent -TOR 1-3, TB 2-3
Gord Dwyer - TOR 0-0, TB 3-2

Game 3
Chris Lee - TOR 1-6, TB 3-1
Frederick L’Ecuyer - TOR 0-0, TB 2-2

Game 4
Kevin Pollock - TOR 10-5, TB 0-0
TJ Luxmore - TOR 3-0, TB 2-2

Game 5
Jean Hebert - TOR 0-0, TB 3-5
Trevor Hanson - TOR 2-0, TB 4-2

Game 6
Jake Brenk - TOR 0-0, TB 1-2
Kelly Sutherland - TOR 3-4, TB 3-2

Total wins/losses in the regular season with all refs in this series:
TOR - 22 wins, 22 losses
TB - 32 wins, 24 losses

It seems odd to me that a team penalized as often as Tampa, who finished the season with less wins than Toronto, manages to get the Powerplay favor + the officiating bonus. This is completely tin-foil hat, but I would anticipate that the NHL would look for more parity. Any feedback on this data or any opinions are welcome.

 

[Morbo]

look at Holl just being a f***ing pylon on the OT goal and Marner not pressuring the puck carrier or f***ing covering the guy taking the shot. WHAT THE f*** was Marner even doing there. f***ing LAZY as shit

And I have people swearing up and down today Marner was great last night...what are people smoking...

 

[PromisedLand]

I get the frustration and appreciate the passion but I think you need to just let last night (specifically the refs) go. We need to just look towards tomorrow.

no offense but this is the kind of attitude that holds us back. Why should we accpet the incompetence of the refs every year? Why is the Leafs always get screwed and are expected to grin and bear it and let it go.

The margin of error in playoffs is very small; year after year this is happening. enough is enough already! I mean how the hell do you give them 5 on 3 on two BS calls made right after another. Kampf's stick was nowhere near that pos head; got called for high stick and then hedman lifts kerfoot's stick into his own ugly mug and that gets called to give tampa a 5 on 3. I mean WTF!

Its so blatant. Meanwhile Matthews jersey is being held on, leafs are getting elbowed in the face and no calls. WTF is this?

There is no justice of even/fair play here.

And I have people swearing up and down today Marner was great last night...what are people smoking...

Marner was COMPLETE SHIT last night. His passes did not connect, he didn't hustle for pucks and was lazy as shit. His stupidass lazy backcheck caused that OT goal

 

[PromisedLand]

That is the craziest thing lmao, an open and known leaf hater who basically dedicates his social media to trolling the leafs is calling it out. The mains are a cesspool right now. People claiming that getting a phantom 5 on 3 to score the gwg didn't determine the outcome of the game LOL. And that the 4-5 missed calls in OT, I think 3 of them were on the gwg goal, were also non-factors. Can't make this shit up.

dude forget about leafs not getting calls the 5 on 3 call that tampa got were two blatant phantom high stick calls.

1) Kampf's stick was nowhere near that pos faker's face
2) hedman lifted kerfoot's stick into his own face

Giving a full 2 man advantage for pretty much full 2 mins is most definitely determining the outocme of the game. And I am not even bringing up the shit that they let tampa get away with and not give Leafs any PPs

 

[Maple Leaf]

just need some tweaks