News Article: Leafs are now identifiable.

[Wafflewhipper]

KOSHAN: Maple Leafs have forged identity as well-rounded outfit through 20 games | Toronto Sun

We are in every game because they play a patient/discipline/ solid defense. As this year goes along and next years even this team will play a better complete game. Nice transition to a competitive overall team game. Still need more grit in the lineup is still unfortunately part of this identity on the minor negative with the group. It shows up instantly after Simmonds goes down. Overall I’m pretty proud of the transformation from top management on down to the 13 forward.
They made strides bringing in the right veterans and intangibles but there is work to do on adding a bit more bite.
I’m absolutely impressed on the whole. Keeper goin!

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[zeke]

that's what happens when Prez-GM-Coach-Team are all on the same page.

 

[Bluelines]

I kind of think it really comes down to AM and MM playing elite elite elite world class hockey. If they are playing near their career averages I think we are a middle-ish of the pack team. Just eye balling AM would have about 5 or 6 less goals and MM would have about 2 or 3 less goals, combined 7 to 9 fewer goals means 2 to 4 less wins, 4 less point means we are in 2nd behind Edmonton, 8 less points means we are in 3rd 2 points ahead of 4th.

If we had such a great team system, the production would be spread out better, the 2nd and 3rd lines have been disappointing, the 4th line has produced better than I expected. I think this years team is better than last years team but its way too soon for the Leaf's or the media to be blowing sunshine up the backsides of the fandom.

 

[willmma]

I kind of think it really comes down to AM and MM playing elite elite elite world class hockey. If they are playing near their career averages I think we are a middle-ish of the pack team. Just eye balling AM would have about 5 or 6 less goals and MM would have about 2 or 3 less goals, combined 7 to 9 fewer goals means 2 to 4 less wins, 4 less point means we are in 2nd behind Edmonton, 8 less points means we are in 3rd 2 points ahead of 4th.

If we had such a great team system, the production would be spread out better, the 2nd and 3rd lines have been disappointing, the 4th line has produced better than I expected. I think this years team is better than last years team but its way too soon for the Leaf's or the media to be blowing sunshine up the backsides of the fandom.

That's not entirely fair. If you knock off 9 goals from the top line and and 8 points of each team you will see them drop too. Edmonton will be 5th.

The point of the article is not about production, it's about the commitment to defensively sound play by the whole team. There is buy-in by everyone.
We have the best GA/GP average in the division (8th in the league). Considering this is a division is playing 80s high scoring hockey, this is quite impressive.

We used to lead the division in GF as well, but Calgary changed that by allowing 7 against to Edmonton in one game and 2 to us in two games.

Basically we are well balanced with attacking and defense. We can't hold Matthews and Marner producing elite numbers against us.

 

[Bluelines]

That's not entirely fair. If you knock off 9 goals from the top line and and 8 points of each team you will see them drop too. Edmonton will be 5th.

The point of the article is not about production, it's about the commitment to defensively sound play by the whole team. There is buy-in by everyone.
We have the best GA/GP average in the division (8th in the league). Considering this is a division is playing 80s high scoring hockey, this is quite impressive.

We used to lead the division in GF as well, but Calgary changed that by allowing 7 against to Edmonton in one game and 2 to us in two games.

Basically we are well balanced with attacking and defense. We can't hold Matthews and Marner producing elite numbers against us.

I'm just saying that MM and AM are in a place, in terms of production, where they have never been before. CM and LD in Edm , have produced at the pace they are currently at. Our success IMO is more related to two world class players playing above their career norms. The key for me is what is normal. If the system was the reason, you'd see our 2nd line, which could be a first line on many teams, succeed as well.

I'm happy they think that defence is powering this 1st place position, IMO AM and MM are the 1st, 2nd and 3rd reason why we are in 1st place. Take the two Calgary games for example, they made a point of shutting down AM and MM, 0 goals in 2 games, resulted in one loss and a lucky bounce in game 2 where we scored with the goalie pulled. If MM and AM don't score, we typically don't win.

 

[zeke]

I kind of think it really comes down to AM and MM playing elite elite elite world class hockey. If they are playing near their career averages I think we are a middle-ish of the pack team.

They are playing to their career production averages.

They're just getting 25% more ice time, so are scoring 25% more.

 

[Rielly4]

They are playing to their career production averages.

They're just getting 25% more ice time, so are scoring 25% more.

fair but they are definitely playing better. Not all ice time is created the same, playing 16 minutes a game you are fresh the entire time. Playing 24 minutes a game you are gassed the entire time.

 

[zeke]

playing 16 minutes a game you are fresh the entire time. Playing 24 minutes a game you are gassed the entire time.

says who?

 

[ottomaddox]

that's what happens when Prez-GM-Coach-Team are all on the same page.

What is this referring to?

 

[nsleaf]

Makes sense considering the competition.

 

[Critical13]

I kind of think it really comes down to AM and MM playing elite elite elite world class hockey. If they are playing near their career averages I think we are a middle-ish of the pack team. Just eye balling AM would have about 5 or 6 less goals and MM would have about 2 or 3 less goals, combined 7 to 9 fewer goals means 2 to 4 less wins, 4 less point means we are in 2nd behind Edmonton, 8 less points means we are in 3rd 2 points ahead of 4th.

If we had such a great team system, the production would be spread out better, the 2nd and 3rd lines have been disappointing, the 4th line has produced better than I expected. I think this years team is better than last years team but its way too soon for the Leaf's or the media to be blowing sunshine up the backsides of the fandom.

