Post-Game Talk: Leafs lose 4-2

[riffle]

Individual glory versus cups

Point, Pastrnak and even now Crosby/Malkin etc... can easily cheat for individual glory but their coach plans around whats best for the team.

Even Ovi said it that if Leafs want to win in the playoffs they will have to change the way they play (basically: stop cheating for offense).

Barzal could cheat for offense easily too... he played two conference finals play 2 way hockey.

Bergeron/Marchand can easily cheat for offense but they always play defense first especially in the playoffs.

These are just some examples.

On top of that my personal take is that Keefe is not an NHL coach. He is a rookie who is supposedly learning on the job. It was pretty obvious how Torts outcoached him in the CBJ series and how he got outcoached by another crap coach last season

Hard to believe the keys were handed to 2 guys learning through OJT. Dubas and Keefe. That's a lot to ask.

 

[LastOne2100]

A classic case of coach can't say anything to a perineal superstar
Lets face it, who is Keefe to talk down to Tavares? nobody

But he can with Nylander

Absolutely, multiple coaches in a row refusing to hold the entire team equally responsible and picking on the easy targets. This is what is killing our culture.

You won't get the best from EVERYONE if you don't push EVERYONE to give their best, and hold EVERYONE accountable.

 

[Leaftors]

Tampa, Florida, Boston all won tonight against their crap teams.

Just 3 nights ago the avalanche lost to the Canucks and pit lost to the sabres while we beat the devils.

 

[BallardEra]

9 points back of Florida with 18 games left. I think the goal should be to at least try and get second place in the division to ensure home ice for the first round.

 

[LastOne2100]

Leafs fans are honestly some of the worst fans in the league. Going to say this again but when they win, some of the fans won't deserve it but the team will.

Really drives me nuts that some people equate being a fan of the team with needing to drool all over everything they do.

Everyone is here because we care about the Leafs. This nonsense about people not being Leafs fans as they are worried about this team's potential for success in the playoffs is nauseating and needs to stop.

 

[riffle]

I think the difference is, any mistake Nylander makes we immediately blame on "effort". Any mistake JT makes we just assume he's trying his best, despite being equally lazy on multiple backchecks tonight, and making multiple brutal lazy turnovers.

It's a strange double standard.

I can point to more things Nylander did right on defense tonight than JT, like that beautiful backcheck and strip of the puck to prevent a Montreal breakaway.

To me, this is simple. It's either an effort issue, or it isn't. Nobody should think the Nylander gaffe was anything but an effort issue.

JT can't skate like 88. Very limited in things in ways 88 is not. I used to criticize Matthews for effort. He and Nylander used to be abysmal in that area a few years ago. Auston took more steps away from that than Willy has. I hope Willy takes more. Perhaps, the public acknowledgement that his lack of effort turned the game is a huge step for him? I saw him in a presser earlier in the year disavowing responsibility for his errors and didn't care for it. Thought it was a very immature reply to a question where he should've taken ownership but he went the other way. Haven't seen the clip of him taking responsibility, but that's very encouraging to me. I expect great things from him in the way of effort tomorrow night.

Rip JT. Rip Auston. Rip Marner. Rip anyone when they don't give effort. Nobody should be immune to that kind of criticism.

 

[PromisedLand]

I get what Keefe's saying. We fully dominated long stretches of that game.

Our problem wasn't the opposing goalie - it was that outside of our top line we cannot convert our possession into dangerous scoring opportunities.

yet keefe persisted with that absolutely horrid 2nd line that surrendered a goal against and gave opposition grade A scoring chances until the 3rd period and his move was flip just one winger.

thats the coach you never take seriously. they did not even change the way they play. if fancy BS is not working then crash the net, take the eyes away of the goalie, tip the shots... something different.... NOPE! they kept doing the same BULLSHIT entire game long

 

[Leaftors]

That applies to every team in the league then. Only 1 team has won the Cup in the last 2 years, and with blatant cheating.

