Player Discussion Jonathan Drouin----Nothing burger edition.

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salbutera

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Sep 10, 2019
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I 'd like to see him take over games like Kovalev could. I'm not holding my breath. :surrender
At 24 Kovalev was as consistent at taking over games as Drouin was...like last night.

Fans seem to only remember 31-year old Kovalev Gainey acquired and his stellar 2007-2008 season at age 34...
 

azcanuck

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Jan 14, 2014
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Loved Kovalev but he was notorious for being “asleep at the wheel” & taking games off. He was Great in the playoffs & especially when the opposition woke him up with a big hit.....? JD doesn’t show that type of ability.
Drouin is a young man who is now wealthy beyond his wildest dreams playing hockey? His battle now exists within the 6 inches between his ears. He has already been paid for “how he plays”?

Fans want more. So what? Jo has to want to be more, internal fortitude if you will. IMHO.
Kovalev? Stickhandle around 7 guys and gain 3 feet of ice. He was the Harlem Globetrotters of hockey.
 

nhlfan9191

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Aug 4, 2010
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I want to smack this kid upside the head. I watch him play last night and I see a kid with real talent and effort. If he could only put it together “consistently.” God he frustrates me. The talent is there. He has a mental block that appears like no other.
 
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nhlfan9191

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Kovalev? Stickhandle around 7 guys and gain 3 feet of ice. He was the Harlem Globetrotters of hockey.

Kovalev had a shot from the right circle that was terrifying. He also had skill and the ability to turn it on as a power forward when he was on. He was inconsistent like Drouin but don’t even try to compare the two. Kovalev was in another league putting it litely.
 

Adriatic

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Feb 27, 2004
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Kovalev had a shot from the right circle that was terrifying. He also had skill and the ability to turn it on as a power forward when he was on. He was inconsistent like Drouin but don’t even try to compare the two. Kovalev was in another league putting it litely.

Couldn't agree more. People tend to forget Kovy was insanely strong too. He was 6'2 220lbs strong as an ox. He's arguably top 5-10 all-time in terms of skills/stick handling with the puck. Drouin and Kovalev should not be in the same conversation whatever their consistency levels.
 

salbutera

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Kovalev had a shot from the right circle that was terrifying. He also had skill and the ability to turn it on as a power forward when he was on. He was inconsistent like Drouin but don’t even try to compare the two. Kovalev was in another league putting it litely.
Stylistic points don’t mean much, there’s no questioning Kovalev was the closest thing the Habs have had to a pure power forward since Richer and his half wall capability on the PP is missing big time, but it’s about production per $ efficiency in a hard cap league - at 24 years of age Kovalev produced the same PPG rate as Drouin surrounded by far greater offensive talent in a much more wide open league with the delta between the top players and bottom feeders far greater than today.
 

nhlfan9191

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Stylistic points don’t mean much, there’s no questioning Kovalev was the closest thing the Habs have had to a pure power forward since Richer and his half wall capability on the PP is missing big time, but it’s about production per $ efficiency in a hard cap league - at 24 years of age Kovalev produced the same PPG rate as Drouin surrounded by far greater offensive talent in a much more wide open league with the delta between the top players and bottom feeders far greater than today.

Last year was the highest scoring era just shortly behind 05/06 in decades and Drouin is WAY behind Kovalev’s best with us in a much higher scoring era. Comparing these two guys is an insult. Right now at least.
 
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LaP

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Stylistic points don’t mean much, there’s no questioning Kovalev was the closest thing the Habs have had to a pure power forward since Richer and his half wall capability on the PP is missing big time, but it’s about production per $ efficiency in a hard cap league - at 24 years of age Kovalev produced the same PPG rate as Drouin surrounded by far greater offensive talent in a much more wide open league with the delta between the top players and bottom feeders far greater than today.

When Kovalev was 24 (97-98) it was the dead puck era bro. In 97-98 there was only 4 players with 90+ points in the league and two of them had exactly 90 points (Jagr, Forsberg, Gretzky and Bure were the only players with 90+ points and all of them are HOFers).

There was 14 players with 90+ points last year one of them being Point. I like Point but if he is in the HOF one day i'll eat crows.
 

salbutera

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Last year was the highest scoring era just shortly behind 05/06 in decades and Drouin is WAY behind Kovalev’s best with us in a much higher scoring era. Comparing these two guys is an insult. Right now at least.
How many points did Kovalev get at 23?
 

salbutera

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When Kovalev was 24 (97-98) it was the dead puck era bro. In 97-98 there was only 4 players with 90+ points in the league and two of them had exactly 90 points (Jagr, Forsberg, Gretzky and Bure were the only players with 90+ points and all of them are HOFers). There was 14 players with 90+ points last year one of them being POint. I like Point but if he is in the HOF one day i'll eat crows.
And some guy called Gretzky was his C who scored 90 that year for NYR bro...while Kovalev had 53 with one of the leagues worst +/-
 

CalgarySnow

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I thought Drouin was good last night, unfortunately there’s the but and that’s how long can he keep it up before he gets bored and disappears. If he keeps it up for the majority of the season I will change my opinion of him.
 
