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John Tavares Discussion

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Completely hypothetical because of the NMC that JT probably wouldn't waive....

But what do you think it would take as an add for the Leafs to do this deal below?

To Leafs: Colin White + ????
To Sens: JT, after his bonus is paid this season.

The idea would be that you buy out White after the deal ($875K/year for 6 years) and use the $10M cap savings to replace JT with a big name UFA.

Sens are asking you to swallow a lot of cash by paying the bonus, hence the add from us.
 
ZubMeUp said:
Completely hypothetical because of the NMC that JT probably wouldn't waive....

But what do you think it would take as an add for the Leafs to do this deal below?

To Leafs: Colin White + ????
To Sens: JT, after his bonus is paid this season.

The idea would be that you buy out White after the deal ($875K/year for 6 years) and use the $10M cap savings to replace JT with a big name UFA.

Sens are asking you to swallow a lot of cash by paying the bonus, hence the add from us.
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I'm not sure what you mean. You talk about Leafs adding something to get the Sens to take JT, but you also say "White +????" for JT. Which is it?

Ignoring the NMC, why would the notoriously cheap Sens take on that huge contract, let alone a +?

Also, we already have a "big name UFA" that's got an $11M cap hit. Do we really want to go down that same road again?
 
Jamason said:
I'm not sure what you mean. You talk about Leafs adding something to get the Sens to take JT, but you also say "White +????" for JT. Which is it?

Ignoring the NMC, why would the notoriously cheap Sens take on that huge contract, let alone a +?

Also, we already have a "big name UFA" that's got an $11M cap hit. Do we really want to go down that same road again?
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I see how the wording is confusing. I meant that the sens would add on our side. We would take on the contract because I suggested we do it after JT's bonus is paid. (which is also why I'm suggesting we need to add). We only care about real salary, not cap so much, and after that bonus is paid JT becomes a good deal in real dollars.

We're offering $10M in cap savings plus assets to the Leafs, in exchange for JT and the leafs burning a tonne of cash (paying the JT bonus plus the white buyout). Alternatively, you could just take White out of it and we would trade futures for JT, provided that bonus is paid first.

What you do with the $10M in cap savings following this deal would be up to you. Doesn't have to be a big name UFA.

And yeah, the NMC makes this a very hypothetical conversation.
 
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Lol at the cap gurus… yeah, if only JT was making 7, we’re one 4 million dollar player from the cup.

If we literally dump JT on Ottawa and only lose a million… we’ll do it better with 10 million… because we’re cap kings.
 
ZubMeUp said:
Completely hypothetical because of the NMC that JT probably wouldn't waive....

But what do you think it would take as an add for the Leafs to do this deal below?

To Leafs: Colin White + ????
To Sens: JT, after his bonus is paid this season.

The idea would be that you buy out White after the deal ($875K/year for 6 years) and use the $10M cap savings to replace JT with a big name UFA.

Sens are asking you to swallow a lot of cash by paying the bonus, hence the add from us.
Click to expand...

I think you'd have to keep Colin White for yourselves to buy out and give us a modest, no salary package including 1 unprotected first round pick if there was a Tavares deal to be had.

You get a cheap money Tavares, we get some futures assets and a UFA shopping spree with the full $11 million.
 
Stephen said:
I think you'd have to keep Colin White for yourselves to buy out and give us a modest, no salary package including 1 unprotected first round pick if there was a Tavares deal to be had.

You get a cheap money Tavares, we get some futures assets and a UFA shopping spree with the full $11 million.
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There's a win-win deal here to be had and I think that something around a 1st isn't unreasonable. No way I'm risking Bedard here though, so I would probably balk on the lack of lottery protection.

It would be an interesting trade, since the suitors for JT are limited to a few poor teams like us, and we'd both be helping each other out.

But paying that bonus gets him down into the range of $4M-$5M/year (cash) over 3 years for us, which is pretty damned tempting. His value is a bit reduced since he still has an 11M cap hit and a NMC which reduces some flexibility. But these bonus-heavy back-diving contracts are pretty savvy and give you an out for just about any contract. I wish to hell my team could afford to structure contracts like that.

If JT agreed in advance to waive, I'd probably be willing to take the guy the Leafs want at 7OA this year and deal player-for-player on July 2nd. So it might be something like Jiricek (or Kemmel or Savoie, etc.) for JT straight up if that would get it done.

Again, we're in HF fantasy land here because of the NMC.
 
just playing along, how much would cost a team to buy out JT after July 2? And how much JT would get after the buyout?
 
ZubMeUp said:
I see how the wording is confusing. I meant that the sens would add on our side. We would take on the contract because I suggested we do it after JT's bonus is paid. (which is also why I'm suggesting we need to add). We only care about real salary, not cap so much, and after that bonus is paid JT becomes a good deal in real dollars.

We're offering $10M in cap savings plus assets to the Leafs, in exchange for JT and the leafs burning a tonne of cash (paying the JT bonus plus the white buyout). Alternatively, you could just take White out of it and we would trade futures for JT, provided that bonus is paid first.

What you do with the $10M in cap savings following this deal would be up to you. Doesn't have to be a big name UFA.

