KingsFan7824
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But another block of a younger guy. Another spot they won't get. Danault and Arvidsson did block guys though.
Speculation: LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread part VII
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But another block of a younger guy. Another spot they won't get. Danault and Arvidsson did block guys though.
Axl Rhoadz
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KingsHockey24
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I was originally going to reply saying JAD would've made an ideal 4C but then realized Lizzo is only 2 years older so I kept my mouth shut.
Axl Rhoadz
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Yah the guy still has a face full of acne but it’s time for him to relinquish his spot to a ‘young’ guy, lol
That's HFboards for you
Anything less than winning the cup every year with 20 rookies is unacceptable on here
KingsFan7824
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Axl Rhoadz
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Herby
How could Blake have known?
Draft position and age, in that order. It's why despite Kupari being younger and playing better this season many would prefer to see Vilardi over him because they are more invested in him due to being a higher pick.
Lizotte is not a kid anymore in hockey terms, he is a solid veteran 4th line center who turns 25 later this year, he is in his stone prime. If former high picks taken 2,5, 11, and 20 in their draft years can't beat out a 5'7 UDFA next season in their 3rd, 4th, 6th and 5th years in the organization that is on those players, not on Blake Lizotte blocking them.
Lizotte is not a kid anymore in hockey terms, he is a solid veteran 4th line center who turns 25 later this year, he is in his stone prime. If former high picks taken 2,5, 11, and 20 in their draft years can't beat out a 5'7 UDFA next season in their 3rd, 4th, 6th and 5th years in the organization that is on those players, not on Blake Lizotte blocking them.
Well theres a bit more to it then that. JAD did beat out Lizotte last year pretty much the whole season if I remember correctly. This year Lizotte had a bad camp and was beat out by Byfield and Vilardi. He only made the team because of injuries and the demotion of Vilardi. He even started the season slow.
Then out of nowhere he really cemented himself as a great player for the team. Hes earned it though I think all or most of the other guys at 25 years old will be better players.
I do not prefer Vilardi over Kupari.
I like both of them on Kings.
Do you really believe that people like Vilardi due to being a higher pick only?
You do not see how much better player Vilardi become this year?
In my view these 2 players will be very important integral parts of Kings contending for titles.
KingsFan7824
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You don't blame Lizotte for anything. It's the same with this roster fighting for a playoff spot. Lizotte doesn't care about whoever is trying to take his job, and the players on the roster today, whoever they are, don't care about an unknown 18 year old, or even what the roster should look like 3 years from now.
However, if people want management to play, the right young guys, then they can't block them with the wrong guys. Kopitar didn't really win a spot, they dealt Belanger to open a spot for him. It was at the end of camp, so DL had his bases covered in case Kopitar wasn't ready, but everyone pretty much knew he was a finished product by the time he came to LA. They traded Visnovsky when they knew they had Doughty. They never played a game together.
Management may be incorrect in their assessment, but the way they built the roster for this season, says they did not see the right young guys as being ready. Even Kaliyev wasn't really projected to be on the team this year. And he's been on the 4th line pretty much all year.
Brown and AA are the easy choices to let go. Then you have your choices to make with Lemieux, Andersson, and Grundstrom. Of course any potential trades.
Then the big one; the minutes for a 35 year old. If they finally go down, you'd think Byfield would benefit from it. Unless TM plays Danault 30min a night.
Herby
How could Blake have known?
Gabe Vilardi is in his 5th year in the organization, he turns 23 in a few months and has yet to establish himself as anything more than an AHL/NHL tweener. He looks like basically every other AAAA player has looked at the same age.
I know you think I am crazy for saying Vilardi and Turcotte have been disappointing prospects, we just have wildly different opinions on when players should be contributing and how important being able to break through to the NHL is.
I place value on whether a guy has made the NHL because it’s by far the hardest obstacle. I don’t care what a guy does at 22 in the AHL if he can’t even come close to matching it in the NHL.
You think Vilardi will be an important cog in winning titles in the future, I don’t think he will be in the organization at this time next year. We will have to see who is right.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
Plays important youth only in minimal roles and not at all on the PP
Benches them preventing them from playing the most important games of the year in the NHL OR AHL
Why aren't the youth developing?
Blake:
Benches them preventing them from playing the most important games of the year in the NHL OR AHL
Why aren't the youth developing?
Blake:
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
And lizotte isn't blocking Vilardi/Byfield, he's the checking 4C, sure maybe 3C, but these are scoring line guys, i'ts a different role, they're not going to 'beat' lizotte for the 12 min depth role and forcing them to is exactly what's wrong with development.
Herby
How could Blake have known?
Danault and Arvidsson are playing roles that 3-4 years ago I’m sure Blake believed would be played by his picks, but that hasn’t materialized and props to Blake, this team is Anaheim or SJ level with Byfield and Vilardi being the 2C and 2RW.
Again, there is no way PA is a King if any of Vilardi, Turcotte (these 2 especially) or QB had shown more since being drafted.
I know I might be in the minority on this, but I'd prefer it if they WERE Anaheim/San Jose level with those two. If they aren't going to be the pieces that work, then you've got to keep trying until you find them. At a certain point you have to stop relying on Kopitar and the other older guys to carry the team. If that means sucking for another three years, you do it. You've got two real options:
1. You continue to battle to get a 6-8 seed in the playoffs and do nothing but get thrashed. Kopitar and Doughty and Quick and, at that point, Danualt are either retiring or past their prime. You've got a couple of youngish players in AK and Bjornfot who have played a handful of meaningful games but never got the chance to take over the team so they've stagnated and become middle of the road guys who chip in from time to time. Byfield and Turcotte have flashes but aren't the guy(s) you wanted/thought they were. You now suck and start over again with no foundation or clear road to success.
