Post-Game Talk: Leafs lose 4-2

[Mess]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the shots were 51-18 in favor of the leafs. That's nearly triple the amount.

Jake Allen .961
Kallgren .824

Now I'm not blaming those goals on Kallgren, he's an AHL goalie and he stopped the shots he should have. But give Allen some f***ing credit, 49 stops, it happens move on to the next one.

Kallgren made 14 saves some of which where on the exceptional side, and another was called back for offside after review.

I thought you told me yesterday that you believe with Leafs offense all they needed was average goaltending to win, particularly come playoff time.

Seems good goaltending impacts games more then you want to let on perhaps, where even losing to the team that sits last in the overall standings is still possible.

Leafs seem to lose when the opposition gets good goaltending, and that seems to take precidence over all Leafs offensive talent in determing who wins and loses games.

 

[ToneDog]

Or the refs could've just made the call ? And people wonder why this fan base loses their shit with officiating. I don't know another player that takes as much abuse as Matthews without getting calls, it's f***ing ridiculous.



Now imagine this trip happening in OT in a playoff game and refs once again decide not to call it

I'd take that bet.

 

[AvroArrow]

Kallgren made 14 saves some of which where on the exceptional side, and another was called back for offside after review.

I thought you told me yesterday that you believe with Leafs offense all they needed was average goaltending to win, particularly come playoff time.

Seems good goaltending impacts games more then you want to let on perhaps, where even losing to the team that sits last in the overall standings is still possible.

Leafs seem to lose when the opposition gets good goaltending.

And now you replay that over a 7 game series and tell me what the outcome is lol. You can't seriously believe Montreals effort was good enough to win a best of 7 right ?

 

[ToneDog]

I think even Matthews said that was a mistake on his part. Think that's a play where he wants to eat the puck on the boards and wait for reinforcements below the goal line. If you can spin out all the power to you, but I feel like those extra little possession tendencies where you look for escape routes going backwards can often cause problems. If you lose control like Matthews did you've already started their transition game for them. Ugly stuff.

I just thought it was a bad look on Rielly (putting O ahead of D).

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Or the refs could've just made the call ? And people wonder why this fan base loses their shit with officiating. I don't know another player that takes as much abuse as Matthews without getting calls, it's f***ing ridiculous.



Now imagine this trip happening in OT in a playoff game and refs once again decide not to call it

Newsflash, the refs aren’t going to call that in the playoffs. Yeah it’s bullshit but that’s the league we play in. They aren’t going to call it in a random regular season game, damn sure they won’t in the playoffs. That still doesn’t excuse the fact that it was a risky play at a bad time.

 

[ToneDog]

Or the refs could've just made the call ? And people wonder why this fan base loses their shit with officiating. I don't know another player that takes as much abuse as Matthews without getting calls, it's f***ing ridiculous.



Now imagine this trip happening in OT in a playoff game and refs once again decide not to call it

The more I watch it, the more it is a clear trip but still not a good look on 44 pinching and getting caught.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

And now you replay that over a 7 game series and tell me what the outcome is lol. You can't seriously believe Montreals effort was good enough to win a best of 7 right ?

I mean, yes? We had this same game multiple times in the playoffs last year and the end result was a series loss.

 

[CuuuJooo]

Gio and Lub had solid, quiet, excellent defensive games. No unnecessary flash, but they get the job done.

I’m not yet sold on Blackwell, though I suspect (like many) that he’d complement JT much better if that albatross pairing on the second line were split up…

 

[Stephen]

I just thought it was a bad look on Rielly (putting O ahead of D).

Well, no argument there on the Leafs poor defensive pinches. One of the more annoying trends is actually seeing the Leafs give the green light to every one of their defensemen to do whatever willy nilly 'activation' regardless of who it is or what the situation is.

Jumping off the point to the side wall, joining the rush to the point where guys like Holl and Brodie are behind the opposition net, or when Lyubushkin joins the rush and migrates from the right defensive spot to the left wing corner.

Seems like innovative tactics until you realize how high danger those chances are. If you have a Roman Josi, let him have free reign, but when it's our medium budget, middling ability defense? Come on.

 

[Stephen]

If there's any positive about last night's Montreal regulation loss is hopefully they're positioning themselves into a worse and worse draft pick.

 

[AvroArrow]

Newsflash, the refs aren’t going to call that in the playoffs. Yeah it’s bullshit but that’s the league we play in. They aren’t going to call it in a random regular season game, damn sure they won’t in the playoffs. That still doesn’t excuse the fact that it was a risky play at a bad time.