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26Mats

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I thought Drouin was good last night, unfortunately there’s the but and that’s how long can he keep it up before he gets bored and disappears. If he keeps it up for the majority of the season I will change my opinion of him.

He was playing every shift like it was his last.

Can he stustain that physically all season?

Or, is it a change in mentality that his permanent - he's just going to play this way every game?

We'll find out.
 

Kriss E

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At 24 Kovalev was as consistent at taking over games as Drouin was...like last night.

Fans seem to only remember 31-year old Kovalev Gainey acquired and his stellar 2007-2008 season at age 34...
Sure..but 24 back then was very different than 24 in today's league. Drouin would probably score 20pts back in mid 90s hockey because he'd get hooked on and manhandled.
Players get so much space to express their skills in today's league. Back in those days players literally would hook their sticks onto you and go for a ride. Not to mention, you would get slashed at least once every time you touched the puck.

Not a knock on Drouin, just saying, different realities. You can't compare. But I disagree with Kovalev's comparison to begin with, Kovy was a much more creative stickhandler. Patty Kane is the only one I would compare to Kovalev.
 

loudi94

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I watch him and think that he's a square peg and coaches are trying to stuff him in the round hole. He's an offensively gifted player, so let him be that player. Yes, he is going to f*** up and cause coaches and fans to pull their hair out, but he can also bring everyone to their feet too. 200 foot backchecking Drouin sucks.
 

digmor crusher

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Jul 11, 2009
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I disagree. There's this misconception that consistency is purely a cerebral issue, it's not, it's mostly physical. Your physical conditioning/attributes are the main driver of your effort, not your mind.

Drouin plays like he did in juniors, tries the same things. That's just how he plays and I don't see it changing. I don't think he's mentally weak.

I could search HF Boards for hours and not find a post that was not more wrong than this. And I'll tell you why.
70% of NHL players have the same skill set, skate the same speed, shoot the same velocity, same stick handling skills, and then there is the 15% elite players and 15% slugs. There is a reason why 2 players with pretty much the same skill set have different results, 1 scores 70 points, 1 40 points.

Was Gretzky the strongest player, hardest shooter, fastest skater, best stickhandler, was Sakic, was Yzerman, is Crosby, is Marchand? No. These guys are superstars because of what is between their ears. Drouins problems are 100% between his ears. Why is Gallaghers effort level 3x of what Drouins is, according to you I guess Gally is 3x in better shape than Drouin. Nonsense.
 

ECWHSWI

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Oct 27, 2006
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I could search HF Boards for hours and not find a post that was not more wrong than this. And I'll tell you why.
70% of NHL players have the same skill set, skate the same speed, shoot the same velocity, same stick handling skills, and then there is the 15% elite players and 15% slugs.
There is a reason why 2 players with pretty much the same skill set have different results, 1 scores 70 points, 1 40 points.

Was Gretzky the strongest player, hardest shooter, fastest skater, best stickhandler, was Sakic, was Yzerman, is Crosby, is Marchand? No. These guys are superstars because of what is between their ears. Drouins problems are 100% between his ears. Why is Gallaghers effort level 3x of what Drouins is, according to you I guess Gally is 3x in better shape than Drouin. Nonsense.
pulling random % from god knows where does not make you right.
 
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dackelljuneaubulis02

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Oct 13, 2012
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Sure..but 24 back then was very different than 24 in today's league. Drouin would probably score 20pts back in mid 90s hockey because he'd get hooked on and manhandled.
Players get so much space to express their skills in today's league. Back in those days players literally would hook their sticks onto you and go for a ride. Not to mention, you would get slashed at least once every time you touched the puck.

Not a knock on Drouin, just saying, different realities. You can't compare. But I disagree with Kovalev's comparison to begin with, Kovy was a much more creative stickhandler. Patty Kane is the only one I would compare to Kovalev.

Not super knowledgeable but I think pure stick-handling it's either Kovalev or Datsyuk all-time. Kovy was very frustrating because he should've been 07-08 Kovy the whole time. Just killed me that he couldn't put it together like he should. An absolute magician when he was on. Nothing more fun in hockey to me than stick-handling and no way could he be outside of any top 5 all-time puck-handling list.

