Confirmed with Link: Jiricek, 2025 5th to Minnesota for Hunt, conditional 2025 1st, 2026 3rd, 2027 2nd and 4th

[Viqsi]

I've deleted all my posts in this and the Hunt thread. Not touching replies because that would require use of moderator-granted powers, so if y'all want to see what I was on about you can still follow the conversation that way.

I just don't need the hostilty and the first step to avoiding it is to not precipitate it myself.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Lol. I remember when tbat movie was on cable all the time. I have always liked Michael Keaton. Probably on of my favorite actors. Don't think I ever disliked a movie he was in. Mr. Mom is a classic. "220, 221, whatever works."

“Scotch?”

Dude is brilliant. Johnny Dangerously. Night Shift.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

So, before I start I just want to say I think emotions are high for some right now given other sporting events today (at least, thats the case for me).

But moving from that as much as possible, here's the disconnect and the main reason why I don't agree with this deal.

Its not just about Jiricek, and that he's a former 6th overall pick. It's not about how he/his agent acting up last year. None of that is what actually matters to me, despite me being high on him and wishing we'd have kept him and tried to make it work.

What I DON'T get is that this doesn't make us better. Not now, and not anytime soon in all likelihood. Waddell's "rally cry" is that he will do whatever he can for the betterment of the franchise now and going forward. Which, yeah, great we want that. But how does this make us better this year? Or even anytime relatively soon?

Jiricek is a better prospect than Hunt. I think most would agree. Hunt may be more polished and more NHL ready/able to play right now than Jiricek, but the upside isn't even close. RHD are more valuable than LHD, especially young ones, so thats where all the picks come into play. But essentially, Hunt is another addition to a crowded LHD group. He's not even the first call up if needed from Cleveland (which I assume would be Mateychuk). Is he even over Svozil? That puts him 8th or 9th on the depth chart at best. Granted, Harris, Provorov, JJ, and maybe even Christiansen aren't here for the long haul so there is a pathway for Hunt. But again, that's not helping us this year.

Now the picks, which are complete crap shoots. Waddell made it known he wanted to recoup picks after dealing a pick to get rid of Laine's deal and honoring the 2nd rounder deal for Provorov. Again, not something I mind. But we're going to recoup these picks at the deadline anyway using Provorov, Kuraly, Olivier (if necessary), etc. So, why are we trading a 21 year old defenseman with high upside?

It feels less like "we're trying to get better" and more like unloading for the sake of unloading. Hunt may be an NHL defenseman. The picks may work out, either by drafting or trading. But none of this is going to help the CBJ in the time period Jiricek (probably) would have. It feels like giving up on a guy just because he wasn't yours.

This feels like the Johansen deal where the GM is cutting bait to bring in his own guys rather than working with what he's got. And on its face, most CBJ fans would jump for joy with that comparison because Seth Jones worked out really well here. Well, the only problem is there is no Seth Jones in this deal. There really isn't anything to be excited about it the deal.

Maybe it all works out in the end. Jiricek as a prospect has a few knicks in the armor. He's not a blue chipper that we thought he'd be. Maybe he's an off ice headache, either through himself or his agent. But idk, it kinda feels like we shouldn't be giving up on 21 year olds with high potential for the sake of drafting more kids over the next 2-3 years who may help us in 4-6 years.



"Jiricek is Jiricek but the picks could be anything. It could even be a RHD with high upside, you know how valuable one of those are!" type thing

 

[614 CBJ]

Walsh is part of the problem IMO

tell your clients they are better than they are is this is where you end up

 

[SteelCityCannon]

So, before I start I just want to say I think emotions are high for some right now given other sporting events today (at least, thats the case for me).

But moving from that as much as possible, here's the disconnect and the main reason why I don't agree with this deal.

Its not just about Jiricek, and that he's a former 6th overall pick. It's not about how he/his agent acting up last year. None of that is what actually matters to me, despite me being high on him and wishing we'd have kept him and tried to make it work.

What I DON'T get is that this doesn't make us better. Not now, and not anytime soon in all likelihood. Waddell's "rally cry" is that he will do whatever he can for the betterment of the franchise now and going forward. Which, yeah, great we want that. But how does this make us better this year? Or even anytime relatively soon?

Jiricek is a better prospect than Hunt. I think most would agree. Hunt may be more polished and more NHL ready/able to play right now than Jiricek, but the upside isn't even close. RHD are more valuable than LHD, especially young ones, so thats where all the picks come into play. But essentially, Hunt is another addition to a crowded LHD group. He's not even the first call up if needed from Cleveland (which I assume would be Mateychuk). Is he even over Svozil? That puts him 8th or 9th on the depth chart at best. Granted, Harris, Provorov, JJ, and maybe even Christiansen aren't here for the long haul so there is a pathway for Hunt. But again, that's not helping us this year.

