The Winter Soldier
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- Apr 4, 2011
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This is why I made the Dion Phaneuf comparison the other day. Jakob has the talent, no doubt. But he has his moments too where he makes questionable plays.
LD Jakob Chychrun - Sarnia Sting, OHL (2016 Draft)
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This is why I made the Dion Phaneuf comparison the other day. Jakob has the talent, no doubt. But he has his moments too where he makes questionable plays.
McMatthews
Registered User
Chychrun is a more mobile Dion Phaneuf.
He battles the puck way too much to risk a top 5 pick on him.
He'd be a great pick around 8th or 9th.
D0ctorCool
Registered User
I've been way more impressed with Fabbro. Chychrun has been making a lot of little mistakes all tournament long. I hope everyone disagrees with me though, as I really wanted the Canucks to draft him @ 4 or 5. Now I'm not so sure.
McMatthews
Registered User
As one of the first people to bring it up, I'm proud I made a good statement, but it was with a different intention. I still think Chychrun ends up better than Bogosian, as him and Sam Gagner are the two guys I look at and just feel they were developed in the worst possibly ways, and had a lot of bad bounces (Particularly Bogosian with injuries). I think if you play their careers out 10 different times, this is the worst possible outcome you get. I hope Chychrun has a strong last two games, but this hasn't been a strong performance. He has all the skill in the world, he just needs to calm down a bit.
I don't really see the Dion comparison, Chychrun is a way more fluid player. I'd also add, Dion's game was drastically changed by the rule changes on hitting (which he developed his game around). His intimidation through killing guys in the middle or looking down, led to him developing sub-par positioning, which had to be adapted mid-career. This was because when that was a clean hit, it was a fine gamble, now when its a 5 minute penalty and a suspension, its a stupid play.
EichHart
Registered User
I don't think Bogosian was developed badly. Bogosian at the end of last season was incredible. I think injuries has really hurt his game. He was a top 2 dman for the last 20 games of last year, this year he really struggled but picked it up towards the end of the year.
He probably should of got an extra year in Jr, and he's had bad injury luck. Him and Pietrangelo were comparable prospects, and handled in almost completely opposite ways. I don't think he's a bad player, he's a capable top 4 player when healthy, but he had the potential to be a top 10 to 15 defender league wide. He had every tool you wanted. Its just he was thrust into a top 4 role very early in his career on a bad team, while getting a heavy amount of D-zone starts. Its why if the Leafs draft Chychrun, I would hope he gets an extra year of jr, then eased in at 19 (16 to 20 minutes a game, with favourable match ups and zone starts).
To compare, here is how Pietrangelo was developed compared to Bogosian, got small stints with the club at 18 and 19, but both times sent down. In the 19 year old season case, they spread out the games, and got him an AHL conditioning stint, then WJC and sent back to the OHL. In his first full season, and both seasons he had prior games he was used more heavily in the offensive zone (about 57% O-zone starts), and only had more D-zone starts to O-zone starts last year and this year. Bogosian was thrown to the wolves at 18, started in the O-zone 44% of the time. On top of that Blues had a somewhat stable situation, where the last year of Atlanta was a train wreck. If Atlanta drafted Pietrangelo, I'm very uncertain if he could of overcame what Bogosian was put through.
Breakers
Make Mirrored Visors Legal Again
Chychrun has been taken off the first unit power play because of his play.
Too many turnovers in this tournament, and instead of making a simple pass to maintain possession he skys or it shoots it off the glass.
Not liking his game in this tournament.
Too many turnovers in this tournament, and instead of making a simple pass to maintain possession he skys or it shoots it off the glass.
Not liking his game in this tournament.
1Gold Standard
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- Jun 13, 2012
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I thought he played 1 good game, the 2nd game of the tourney...but it's been going off the rails ever since that...
Fabbro has been a lot better.
sergejean
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- Dec 11, 2007
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From what I've seen of him (tv and videos) he doesn't seem to process the game at a high enough speed to become a top pairing defenseman in the NHL. To me his upside is second pairing, which is not bad at all but not what I would be aiming for if I was to pick top 5 or even top 10.
The Winter Soldier
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I have been waiting for him to come on, all year. But he hasn't. There were red flags why he was passed over by a weak D depth Team Canada at the WJC.
To me he looks like a more mobile Phaneuf, that is less physical. Now Dion is good as a 2nd pairing D man. But first pairing, I would not put him or Chychrun in that category from what I have seen.
He is only 18 though, so nothing is written in stone. But there are concerns for me.
Just to add to this, Bogosian was already built like a tank at 18. I think a lot of GM's think "he has the size and athletics to be in the NHL", but fail to realize that some kids need extra time to build their hockey IQ and fine tune their talents.