2. You suck this year and next year and maybe the year afterwards. You get a couple more high end caliber draft picks (possibly even a guy like Bedard) and hope that they're going to be the guys to succeed and carry the team. It allows Byfield and Turcotte to slot in a little lower, with less expectations but still above what their place on the team would suggest they are. You still have a young team though so you fill it out with vets that complement the youth and how have experience going deep into the playoffs but you don't need to make or break the team. Guys from the Blues and Lightning will be moving into those roles in the next 2-3 years. Nab them in free agency with the promise of a larger contract that we can afford and an extra year. Think Willie Mitchell type deals.
I know it's not that simple because ownership, but we're starting to get very very close to that black hole again and I honestly don't see it not happening. Too many obvious signs of that.
King'sPawn
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I think you're putting unfair and unreasonable expectations on Vilardi, who missed years of crucial development time while several were trying to figure out what was wrong with him.
He only started playing hockey on a regular basis for half of the 2019-20 season since drafted. So, he's really only had 2.5 years while also overcoming what could have been a career-ending issue if they didn't figure it out.
He may or may not be a cog in the Kings future. I think he has the ability and brain to do it. It's apparent by how well he controls the puck and the chances he creates.
But I think he's faced a lot of obstacles, and forcing him to be the 2C when he struggled last year while the Kings expected to make the playoffs this year, that wouldn't have been fair to anyone. Which is why Danault was brought in - he was perfect for reducing Kopitar's minutes while acting as a buffer for the prospects (namely Turcotte, Vilardi, Byfield).
The problem is that good insulation never occurred. The skilled players were loaded onto the top-6 and the scraps were thrown to the rest, all in the name of "learn2check".
If the skill were spread more evenly, at least among the top 9, the Kings could have:
- reduced Kopitar's minutes so he's not being run ragged
- give the prospects more talent to work with to start growing into the responsibility of being a scorer.
Moore and Iafallo are great waterbug players who can score (I know Iafallo's struggling now, but this is an uncharacteristically bad cold streak).
Danault has made EVERY PLAYER excel on his line. Everyone plays better with him than without him. Yet NONE of the prospects have had regular time with him.
There was opportunity to bring the prospects along in a bigger role just to see what they are capable of, and the Kings passed on it this season.
And frankly it's incomprehensible that prospects are still being pointed at here like they're the problem.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
Even if they were, that wouldn't be an indictment of their development unless you're being a hypocrite.
You're a huge Zegras fan, and Anaheim is in the tank despite where he is. Jack Hughes, anyone? Caufield, both bad and great version, neither has had an impact on MTL, but he couldnt' do jack shit until he got some confidence and minutes from the org.
And on the flipside, you're a huge Boldy fan--he's on a successful team getting 2W minutes. And you already know about Beniers, of course.
Meanwhile, Lafreniere was getting top-6 time on an eastern contender despite lack of production performance. Ditto Kakko. Kirby Dach, same scenario, but basement team now.
Whether the roles are played by the picks or not is pretty clearly independent of prospect ability and development, no? These guys are still getting their minutes because their coaches know they need big touches, offensive/PP time, and puck rhythm regardless of how their teams are doing and your suggestion that none of these prospects are carrying the Kings so its their own fault has no basis in reality around the NHL. They always at least get a shot and deployment commensurate with their skillsets.
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On some level, I'm glad there is somewhat of a meritocracy and that the Kings are showing the kids that you need to perform to get into games and that nothing will be handed to them.
If Byfield, with all his size, skill, etc can't beat out Lizotte for a spot in the lineup, then that's on Byfield - not the development staff, not the coaches, not anyone else. God knows he was given equal opportunity as Lizotte to cement his spot. And I've seen enough games to know that at this moment in time Lizotte gives the Kings a better chance of winning games. That's a separate conversation from "should Byfield be developing in the AHL". I guess the counter to that is that he's still around Danault, Kopi, etc when this pressure packed playoff push is happening.
On the blue line, Bjornfot has been awful and I'm glad Moveare is in. Similarly, I'm glad Spence is playing over Stetcher. The players who give the team the best chance of winning are playing regardless of draft status or veteran status.
If Byfield, with all his size, skill, etc can't beat out Lizotte for a spot in the lineup, then that's on Byfield - not the development staff, not the coaches, not anyone else. God knows he was given equal opportunity as Lizotte to cement his spot. And I've seen enough games to know that at this moment in time Lizotte gives the Kings a better chance of winning games. That's a separate conversation from "should Byfield be developing in the AHL". I guess the counter to that is that he's still around Danault, Kopi, etc when this pressure packed playoff push is happening.
On the blue line, Bjornfot has been awful and I'm glad Moveare is in. Similarly, I'm glad Spence is playing over Stetcher. The players who give the team the best chance of winning are playing regardless of draft status or veteran status.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
This is an approach entirely focused on 2022 at the expense of the future.
pick scoring center like a depth checker isn't 'merit', it's square peg-round holing a prospect and when it doesn't fit you throw away the square peg instead of finding the right fit.
Can you imagine Edmonton trying McDavid out on line 3 and holding PP time hostage until he showed he could check effectively? Of course not, because its' a f***ing hilariously stupid thought.
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Sol
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He looked better than Most of the rookies. Anyone who remembers preseason will remember how good he was on the PP. amazing passes and creating chances nonstop on the PP. very very creative player. But yet again The Kings love botching Eastern Europeans it seems
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