John Tavares Discussion

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It’s great to be Johnny !!!

every time he slumps fans bend over backwards to invent fairy tales for his crap play

and then theirs poor Jack who’s getting roasted by almost everybody including his coach
The coach gets to do that because his boss has not signed Jack to a ridiculous amount of money. The high priced guys on long term contracts don't get thrown under the bus by Keefe. Its in the best interest of him to get the expensive players rolling or else he risks making Dubas look bad.
 
The coach gets to do that because his boss has not signed Jack to a ridiculous amount of money. The high priced guys on long term contracts don't get thrown under the bus by Keefe. Its in the best interest of him to get the expensive players rolling or else he risks making Dubas look bad.
True but if he doesn’t get one of his goalies rolling and we get knocked out early again there’s a good chance he’ll be kicked to the curb alongside his boss .
 
I hope you folks don’t hold your breaths on this. There’s literally 0 reason or indication that this season is some sort of make or break for anyone but the guys on the ice. The Management and coaching staff have done really good work putting pieces together and to giving them every opportunity to succeed while also leaving good pieces in the cupboard. (We do own all our top picks going forward, nobody cares about 4-6th rounders missing for one year)
If they flame out again I expect a massive core shake up but not a decimation of the front office.
It should be interesting that’s for sure. That said I hope neither of has to find out who is right. Lol
I hope they at least go deep and ultimately win the cup
 
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Can’t imagine what JT will look like in another 1-2 years. He’s going to be a 60-65 point guy for 11M for the last 2 years of his deal yiiiiikes

I loved the signing at the time. Looking back, I think we end up being a better team without ever signing him. Who knows though. Just a guess
 
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I'd be interested to see what the advance stats say but JT doesn't seem to be driving play, and seems to be succeeding of the teams generally good offensive players.

I hope he steps up for the playoffs. Cause right now after goaltending and shoring up the defence. He'd be my third concern. And a not so fixable one at that.
 
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Did anyone watch Tavares before this year who is says he lost a step skating? It has always been the biggest knock on Tavares. Whole 2nd line is struggling as a unit while the first line has left earth which makes it look even worse. The issue we face right now is Tavares needs Marner for a spark but you can’t break up the first line with how they have been playing. I still feel the pairs of Nylander Matthews and Tavares Marner mesh better. Tavares and Nylander Chemistry seems pretty non existent they still have hot periods but it’s based on skill not chemistry. Marner and Matthews are the line drivers and right now both drivers in one car driving at light speed while the other car is flint-stones running along.
An $11M player should drive a line himself and make his line mates better. That’s why they gave him $11M x 7. Breaking up the best line in the league to help him out will hurt the team more. Willy’s lack of effort recently isn’t helping and I’m sure it would hurt the 1st line more than help the second.
 
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Post Covid or not, I think part of the struggles Tavares is having is the incompatibility of his style of play with William Nylander and Alex Kerfoot. Those two can wheel and are both great shifty puckhandlers who thrive in open ice. Tavares seems to want to get into an area in the offensive zone or work the boards, slow down the flow and generate some offensive looks via the cycle. The linemates he thrived with on the Island tended to be garbage goal scorers, power forwards, etc. He had great success his first year paired with Marner, but Marner can facilitate those little area plays and touches with the puck. Nylander wants to wheel and he's happy being the trigger man.

I almost want to see Tavares with Kase and Kampf.

I'd like to see:

Kampf - Tavares - Mikheyev
Nylander - Kerfoot - Kase

I think the play styles will gel better that way, and it gives the Leafs two second lines.
 
JT is in a huge slump .. he is loosing speed by da second and it appears father time is kicking in .. I thought he would move to wing next season but it may need to occur for this seasons playoffs .. he will still be effective but this was always part of da program
 
JT had a very similar quiet stretch last year where he only scored 2 goals in 17 games. People were jumping on him and Willy at that time. Anyone else remember that dummy Steve Simmons' "Ikea" article on Willy?

Exhibit A:

17GP
2G + 10A, 12Pts
upload_2022-2-28_7-39-47.png


and then he finished the year with:

34Gp
13G + 18A, 31Pts

Him and Willy turned it on, and were arguably our best 2 players to finish the year.

People need to pump the breaks with the JT shit. He's a complete pro. He will be fine. I want him to score just as much as the next person, but are we really complaining about a dude who has 48pts in 51GP this season? on our 2nd line no less...

We don't deserve this team lol
 
JT had a very similar quiet stretch last year where he only scored 2 goals in 17 games. People were jumping on him and Willy at that time. Anyone else remember that dummy Steve Simmons' "Ikea" article on Willy?

Exhibit A:

17GP
2G + 10A, 12Pts
View attachment 511308

and then he finished the year with:

34Gp
13G + 18A, 31Pts

Him and Willy turned it on, and were arguably our best 2 players to finish the year.