When Drouin's on he's easily the most exciting Hab forward since Kovy even more than Radulov who I could kill MB for letting go. I think people short change Drouin's skill level a bit. Not being as skilled as Kovalev is just about every player who's played the game. Doesn't mean that Drouin's skill level isn't extremely high. I think he could be a superstar if he can be consistent full stop. Kid can flat out fly.
 

digmor crusher

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Jul 11, 2009
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It may be random because no one knows for sure but its close. Almost all NHL players were superstars in Junior, a 50 goal scorer in Junior can be a 3rd line plug in the NHL., why, because they have the talent but they don't have what it takes between the ears. I'm sorry but anyone who knows anything about hockey will know this. Unfortunately the only discussion on here is negativity and bashing for the most part. Where does my knowledge come from, 50 years of watching hockey, reading the Hockey News for decades, pouring over stats for decades, it sure doesn't come from here.
 

Doc McKenna

A new era 2021
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And some guy called Gretzky was his C who scored 90 that year for NYR bro...while Kovalev had 53 with one of the leagues worst +/-
Maybe if you had been old enough to watch the games you would stop this extremely dumb analogy. Kovy was super lazy 'enigma' but he could control the entire game whne he was on. I have never seen drouin play anywhere near this level. In fact few players ever could play like him when he decided it was a game to play in.

Look up the Darcy tucker forearm shiver or when he dropped his glove or helmet in I think the bruins games. Literally no one could strip the puck from him.

I didnt even much like him because of the inconsistency but boy oh boy the talent was there to break a game on any given night...without help from any team mates. Honestly have seen few players like him. Jagr comes to mind with good reason. Jagr was what kovy would have been if he wasnt distracted from everything else in life. Guy was way too smart to just be a hockey player, so it was something he did to earn a living.
 
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Kriss E

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May 3, 2007
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Not super knowledgeable but I think pure stick-handling it's either Kovalev or Datsyuk all-time. Kovy was very frustrating because he should've been 07-08 Kovy the whole time. Just killed me that he couldn't put it together like he should. An absolute magician when he was on. Nothing more fun in hockey to me than stick-handling and no way could he be outside of any top 5 all-time puck-handling list.

When Drouin's on he's easily the most exciting Hab forward since Kovy even more than Radulov who I could kill MB for letting go. I think people short change Drouin's skill level a bit. Not being as skilled as Kovalev is just about every player who's played the game. Doesn't mean that Drouin's skill level isn't extremely high. I think he could be a superstar if he can be consistent full stop. Kid can flat out fly.

I'm not short changing Drouin, I agree, he was drafted 3rd ov because he had superstar level skills. Just terrific vision and playmaking abilities. He's just never really been able to put it together, he still tries to play way too much like he did in juniors. He hasn't developed his game well enough.
 

Kriss E

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May 3, 2007
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Jeddah
I could search HF Boards for hours and not find a post that was not more wrong than this. And I'll tell you why.
70% of NHL players have the same skill set, skate the same speed, shoot the same velocity, same stick handling skills, and then there is the 15% elite players and 15% slugs. There is a reason why 2 players with pretty much the same skill set have different results, 1 scores 70 points, 1 40 points.

Was Gretzky the strongest player, hardest shooter, fastest skater, best stickhandler, was Sakic, was Yzerman, is Crosby, is Marchand? No. These guys are superstars because of what is between their ears. Drouins problems are 100% between his ears. Why is Gallaghers effort level 3x of what Drouins is, according to you I guess Gally is 3x in better shape than Drouin. Nonsense.

First, let's get something clear. Everything you do is ''between the ears''. The motor cortexes in your brain control movement. The only thing that's not linked to the brain when it comes to movement are reflexes. So..skating, shooting, passing, stickhandling, decision making, etc...99% of the things involved in sports (and life) happen ''between the ears''.

What I disagree with is the notion that Drouin, for example, performs well on/off due to an unwillingness to compete harder. I think it's more of a physical aspect and I say this because I've worked in the field of fitness and performance for over a decade. Competing at 100%....100% of the time, is not something everyone can just do ''if they set their minds to it''. That's an old saying that's just utter garbage.
Do you know anything about performance and recovery? How do you know how Drouin's body reacts to ''x'' amount of physical stress through a few games vs Gallagher's. Do you know their sleeping patterns? Nutritional habits and how much they use that to imcrease their recovery?

Take Lance Armstrong for instance. He dominated his sport. Now, everybody knows he was using PEDs but then, we also know all the guys behind him were also using the same. So what gives? Well maybe he was just physically better prepared both through training and/or genetically predisposed to have this advantage. Don't agree..Well, listen to Dr. Peter Attia talk about it here:


Yes, it's still just his opinion, but he has it based off research he has done and continuous to do on performance. So maybe the guys fans love to pile on because they give inconsistent efforts aren't doing it because they're lazy or lack compete level, and it's more of a physical thing.

Btw, don't take this the wrong way but if you want to have a strong post/argument, don't fill it up with completely fictional percentages.
 
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