We have used the same loophole in the cap. Stop calling it cheating

 

[LastOne2100]

To me, this is simple. It's either an effort issue, or it isn't. Nobody should think the Nylander gaffe was anything but an effort issue.

JT can't skate like 88. Very limited in things in ways 88 is not. I used to criticize Matthews for effort. He and Nylander used to be abysmal in that area a few years ago. Auston took more steps away from that than Willy has. I hope Willy takes more. Perhaps, the public acknowledgement that his lack of effort is a huge step for him? I saw him in a presser earlier in the year disavowing responsibility for his errors and didn't care for it. Thought it was a very immature reply to a question where he should've taken ownership and went the other way. Haven't seen the clip of him taking responsibility, but that's very encouraging to me. I expect great things from him in the way of effort tomorrow night.

Rip JT. Rip Auston. Rip Marner. Rip anyone when they don't give effort. Nobody should be immune to that kind of criticism.

Sure, but I don't understand how anyone can watch tonight's game and come away thinking that the only person with an effort problem tonight that should be called out was Nylander, while everything else the team did was awesome.

That was Keefe's presser tonight. Embarrassing.

 

[fahad203]

Just 3 nights ago the avalanche lost to the Canucks and pit lost to the sabres while we beat the devils.

I think you are missing the point. Every team losses to every team
For the leafs though, it's the same way of losing to scrubs

A goalie outshines ours. Why, because we dont' make his life tough enough
We dont' get second chances. We don't crash the net

They out wait us, like they did today until we made a mistake. This was the exact recipe from last year's playoffs when we went to two OT
Habs simply out waited us and out goalied us

That's been like that for how long now? 3 years running minimum starting with Columbus

 

[PromisedLand]

might be time for a culture change for this organization if it goes south in the playoffs.... new vision

guys like dubas may be good to ahve in the organization but should not be GM. His overpayments and shortsightedness and absolutely no foresight has set this franchise years behind IMO and has wasted prime opportunities. Both nylnader and matthews are UFAs before Tavares' contract is even off the books.

If that was the plan then he should not have overpaid on a 5 year and 6 year deals to both Matthews and Marner and should have tried to win in the short window with having massive cap flexibility.

He ruined the cap, no guarantees that mattews and nylander even re-sign.

What an absolute colossal failure of a GM he has been is an understatement.

 

[Mopar]

They shouldn't be taking it easy just because they're solidly into the playoffs. Take care of business and secure home ice advantage. Fans in the stands this year and the team needs all the help it can get to finally get the gorilla off its back and advance.

 

[Leaftors]

I think you are missing the point. Every team losses to every team
For the leafs though, it's the same way of losing to scrubs

A goalie outshines ours. Why, because we dont' make his life tough enough
We dont' get second chances. We don't crash the net

They out wait us, like they did today until we made a mistake. This was the exact recipe from last year's playoffs when we went to two OT
Habs simply out waited us and out goalied us

That's been like that for how long now? 3 years running minimum starting with Columbus

Montreal was allowed full capacity and have had some key players come off injury recently. Our effort level was there for stretches, and in the end a few mistakes cost us the game. It’s the NHL, “scrub” teams still win games. The Habs if they had Allen all year + st.Louis behind the bench would certainly not be in this position. The sky is not falling, it’s not all sunshine either.

Let’s see how they fare tomorrow.

 

[LastOne2100]

guys like dubas may be good to ahve in the organization but should not be GM. His overpayments and shortsightedness and absolutely no foresight has set this franchise years behind IMO and has wasted prime opportunities. Both nylnader and matthews are UFAs before Tavares' contract is even off the books.

If that was the plan then he should not have overpaid on a 5 year and 6 year deals to both Matthews and Marner and should have tried to win in the short window with having massive cap flexibility.

He ruined the cap, no guarantees that mattews and nylander even re-sign.