People need to pump the breaks with the JT shit. He's a complete pro. He will be fine. I want him to score just as much as the next person, but are we really complaining about a dude who has 48pts in 51GP this season? on our 2nd line no less...

We don't deserve this team lol
At a cap hit of $11M, he needs to be a game changer every damn game. Right now he's not living up to that contract. Nor does he appear to be an effective Captain, however that's up for debate as none of us fans are in that Leafs' dressing room!
 
Even at their best JT and Willy don't work together, when they do have success it's because 2 highly talented players find a way to put the puck in the net, not because of any sort of chemistry.

Nylander wants to generate off the rush and control the play up high in the offensive zone, JT wants to play half court offense, grind down low and funnel pucks to the net - it just doesn't mesh.

I'd try:

XXX - Kerfoot - Nylander
XXX - Tavares - Kase

Use the Kerfoot/Nylander line in an offensive role and the Tavares line in a more defensive role.

Lots of options for the other wing:
  • a speed guy with Nylander/Kerfoot - Mikheyev, Robertson, Engvall (ideally a right shot C would be nice to fill that spot and move Kerfoot to LW)
  • A heavier guy with Tavares/Kase - Simmonds, Kampf (make it a shutdown line), even Mikheyev could work as he can use his size effectively on the forecheck.
 
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At a cap hit of $11M, he needs to be a game changer every damn game. Right now he's not living up to that contract. Nor does he appear to be an effective Captain, however that's up for debate as none of us fans are in that Leafs' dressing room!
He was never acquired to live up to an 11 million dollar contract. That was the acquisition cost of a UFA player in the prime of their career. Not sure why people find this so hard to understand.

If we wanted JT, that was the price. We wanted him, so we paid up for him. He's been near a Pt/game player since we got him, our captain, largely good on both sides of the puck, and as Steve Dangle says perfectly; JT is the "little thing King". As in, he does all the little things that largely go unnoticed and sometimes/often don't see the scoresheet.

JT will be fine. I am not denying that he can be better. He most certainly has been slumping, on both sides of the ice. But I think he deserves the benefit of the doubt. He's given us no reason to believe he can't work this out on his own.
 
Team Canada candidate pre Covid, now slowing down with Nylander reverting to his coasting self. God, Nylander must drive a coach mad. JT ain't at his best, agreed, but I think he's dealing with post Covid factors and a RWer who is playing like absolute shyte at the present. While Kerfoot is who he is, and that ain't all bad, WN is a gold standard talent that goes through periods of absolute brain dead defensive play and we're seeing that now. Were I Keefe I'd take him out to the woodshed. To little effect I'm sure. Tavares has never been a player of god given skill - that's Willy - he's had to work hard all his career and done a damn fine job of it. I'm sick of reading the crap he takes on this board. Give me JT over Nylander every day, I can count on effort with Tavares, I cannot with Nylander. This pains me to say, 'cause Nylander when on is electric, but I just can't count on him, he floats and doesn't compete on a day to day basis.
 
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At a cap hit of $11M, he needs to be a game changer every damn game. Right now he's not living up to that contract. Nor does he appear to be an effective Captain, however that's up for debate as none of us fans are in that Leafs' dressing room!

You're captain comment is absolute crap, as you've no idea what he does as captain. His cap hit was, and is, consistent with his production. He's been saddled with Nylander who has been floating the past two months. I love Nylander's talent, I hate his compete. Give Tavares a guy he can count on and things improve in the D and O zone 100%. I love WN's talent, close to if not the equal of Marner's, but his day to day effort sucks, I'd move him tomorrow.
 
took a closer look at his post covid break number

first 10 games after break - 4g - 4a = 8pts

last 12 games - 0g - 8a = 8pts and most of these were nothing 2nd assists

so considering his production was fine the first 10 games after the covid shutdown it's impossible to argue he's suffering from any covid after affects if in fact he had any covid symptoms to begin with

but this setback shouldn't stop us from continuing to come up with new and creative ways to defend Johnny and while we're brain storming we can rely on the golden oldies

-still recovering from giving birth to 2 children
-line mates are useless and letting him down
-not trying to score , concentrating on D

and my personal favorite

-he's not slow , everyone else is just fast
 
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I'd like to see:

Kampf - Tavares - Mikheyev
Nylander - Kerfoot - Kase

I think the play styles will gel better that way, and it gives the Leafs two second lines.
I’d swap kampf with Robertson and have Kampf-Engvall be the backbone of a shutdown 4th line. Mix in spezz/simmer or Kase Kerfoot mikheyev. Lots of mix and match opportunities
 
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You're captain comment is absolute crap, as you've no idea what he does as captain. His cap hit was, and is, consistent with his production. He's been saddled with Nylander who has been floating the past two months. I love Nylander's talent, I hate his compete. Give Tavares a guy he can count on and things improve in the D and O zone 100%. I love WN's talent, close to if not the equal of Marner's, but his day to day effort sucks, I'd move him tomorrow.
A quote from a Fan Sided article...