It also still doesn't excuse the refs incompetence. Even if Matthews wiffed on the dump in, he could have easily turned around and back checked preventing that goal. A risky pinch is a completely different discussion, that is 100% on the refs for not calling that trip. When the opposing skater trips your player, takes the puck the other way and scores on an odd-man rush, that is 100% on that trip. Matthews was in more than a good enough position to back-check even if he just got stripped of the puck and not tripped.

He had also cross-checked Bunting in the head right off the face off, just before tripping Matthews. Call a f***ing penalty. Our players get suspended 2 games without even thinking about it, no prior history, DoPS instantly tweeting about the player and immediate suspension. We've now seen 2 cross-checks to the neck/head in 3 days, and not a single one gets a hearing.

 

[ULF_55]

Kallgren made 14 saves some of which where on the exceptional side, and another was called back for offside after review.

I thought you told me yesterday that you believe with Leafs offense all they needed was average goaltending to win, particularly come playoff time.

Seems good goaltending impacts games more then you want to let on perhaps, where even losing to the team that sits last in the overall standings is still possible.

Leafs seem to lose when the opposition gets good goaltending, and that seems to take precidence over all Leafs offensive talent in determing who wins and loses games.

Yeah, Leafs have come up short several times while outshooting opposition big time.
Even with all their fire power, Leafs have a hard time getting good shots against good defensive teams. Still get shots but not good ones.
They do well against goalies with holes/flaws.

 

[ULF_55]

Funny, that goal with Matthews setting up the break-away was very similar to the one Nylander had the other night.
Last night was a little worse, Matthews had control of the Nylander never did.

 

[Mess]

And now you replay that over a 7 game series and tell me what the outcome is lol. You can't seriously believe Montreals effort was good enough to win a best of 7 right ?

What about last years 7 game series against Montreal results where it was good enough and Leafs got 1.81 GAA and .934 sv% from Campbell? Did you think Montreal's effort was good enough then to win 4 of 7 games?

Its not just about effort and offensive talent and shots on net, its all about how many actual goals against and saves a goalie makes. Now its not Carey Price but just regular goalies making saves.

Leafs lost this game to Allen 4-2, but they also lost to Montreal 5-2 when rookie goalie Samuel Montembeault made 35 saves and posted a .946 sv%..

You seem to be putting a lot of trust into expected GF% based on volume of shots taken, and denying actual goals against is what matters as its the goalie that determines that.

Here is the secret formula that I've learned to success, and its the goalie that surrenders the least goals against, and thus likely the best sv% in a game that wins. Its not the shooter nor their shots nor the effort its the # of saves made on them, which is out of a teams control.

 

[Budz]

I would move JT with Matthews/Mitch.

Bunting Kerfoot Nylander
Mik Kampf Engvall

 

[egd27]

We will have a good preview vs the Panthers tonight.

Their most convincing game lately was the Carolina game but just seems like the way they really want to play is going to get them into trouble when playoff style hockey starts, they don't get whistles and all their little east west plays, defensive pinches reversals, and area passes are going to get gobbled up by a team that will just roll them over.

Perhaps, but my sense is the Sunday Mar 27th Panthers may not play the same way they would if this were Game 1 of a playoff series vs Toronto.
I'm not convinced I can say the same about the Leafs.

 

[Torontonian]

Can't wait for Simmonds to be out of lineup for either one of the college FA or Kase etc, guy provides absolutely nothing to the lineup. Same thing with Holl, every time he gets the puck on his stick in the o-zone, the play dies. 50 shots on goal to 17 and we still lose, same issue that's been haunting us in the playoffs, cant finish when we need to score.

I get the Nylander blame, he's been a passenger the past 25 games or so, has shown he went back to a soft, outside player, unlike what he shown at the start of the season, that's the most annoying part of him. The Savard goal was all on him, Giordano took his man hard in front of the net and tied up his player and Nylander with a lazy backcheck just left his man all alone in front.

Lastly, the 3rd goal MTL scored is the exact thing thats wrong with Toronto, Matthews up high with the puck and you see 44 move in thinking offence in a tied 2-2 game with 2 mins left in the 3rd period.

 

[AvroArrow]

What about last years 7 game series against Montreal results where it was good enough and Leafs got 1.81 GAA and .934 sv% from Campbell?

