Value of: Kakko to Colorado

[Hunter Gathers]

talk about low targets... if we are going after this kind of players, Id rather get Poolparty than Kakko...

Why would you want an older, shittier version of Kakko . . . ? Like, I mean, Poolparty is pure waiver fodder (literally) whereas Kakko is at least a functional NHL player.

That's an odd take. Kakko is bad, but he's far superior to Poolparty.

3rd round pick. I think that balances out past performance and future potential quite nicely.

Pass. I see no reason to trade him for a mid-round pick. Either a 2nd round pick or a reclamation project (think former 1st rounder).

I'd also consider a high-ceiling, low-floor prospect (perhaps a rising mid-round guy).

No real interest in pure picks.

 

[FerrisRox]

Avs rumored to have interest in him during the draft, and the Avs are the kind of team that 'always get their guy'

With Nichuskin likely gone and Kakko's name in rumors, I wouldn't be surprised to see the Avs target him as a cheap Nuke-lite reclamation project 2.0.

However, I'm not sure these teams make great trading partners. I know the Rangers aren't in a rush to move him, but he appears to be stagnating on their roster so maybe it's better to move on (especially if they come up short this season)

Curious what the Ranger's ask would be and if the Avs have the pieces to match it

Why would Nichuskin "likely" be gone?

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

That's a strange td. ake. I felt that way before both players actually played for the Habs.

well thats what i meant, at the time of the trade you were gambling pretty hard on potential/turning their careers around.

But 13th + 3rd for dach is prob close to an over payment now, and essentially 2 late 1sts for newhook seems rather generous still.

 

[Habsrule]

I actually feel like the habs over paid for both dach and newhook

Yes and no.

Dach cost Romanov and a 3rd. I loved Romanov but second pair defensive defencemen can be easier to find than second line centers with size.

Newhook cost a late 1st and an early 2nd. Realistically each pick is a 50/50 if they will be as productive as what Newhook is.

Both were calculated risks.

 

[CanadienShark]

well thats what i meant, at the time of the trade you were gambling pretty hard on potential/turning their careers around.

But 13th + 3rd for dach is prob close to an over payment now, and essentially 2 late 1sts for newhook seems rather generous still.

Gotcha. I think I was pretty pissed off at both trades, at the time. Shows what I know.

I'm A-Ok with both trades now and what we gave up for both players. That's where we disagree, I think.

 

[SEALBound]

Pass. I see no reason to trade him for a mid-round pick. Either a 2nd round pick or a reclamation project (think former 1st rounder).

I'd also consider a high-ceiling, low-floor prospect (perhaps a rising mid-round guy).

No real interest in pure picks.

That's fair. Kakko might serve better as a Rangers reclamation project. I don't see a lot of teams wanting to give up a 2nd round pick for him unless it's a late 2nd or if they have multiple 2nds. Or unless there's something else coming back from the Rangers.

The swap for another 1st round prospect who has struggled is another good suggestion. Course, Kakko is a RFA and his qualifying offer is $2.4mil. I'm right on the fence about whether or not he's worth that. I think if you're not up against the cap, sure. That's about right for a bottom 6 wing good for 20-30pts a season. At the same time, if you're cap-strapped and looking for value, Kakko ain't it.

If it's to the Penguins, I would be tempted to offer Poulin.

 

[dirtydanglez]

not sure nuke is realistically gone. trading him might be difficult, buy-out is very unlikely, i dont think the league can terminate the contract until he violates stage 3. it's possible but i think the avs are 'stuck' with him for the time being.

 

[Perratrooper]

Yep. Trade should only be done around reclamation projects. Period. I’d take a high ceiling low floor guy (Kakko has a bottom 6 ceiling but is a playable NHLer) on a flyer to see if the team can do something.


What’s the scouting report (30K foot view)

I’m not close to most qualified Avs fan “scout”, but OO is a winger (who has played some centre) who brings an elite shot and if he were to make the NHL looks to be an Andre Burakovsky type. Decent speed, great shot, but a parameter player. From reports I’ve read he’s started to play a bit more of a rounded game and has shown willingness to try and improve. He has top 6 upside, but COVID shortened seasons and injuries have somewhat stunted his growth.