So basically "if our players were worse, we would be worse?" Do I have that right?

Groundbreaking

They are playing to their career production averages.

They're just getting 25% more ice time, so are scoring 25% more.

 

[Bluelines]

They are playing to their career production averages.

They're just getting 25% more ice time, so are scoring 25% more.

They are scoring more, the "why" is immaterial to the fact their increase in production is IMO why this team record is so good.

Before this year, Mitch scored at 0.97 ppg, this year 1.43 ppg, that is almost a half point per game better.
Before this year, Matthews scored at 1.01 ppg, this year 1.55 ppg, that is more than a half point per game better.

Between the 2 of them they added about a ppg more to Toronto's production, it's like Toronto added a star's production without adding a star

 

[Bluelines]

So basically "if our players were worse, we would be worse?" Do I have that right?

Groundbreaking

You missed a pretty simple point, the article claims its our commitment to a team system is why the Leafs are dominating the division. It's pretty simple to see that the production of AM and MM is the reason why the Leafs are dominating. Shut those 2 down and the Leafs lose. If shutting down 2 players means your team lose , how good is that system?

 

[dubplatepressure]

Good start to the post season, this year has been so far. We'll see how the playoffs shake out.

 

[Teeder Keon]

They are playing to their career production averages.

They're just getting 25% more ice time, so are scoring 25% more.

Good point

 

[Critical13]

You missed a pretty simple point, the article claims its our commitment to a team system is why the Leafs are dominating the division. It's pretty simple to see that the production of AM and MM is the reason why the Leafs are dominating. Shut those 2 down and the Leafs lose.

Alright, now name me all the contenders that dominate even after you shut down their top two players?

Maybe Tampa? Although Tampa isn't dominating right now with a healthy team.

 

[mix1home]

You missed a pretty simple point, the article claims its our commitment to a team system is why the Leafs are dominating the division. It's pretty simple to see that the production of AM and MM is the reason why the Leafs are dominating. Shut those 2 down and the Leafs lose.

I think the same is universally true. Edm didn’t win single game last season when both cm and ld were off score sheet. I think they got one win this year. Does not negate argument that we have somewhat better D and defensive system.

 

[Bluelines]

Alright, now name me all the contenders that dominate even after you shut down their top two players?

Maybe Tampa? Although Tampa isn't dominating right now with a healthy team.

So again, you missed the point, I said if MM and AM play at career average, our team is closer to middle of the pack. In context to an article that says our teams is playing better because of a team system, its pretty easy to win when 2 elite players who are already scoring at a high pace add a ppg to their career average.

 

[Critical13]

So again, you missed the point, I said if MM and AM play at career average, our team is closer to middle of the pack. In context to an article that says our teams is playing better because of a team system, its pretty easy to win when 2 elite players who are already scoring at a high pace add a ppg to their career average.

You didn't answer my question, either. You said if teams shut them down, we won't dominate. Sure. Now list the teams that this doesn't apply to?

 

[Bluelines]

I think the same is universally true. Edm didn’t win single game last season when both cm and ld were off score sheet. I think they got one win this year. Does not negate argument that we have somewhat better D and defensive system.

Again I wouldn't put our system as the top reason why we are winning this year. Its pretty obvious two players are carrying this team. Our "system" is to rely on MM and AM to generate goals.

 

[7even]

They are playing to their career production averages.

They're just getting 25% more ice time, so are scoring 25% more.

Productivity isn't linear. You already know that.

Matthews is shooting 22%. Forwards' peak years usually come between 22 and 25. Matthews and Marner are both 23. This is what a career year looks like.

 

[Buds17]

First place overall definitely makes for a nice identity.

 

[willmma]

I'm just saying that MM and AM are in a place, in terms of production, where they have never been before. CM and LD in Edm , have produced at the pace they are currently at. Our success IMO is more related to two world class players playing above their career norms. The key for me is what is normal. If the system was the reason, you'd see our 2nd line, which could be a first line on many teams, succeed as well.

I'm happy they think that defence is powering this 1st place position, IMO AM and MM are the 1st, 2nd and 3rd reason why we are in 1st place. Take the two Calgary games for example, they made a point of shutting down AM and MM, 0 goals in 2 games, resulted in one loss and a lucky bounce in game 2 where we scored with the goalie pulled. If MM and AM don't score, we typically don't win.

On the flip side JT and WN are not playing to their average we would be much better.

Can we say AM MM are currently offsetting JT WN production drop?

 

[zeke]

They are scoring more, the "why" is immaterial to the fact their increase in production is IMO why this team record is so good.

Before this year, Mitch scored at 0.97 ppg, this year 1.43 ppg, that is almost a half point per game better.
Before this year, Matthews scored at 1.01 ppg, this year 1.55 ppg, that is more than a half point per game better.

Between the 2 of them they added about a ppg more to Toronto's production, it's like Toronto added a star's production without adding a star

It is absolutely material to both your claim that they are suddenly playing a new level of "elite elite hockey" and your hypothetical "if they were playing to their career averages".

There has been no change in their level of play, only in their usage.

 

[zeke]

Productivity isn't linear. You already know that.

Matthews is shooting 22%. Forwards' peak years usually come between 22 and 25. Matthews and Marner are both 23. This is what a career year looks like.

Who even came up with this silly line "production isn't linear" anyways? Why do people keep using it as a mantra? What does it even mean? Why do people use it as a crutch every time the obvious thing happens and players see their production go up when they get more minutes?

Yes I am totally shocked that they are suddenly having "career years" when their ice time suddenly jumps 25%.

What a surprise! Who could have guessed?