Its not just about effort and offensive talent and shots on net, its all about how many actual goals against and saves a goalie makes. Now its not Carey Price but just regular goalies making saves.

Leafs lost this game to Allen 4-2, but they also lost to Montreal 5-2 when rookie goalie Samuel Montembeault made 35 saves and posted a .946 sv%..

You seem to be putting a lot of trust into expected GF% based on volume of shots taken, and denying actual goals against is what matters as its the goalie that determines that.

No i'm putting a lot of trust into dominating a game, playing the right way and badly out chancing your opponent. Obviously an elite goaltender needs to be taken into consideration, he's going to negate (not sure if it's the right word I want to use) a significant amount of the offence. If the skaters play the way they did over a 7 game series, they will win that series almost every single time. Going back to last years series, legit everything that could have went wrong did. It's like the hockey gods tehmselves came down and blessed the Habs.

The shooters also determine actual goals against, something you haven't acknowledged it. The puck doesn't magically go into the net, there's a shot that beats the goalie, and Matthews is the best in the business.

Also question for you, if it was us that was outshot 51-18 and won last night what would the narrative be then ? What would your stance be then ? We were the better team and deserved to win ? We played the right way and dominated ? The better team doesn't always win, there's always some luck involved, but dominating puck possession and scoring chances heavily tilts the odds in your favor and that's all you can do. You can't predict freak injuries to multiple core players, or ridiculous bounces or your player sending the opposing team on a 2 on 0 in OT. You give yourself the best chance to win and we did that, like it or not but luck is absolutely a factor in all sports.

I'll take that game last night from a puck possession/scoring chances point of view 100/100. Like the great Ray once said "That's the way she goes, sometimes she goes sometimes she doesn't" On to the next one.

 

[Goldenhands]

Lol seriously, I don't get it with some people. I know it's the Habs and it sucks losing to them, but what can you do when Allen played the game of his life? Leafs completely dominated other than a small portion of the 2nd

My only takeaway from this game is that I hope Keefe keeps JT and Nylander separated

Allen is a pretty solid and underrated goaltender, he is actually pretty consistent and rarely allow weak goals. He has exceeded all expections we had since we got him and stands strong in the net on most nights.

 

[egd27]

And now you replay that over a 7 game series and tell me what the outcome is lol. You can't seriously believe Montreals effort was good enough to win a best of 7 right ?

We just did 10 months ago and it was.

 

[griffon1]

I would move JT with Matthews/Mitch.

Bunting Kerfoot Nylander
Mik Kampf Engvall

I'd leave the best line in hockey alone and would give some new guys a look with JT & WN.

Kerfoot is ok but just doesn't work there and unfortunately is a high paid 3rd liner on this team.

Robertson looked ok, was just trying to hard and over shooting. I'd also try Blackwell or a Marlie, and for more than just a couple of shifts.

I'm getting fed up with Keefe giving someone a brief look then going back to what we know doesn't work.

Also time to give Simmonds and Spezza some rest.

 

[riffle]

Don't know if I've ever missed Kadri more than right now. We don't have a capable 2C. There's a dearth of centers in this organization. Trades have consequences...even years later. This one's haunting hard right now.

 

[Bluelines]

I just thought it was a bad look on Rielly (putting O ahead of D).

Ya gotta know when to pinch and when to play it safe, less than 3 minutes left in the 3rd in a tie game on the road, every coach but Keefe will tell their players to NOT do what Rielly did...but this why Keefe loses that game and other coaches at least get a point.

 

[Racer88]

Kallgren made 14 saves some of which where on the exceptional side, and another was called back for offside after review.

I thought you told me yesterday that you believe with Leafs offense all they needed was average goaltending to win, particularly come playoff time.

Seems good goaltending impacts games more then you want to let on perhaps, where even losing to the team that sits last in the overall standings is still possible.

Leafs seem to lose when the opposition gets good goaltending, and that seems to take precidence over all Leafs offensive talent in determing who wins and loses games.

Ya it almost seems that the Leafs talent is only on display against average or poor goal tending otherwise how could we get ”goalied “ so often. Over the last 3 years including playoffs

 

[Racer88]

Don't know if I've ever missed Kadri more than right now. We don't have a capable 2C. There's a dearth of centers in this organization. Trades have consequences...even years later. This one's haunting hard right now.

Yup. I would take Kadri even with his suspension history over Tavares any day of the week