What an absolute colossal failure of a GM he has been is an understatement.

The blame sits squarely with Shanahan. Dubas is very far out of his depth and no one in their right mind should've given him the GM role at such a critical time for the team, with multiple major contracts coming up.

 

[Dragao6]

The thing about us was we have so many holes. You needed to go all in or nothing at all
It tells me that you kind of believe in this team, kind of hoping Campbell can save you and kind of hoping for other team to F up

Nope kinda of the opposite
Wasted and have been wasting assets at deadline on this team that isn’t ready
Wasted allot of ufa walking for nothing over the years

This team will be relevant when tavares contract is up only
The current best teams will be in cap hell soon enough
That’s when we should be preparing for

 

[Leafs1991]

I think the difference is, any mistake Nylander makes we immediately blame on "effort". Any mistake JT makes we just assume he's trying his best, despite being equally lazy on multiple backchecks tonight, and making multiple brutal lazy turnovers.

It's a strange double standard.

I can point to more things Nylander did right on defense tonight than JT, like that beautiful backcheck and strip of the puck to prevent a Montreal breakaway.

Exactly, I think people ahve been way too hard on him all year, he's been the best player on that line all season and has looked much better compared to last season in the effort department. He's forecheking and backchecking alot more.

 

[MSZ]

Looks like Matthews is about to lose his rocket lead too. This season just couldn't get any worse.

 

[riffle]

Might be something to this? Time to shelter our Captain and one of our elite wingers.

 

[fahad203]

Might be something to this?

I mean Leafs are all about numbers
Do they not know this?

 

[LastOne2100]

Might be something to this?

Yes, the second line doesn't work at all, no matter who the third warm body they still there is. Everyone knows this except Keefe.

The debate is whether the problem is more JT or Nylander, but since Keefe refuses to do anything about it, we might never know.

The fact we haven't spent at least some time with Nylander-Matthews, JT-Marner to try and get everyone going is just madness at this point.

 

[fahad203]

Yes, the second line doesn't work at all. Everyone knows this except Keefe.

The debate is whether the problem is more JT or Nylander, but since Keefe refuses to do anything about it, we might never know.

The fact we haven't spent at least some time with Nylander-Matthews, JT-Marner to try and get everyone going is just madness at this point.

Must be the line. Keefe is the greatest coach ever

 

[PromisedLand]

This has been a problem on the Leafs for years now. For some reason Dubas just has no interest in D who can shoot the puck.

Leafs are the ONLY playoff team to not have a solid point shot. Not even one btw.... and has been like that for more than 5+ years

Let that sink in

 

[Future]

Sure, but I don't understand how anyone can watch tonight's game and come away thinking that the only person with an effort problem tonight that should be called out was Nylander, while everything else the team did was awesome.

That was Keefe's presser tonight. Embarrassing.

The problem is Nylander has the talent to take over a game. To carry a line by himself.

He’s so much more talented than that manlet Caufield, yet didn’t look that great against competition he should absolutely dominate. Why is that? Talent wise he’s right up there with Marner/Matthews and he looked to be having a breakout year the first third/half of the season. His play has certainly tailed off since then.

If he hasn’t been able to find any semblance of consistency after all these years, will he ever?

 

[Rude Dog]

You must be a new Leafs fan
I have been waiting for 20 years for a series win

So far we got was 4-1 collapse against Boston
3-2 loss to Columbus playing 5 games at home
3-1 loss defecit against Habs

Lol. Double that time and you would be close. Thx for the history lesson. Wasn’t aware. Sorry. I’m just not ready to concede like many here.

 

[LastOne2100]

Leafs are the ONLY playoff team to not have a solid point shot. Not even one btw.... and has been like that for more than 5+ years

Let that sink in

Not that it would help anyways. Point shots from D are only good if you have players setting up in front of the net battling for position, making it hard for defenders and goalies alike. We are soft as butter in front of our own, and our opponents' nets.