The majority the progression of hockey IQ and skills are developed prior to the NHL (obviously players still progress in the early stages of their careers but not as exponentially) because they are able to make mistakes at the lower ranks. At the NHL level, these traits are either fine tuned with experience and exposed.
I think a great example of this is the next generational player. McDavid as a 16 year old in Erie was fantastic. Everyone knew that he was going to be a top pick and play in the NHL at 18. If you recall at the World Juniors ( I use this as an example as this is when most people caught McDavid) the progression made from 2014 to 2015 was astronomical. In 2014 he could see the lanes open up for him but couldn't create. He learnt from his play and in in 2015, he figured how to exploit them and as a result was dominant player.
Now back to Chychrun, I think most people agree that he is going to be an NHL player. I personally don't see a franchise defensemen when watching him (tbh I get a Ryan Whitney sense), but I do see the potential of being a good #2 or a very good #3 but he is raw in terms of hockey IQ. He needs more time to develop before stepping into the NHL. He is a year behind Ekblad at the same age in terms of mental development. This isn't a slight against Chychrun, Ekblad had already played three seasons (to Chychrun's two thus far) of junior hockey prior to being drafted.
Steve Kournianos
@thedraftanalyst
He hasn't had a good tournament points-wise but he's been excellent in his own end. If you watch the film and analyze it, you'll see he's covered up a ton for out-of-position teammates. He made a horrid turnover in one game, but other than that he's been shutting everybody else down or speeding the puck up ice.
Just remember that you dont need to put up points to have a good tournament. This was the same rational people used with Hanifin and the 2015 WJCs.
Canada has given up six goals in five games. Chychrun's a key part of that on the top pairing.
He's going to drop to 4th in our April rankings but be careful saying Fabbro's better. Recency at its finest. Then you might as well say Fabbro's better than Sergachev if you're going to uses the last 5 games as a barometer.
Just remember that you dont need to put up points to have a good tournament. This was the same rational people used with Hanifin and the 2015 WJCs.
Canada has given up six goals in five games. Chychrun's a key part of that on the top pairing.
He's going to drop to 4th in our April rankings but be careful saying Fabbro's better. Recency at its finest. Then you might as well say Fabbro's better than Sergachev if you're going to uses the last 5 games as a barometer.
I was never Chychurn's fan. I thought Fabbro was always underrated for playing in the BCHL, glad people see it now. The game just doesn't come natural for Chychurn IMO, he gets stuck a lot and doesn't know when he should just pull back and reset instead of trying to force the play. Not very good instincts IMO, slow thinker as well. He'll do good in the regular season but is he a defenceman you can with a Cup with? Not sure about that when the speed and intensity picks up.
He has solid tools, but I want defenceman who are confident and are very good at passing out of the defensive zone, and decision-making. That's how you create offence and what makes a good defenceman, being stuck in your own zone with a turnover or a bad play is how you lose games. That being said, Chychurn can improve on this game and if you pair him with a good PMD, that could be a great pairing. Opens more space for Chychurn to skate and pass.
He has solid tools, but I want defenceman who are confident and are very good at passing out of the defensive zone, and decision-making. That's how you create offence and what makes a good defenceman, being stuck in your own zone with a turnover or a bad play is how you lose games. That being said, Chychurn can improve on this game and if you pair him with a good PMD, that could be a great pairing. Opens more space for Chychurn to skate and pass.
To be fair I noticed this a while ago, and only mentioned it like a month ago, had to prevent you from taking credit.
http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=115810499&postcount=616
I think Chychrun is still a top 10 pick, but it just goes to show how unpredictable junior players' development is. As a 16 yo Chychrun was maybe the best defense prospect I've ever seen at that age. This year he just hasn't developed at all, and seems to be trying to play beyond his abilities leading to errors and lowered confidence.
Anthony Mauro
DraftBuzz Hockey
DraftBuzz Hockey's FEB submission for Brock Otten's Midseason Media/Scout Top 10 for 2016:
It's looking like not much has changed, and with a packed house from #4-#14 that's not a good thing for Chychrun. One thing in his favor is Sarnia's deployment of him late, especially on the PP, as it got him more involved and producing.
It's looking like not much has changed, and with a packed house from #4-#14 that's not a good thing for Chychrun. One thing in his favor is Sarnia's deployment of him late, especially on the PP, as it got him more involved and producing.
Breakers
Make Mirrored Visors Legal Again
I don't think any of this years top D will be as good as last years top 3
Provorov, Hannifin, and Werenski are so solid
I can't say the same about his crop.
Provorov, Hannifin, and Werenski are so solid
I can't say the same about his crop.
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