He went from putting up 20 points in 63 games in his first AHL season to 20 in 39 games. I would expect another jump for next year.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

That's fair. Kakko might serve better as a Rangers reclamation project. I don't see a lot of teams wanting to give up a 2nd round pick for him unless it's a late 2nd or if they have multiple 2nds. Or unless there's something else coming back from the Rangers.

The swap for another 1st round prospect who has struggled is another good suggestion. Course, Kakko is a RFA and his qualifying offer is $2.4mil. I'm right on the fence about whether or not he's worth that. I think if you're not up against the cap, sure. That's about right for a bottom 6 wing good for 20-30pts a season. At the same time, if you're cap-strapped and looking for value, Kakko ain't it.

If it's to the Penguins, I would be tempted to offer Poulin.

I actually think he's just worn out his welcome, here. Not that he's a bad guy or anything (far from it; zero issues in the locker room). I think it's just best for both parties to find a new home for him.

I wouldn't trade him in division unless it was for an overpay, though. I can't see the Pens being a partner, here.

I’m not close to most qualified Avs fan “scout”, but OO is a winger (who has played some centre) who brings an elite shot and if he were to make the NHL looks to be an Andre Burakovsky type. Decent speed, great shot, but a parameter player. From reports I’ve read he’s started to play a bit more of a rounded game and has shown willingness to try and improve. He has top 6 upside, but COVID shortened seasons and injuries have somewhat stunted his growth.

He went from putting up 20 points in 63 games in his first AHL season to 20 in 39 games. I would expect another jump for next year.

Sounds like someone I'd consider. That's the route I'd prefer to go, anyway, if the Rangers trade Kakko.

 

[Perratrooper]

I actually think he's just worn out his welcome, here. Not that he's a bad guy or anything (far from it; zero issues in the locker room). I think it's just best for both parties to find a new home for him.

I wouldn't trade him in division unless it was for an overpay, though. I can't see the Pens being a partner, here.



Sounds like someone I'd consider. That's the route I'd prefer to go, anyway, if the Rangers trade Kakko.

Send the paper work, can always balance with a late pick if required.

 

[bernmeister]

Avs rumored to have interest in him during the draft, and the Avs are the kind of team that 'always get their guy'

With Nichuskin likely gone and Kakko's name in rumors, I wouldn't be surprised to see the Avs target him as a cheap Nuke-lite reclamation project 2.0.

However, I'm not sure these teams make great trading partners. I know the Rangers aren't in a rush to move him, but he appears to be stagnating on their roster so maybe it's better to move on (especially if they come up short this season)

Curious what the Ranger's ask would be and if the Avs have the pieces to match it

Realistically it shouldn’t take too much. Rangers will not be realistic.

stop the bs x 2

no sacred cows
but most guys are not traded unless there is a profit rationale to do so
AND
the level of profit must not be nominal if the asset either already has OR has signif upside potential

reward must be commensurate with risk, and beyond if profit is enuf to consider where asset is desirable

KK is not a star
he is checks off several boxes for physical upside
he is not a finisher, not yet
but he has demonstrated from earliest times of original kid line
he was productive where he has chem w/linemates
then, Chytil and an underdeveloped LaF who then could not skate

We NOW see he DOES have chemistry w/Cuylle + Chytil
though injuries to both Chytil + KK have interrupted that progression

There is no reason, ZERO, for Rs to accommodate and sell you KK on the cheap.
They are better off seeing how the new kid line works, and if Chytil is again out, for them to try again w/a new pivot. I am personally bullish on Edstrom

So Avs do not show any commodity which Rs can get at a price that works.
Hence no deal

 

[Freaky Styley]

Why would Nichuskin "likely" be gone?

Where have you been? He's suspended 6 months. It's likely the Avs pursue contract termination if possible, and if there are signs he will be fit again to play in the league is my guess they trade him before his cap hits the books.