And yeah, the NMC makes this a very hypothetical conversation.
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Even after we pay the bonus, he's still getting $8M per season, and not worth even that.
 
Mess said:
Tavares to Montreal for Carey Price

$11 mil out and $10 mil IN and Leafs get their #1 goalie.
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Five years ago, that would be excellent. Four years left on a 34 year old goalie with health problems is even worse than keeping Tavares.

By the way, I believe both of them have NMCs.
 
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Jamason said:
Even after we pay the bonus, he's still getting $8M per season, and not worth even that.
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Unless I'm misreading capfriendly, he gets a $7M signing bonus this year. I'm kind of assuming that is all paid on July 1, but maybe I'm off on that. But with that gone, he's only owed about $17M for the remaining three years on his deal = ~ $5.66M / year (I screwed up my math in a previous post and said 4-5M).
 
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Jamason said:
Five years ago, that would be excellent. Four years left on a 34 year old goalie with health problems is even worse than keeping Tavares.

By the way, I believe both of them have NMCs.
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Benn for JT, change for the sake of change for both teams, would be a better discussion. I think JT is better and would fit the Stars slow style with everything being tip in goals. Benn is a banger, post up on pp, but not much else these days. But playoff energy.
 
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ZubMeUp said:
Unless I'm misreading capfriendly, he gets a $7M signing bonus this year. I'm kind of assuming that is all paid on July 1, but maybe I'm off on that. But with that gone, he's only owed about $17M for the remaining three years on his deal = ~ $5.66M / year (I screwed up my math in a previous post and said 4-5M).
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You may well be right, and at under $6M a season, that's not bad.

I forgot that so much is signing bonus. I know the Leafs are on the hook for the full signing bonus even if he retires, but I wonder if they are if he gets traded? At $910K per season, he's a bargain!
 
Mess said:
Tavares to Montreal for Carey Price

$11 mil out and $10 mil IN and Leafs get their #1 goalie.
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THAT'S a spicy meatball!
I don't think that would ever happen in a million years, but I can only imagine the headlines it would produce in Toronto AND Montreal, lol . . . would be epic.

But I would also say no to Price. It's too high a cap hit for a G, and I don't see anyone taking him without Montreal paying some of his money with assets coming to them in compensation . . . but who knows, maybe one day we will see pigs fly . . .
 
Your trying to pawn off Tavares. Does Ottawa really want him? They’re going in the same direction as the Leafs and why would they want an 11 mil cap hit when they have to sign some RFAs over the next couple of years and they’re going to get significant raises. He doesn’t play they way Ottawa wants to play. They have a young core and there is better options to move those guys along.
 
Racer88 said:
Even if we could get JT to waive is no trade nobody is taking him at that crazy contract
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half the league would be interested. Most of JT's contract is already paid, its a lot of Bonus'. There would be a ton of teams lined up to take time. I don;t really think the cap hit is an issue for most teams and the real dollars certainly isn't an issue . He'd be a #1 on a lot of teams. The leafs would have to take on some bad contracts to make it work.
 
Not one contending team would take on Tavares with his contract. No room for them and what GM is looking at Tavares and thinking he is good value. His skating is becoming more and more of an issue, back pressure causes him major problems as does his first 3 strides, he is swarmed as a result. Tavares wouldnt waive his no trade, for a team thats non playoffs and in need of reaching the cap floor given his 11 million is more like 7 in the final 3 years in real money. I think he must go and give the captain to Matthews and it would get ugly to move him but its the smartest thing to do, imo.
 
The key to getting Tavares to hypothetically waive his NMC for a trade is finding a destination that would work for his wife's career. Undoubtedly those places exist.
 
Boston for a 1st (that gives us 2 this year and hopefully someone is ready for the team in a year or 2) and Debrusk.

No Krejci, maybe no Bergeron, Boston would look for that deal.

Add Debrusk to Matthews/Marner or Willy line.
Now get a Kadri type 2C with some bite and spend/secure a quality goalie for the 11 mil.

Bunting - Matthews (now the C) - Marner
Debrusk - C - Nylander
Brand new 3rd line

Goalie.
 
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Trapper said:
Boston for a 1st (that gives us 2 this year and hopefully someone is ready for the team in a year or 2) and Debrusk.

No Krejci, maybe no Bergeron, Boston would look for that deal.

Add Debrusk to Matthews/Marner or Willy line.
Now get a Kadri type 2C with some bite and spend/secure a quality goalie for the 11 mil.

Bunting - Matthews (now the C) - Marner
Debrusk - C - Nylander
Brand new 3rd line

Goalie.
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Boston should be in a rebuilding phase. Why would they trade a solid 25 year old player for a fading 32 year old? Not a good trade for them, even without throwing in a first round pick.
 
Jamason said:
Boston should be in a rebuilding phase. Why would they trade a solid 25 year old player for a fading 32 year old? Not a good trade for them, even without throwing in a first round pick.
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It depends what happens with Bergeron. If he comes back, there is no rebuild.
Bergeron/Tavares/Marchand/McAvoy/Pastrnak/Hall/etc. is not rebuild.

Either way, I would be asking JT to waive.
 
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