'For a player being paid $11 million a season, the Toronto Maple Leafs continue to need more from their captain. Let’s not discredit him though; he’s still projecting to score 28 goals and hit 78 points across 81 games.'

As for my absolute crap captain comment, I qualified my statement by saying that we fans do not know how he leads in the dressing room. However, I rarely ever seem to see him 'talking' to or cheering on his teammates on the bench or on the ice.
 
took a closer look at his post covid break number

first 10 games after break - 4g - 4a = 8pts

last 12 games - 0g - 8a = 8pts and most of these were nothing 2nd assists

so considering his production was fine the first 10 games after the covid shutdown it's impossible to argue he's suffering from any covid after affects if in fact he had any covid symptoms to begin with

but this setback shouldn't stop us from continuing to come up with new and creative ways to defend Johnny and while we're brain storming we can rely on the golden oldies

-still recovering from giving birth to 2 children
-line mates are useless and letting him down
-not trying to score , concentrating on D

and my personal favorite

-he's not slow , everyone else is just fast

I’m sure they’ll tell you now that post-covid symptoms happen weeks after getting over it! People here have some fetish with this guy and defend him like their jobs depended on it.
 
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A quote from a Fan Sided article...

'For a player being paid $11 million a season, the Toronto Maple Leafs continue to need more from their captain. Let’s not discredit him though; he’s still projecting to score 28 goals and hit 78 points across 81 games.'

As for my absolute crap captain comment, I qualified my statement by saying that we fans do not know how he leads in the dressing room. However, I rarely ever seem to see him 'talking' to or cheering on his teammates on the bench or on the ice.
Some of the best leaders in the history of the game were quiet.

Joe Sakic, Nicklas Lindstrom and Scott Neidemeyer instantly come to mind. Even Mats was always crucified in this market for not being a Rah-Rah type captain, only to hear countless stories of his unbelievable leadership from former teammates of his.

JT has the respect of the entire league. He's had to be a pro since he was awarded exceptional status in the O. I personally think Matthews is the true leader of this group now, but at the time JT was awarded the "C" it was likely the right call. We may doubt his abilities to lead, but I genuinely don't think there is one person in that room that does. And in the off chance they do doubt his leadership, it's really just a letter on a jersey. The guys in the room know who the real leaders are, and the real leaders step up at the right times regardless of what is on their jersey.

JT also had almost the entire Leafs squad up at his cottage this summer after they lost out in the playoffs to iron out some shit. That went completely unnoticed by the media at the time it unfolded, and only in training camp was it revealed by I think Simmer. He doesn't need to lead when the camera's are on.
 
I’m sure they’ll tell you now that post-covid symptoms happen weeks after getting over it! People here have some fetish with this guy and defend him like their jobs depended on it.
the funny thing is he's had people defending him like their life depended on it since he went to the the Gens

nothing is ever his fault and he's never in a slump , it's always some type of injury or illness

and if they ever do criticize him in any way they always bring in his linemates to to share the blame . it's not Johnny that's playing poorly it's the whole line and then they start shitting on Willie to deflect away from Johnny , lol
 
You're captain comment is absolute crap, as you've no idea what he does as captain. His cap hit was, and is, consistent with his production. He's been saddled with Nylander who has been floating the past two months. I love Nylander's talent, I hate his compete. Give Tavares a guy he can count on and things improve in the D and O zone 100%. I love WN's talent, close to if not the equal of Marner's, but his day to day effort sucks, I'd move him tomorrow.
His cap hit is consistent with his production? What?? In his time as an $11 million player with Toronto, he is under a point per game (slightly). He only has one season over a point per game in his 4 seasons in Toronto, and that was his first season multiple years ago.

Are you telling me every point per game player that is adequate away from the puck should be making $11 million on their teams cap? He’s the 4th highest paid forward in hockey. Is his production in line with being the 4th best forward in the world?
 
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regardless of points, when was the last time JT was the best player on the team in any given game? given the salary, we should be saying, once in a while at least, that tavares was one of the best players on the ice and won us a game. every other one of the top 4 players have taken over games this year multiple times(marner and matthews hae been a force almost every game for the past 3 months with the toughest matchups). thats what stars do, JT hasnt done that in a long time imo.
 
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regardless of points, when was the last time JT was the best player on the team in any given game? given the salary, we should be saying, once in a while at least, that tavares was one of the best players on the ice and won us a game. every other one of the top 4 players have taken over games this year multiple times(marner and matthews hae been a force almost every game for the past 3 months with the toughest matchups). thats what stars do, JT hasnt done that in a long time imo.
Pretty f***ing hard to be the best player on the ice when Matthews and Marner are rolling the way they are....

JT is the Tim Duncan of the NHL. There is no fun in fundamentals...
 
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