I think the bridge is burnt and with uncertainty around Landeskog the Avs can't afford to have another $6M tied up in a 'what if'. IMO they use that money in the offseason and move on from him

 

[FerrisRox]

Where have you been? He's suspended 6 months. It's likely the Avs pursue contract termination if possible, and if there are signs he will be fit again to play in the league is my guess they trade him before his cap hits the books.

I think the bridge is burnt and with uncertainty around Landeskog the Avs can't afford to have another $6M tied up in a 'what if'. IMO they use that money in the offseason and move on from him

Where have I been? I've been here, in the real world, where a suspension doesn't mean a player is suddenly "gone." They can't "terminate" his contract and I don't see what possible reason they would have to trade him away when he's at his lowest value.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Send the paper work, can always balance with a late pick if required.

It's very rare to find deals where both teams can be like, "Sure, why the f*** not?"

 

[pld459666]

Personally, Kakko needs to go somewhere there is no immediate need to win sort of pressure tjat will allow his game to mature and grow.

Get him to SJ and let him marinate with that franchise.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Personally, Kakko needs to go somewhere there is no immediate need to win sort of pressure tjat will allow his game to mature and grow.

Get him to SJ and let him marinate with that franchise.

I think being united with Rantanen could be good for him in Colorado. One of the few "win now" teams I think Kakko could do well with.

 

[Vivaldi]

Kakko + Goodrow for Nuke lol.

If Nuke becomes clean he's virtually everything New York needs in one player and he was GPG+ these playoffs before the suspension. Its a gamble for sure but they gambled on Avery after his Dallas implosion. They're a pretty disciplined organization with intense management, culture and demanding fans to hold him accountable, and moving away from where the negative routine is helps.

 

[Scintillating10]

Avs rumored to have interest in him during the draft, and the Avs are the kind of team that 'always get their guy'

With Nichuskin likely gone and Kakko's name in rumors, I wouldn't be surprised to see the Avs target him as a cheap Nuke-lite reclamation project 2.0.

However, I'm not sure these teams make great trading partners. I know the Rangers aren't in a rush to move him, but he appears to be stagnating on their roster so maybe it's better to move on (especially if they come up short this season)

Curious what the Ranger's ask would be and if the Avs have the pieces to match it

He's big mobile player, decent puck control. Just not the player he was drafted at. Probably third liner

 

[elmaco]

Just take him.

Gladly

 

[AslanRH]

I think being united with Rantanen could be good for him in Colorado. One of the few "win now" teams I think Kakko could do well with.

I'd rather he model after Lehkonen than Rantanen.

 

[Freaky Styley]

Where have I been? I've been here, in the real world, where a suspension doesn't mean a player is suddenly "gone." They can't "terminate" his contract and I don't see what possible reason they would have to trade him away when he's at his lowest value.

There's plenty of reasons- they can't rely on him when they need him most. Two strikes and your out - look at Kadri in Toronto. Everyone wants Nuke to figure out his life but the team can't live with that uncertainty on their books. They will try to move on every way they can if they can't LTIR him.

They might be stuck with him but there's enough loopholes and creativity that can solve that issue. Trading him frees up 6M+ of cap space that would otherwise be in limbo, regardless of the return. It's an unfortunate situation but it's still their best move at this point. Otherwise maybe they see if he can come back and play and then move him near the deadline but I really doubt they go into another playoff run with this possibility hanging over their head. He's done as an Av IMO

 

[Synergy27]

Just stopping by to say that being a Ranger fan sucks.

See ya.

 

[FerrisRox]

There's plenty of reasons- they can't rely on him when they need him most. Two strikes and your out - look at Kadri in Toronto.

So you're example for why they should trade him is the disastrous deal that saw the Maple Leafs turn Nazem Kadri into a year of Tyson Barrie and Alexander Kerfoot?!?

 

[T_Cage]

His 2.4m QO is the hangup for me. If he is not qualified by NYR I would be all over a cheap reclamation deal (as would I imagine several teams)

Still worth something at 2.4, but I dunno what. He becomes a luxury and not a need at that price. Maybe Utah that has an abundance of 2nds and cap would do a 2nd for Kakko + 4th?

 

[LTIR]

Add KK to the Puljujarvi, Kotkaneimi, Juolevi, Vesalainen bucket.