Now the picks, which are complete crap shoots. Waddell made it known he wanted to recoup picks after dealing a pick to get rid of Laine's deal and honoring the 2nd rounder deal for Provorov. Again, not something I mind. But we're going to recoup these picks at the deadline anyway using Provorov, Kuraly, Olivier (if necessary), etc. So, why are we trading a 21 year old defenseman with high upside?

It feels less like "we're trying to get better" and more like unloading for the sake of unloading. Hunt may be an NHL defenseman. The picks may work out, either by drafting or trading. But none of this is going to help the CBJ in the time period Jiricek (probably) would have. It feels like giving up on a guy just because he wasn't yours.

This feels like the Johansen deal where the GM is cutting bait to bring in his own guys rather than working with what he's got. And on its face, most CBJ fans would jump for joy with that comparison because Seth Jones worked out really well here. Well, the only problem is there is no Seth Jones in this deal. There really isn't anything to be excited about it the deal.

Maybe it all works out in the end. Jiricek as a prospect has a few knicks in the armor. He's not a blue chipper that we thought he'd be. Maybe he's an off ice headache, either through himself or his agent. But idk, it kinda feels like we shouldn't be giving up on 21 year olds with high potential for the sake of drafting more kids over the next 2-3 years who may help us in 4-6 years.

I get what you're saying and you very well be right in the end, but we don't know if this makes us better yet. Say we get a 1 for Provorov. I really highly doubt we'll actually make 3 picks next year in the first round. Waddell apparently was in deep talks to acquire Necas this year at the draft. Next year I feel that's the type of deal he actually pulls the trigger on with the draft capital. Then we'll see if that makes us better.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I get what you're saying and you very well be right in the end, but we don't know if this makes us better yet. Say we get a 1 for Provorov. I really highly doubt we'll actually make 3 picks next year in the first round. Waddell apparently was in deep talks to acquire Necas this year at the draft. Next year I feel that's the type of deal he actually pulls the trigger on with the draft capital. Then we'll see if that makes us better.

For sure. I am very cognizant that Waddell isn't just going to slow play this thing and make all of these draft picks himself.

But with the cap going up and teams having more money. I just don't know what quality of player is going to be available to get with these picks. Like you said, we were apparently in on Necas but he didn't want to sign. This Minnesota pick is likely to be in the 15-30 area. The 2nd, 3rd, and 4th are mostly just fillers in any potential deal. Does it make us more likely to move our own pick, which could be top 10? Who knows.

This whole Jiricek thing feels like a gigantic mystery box type deal. Not saying Jiricek himself was some proven commodity, but idk. It's a weird deal. Especially for a rebuilding team trying to improve.

 

[SteelCityCannon]

For sure. I am very cognizant that Waddell isn't just going to slow play this thing and make all of these draft picks himself.

But with the cap going up and teams having more money. I just don't know what quality of player is going to be available to get with these picks. Like you said, we were apparently in on Necas but he didn't want to sign. This Minnesota pick is likely to be in the 15-30 area. The 2nd, 3rd, and 4th are mostly just fillers in any potential deal. Does it make us more likely to move our own pick, which could be top 10? Who knows.

This whole Jiricek thing feels like a gigantic mystery box type deal. Not saying Jiricek himself was some proven commodity, but idk. It's a weird deal. Especially for a rebuilding team trying to improve.

I thought that already had the contract worked out but Waddell didn't want to pay the price to acquire him. At any rate, who knows what players come available at the time.

This is the type of trade that people love Tom judge immediately but we probably won't know who won for years.

 

[koteka]

I was of the opinion that we weren't going to settle on a lesser package for him but things must have been that irreparable and/or the new regime just didn't think he was that good

A couple of weeks ago I said something along the lines that we might have a deal with Jiricek and his agent that if they just shut up and behave then we will make a trade. Maybe there was a deal that we would make the trade by Dec 1. That would explain the flurry of media reports this week and what looks like an underwhelming return.

 

[Doggy]

I would add that that none of us really have any idea what was really going on behind the scenes (we are all guessing). Maybe Jiricek's wasn't nearly so coachable or worked hard enough on his shortcomings, maybe he was causing headaches for the coaches or GM behind the scenes and they didn't want to deal with it any longer or risk it being public and diminishing his trade value, maybe the new staff just deemed he isn't going to be an impact NHL player and wanted to move on from him. Who knows...certainly not us.

Yes he was a #6OA pick but if Waddell took this deal, maybe it was the best he was offered and that the so-called experts around the league feel the likelihood of Jiricek reaching his draft-projected ceiling was low. Here's the thing...not all high draft picks become impact players. Some fail...and while I like to preach patience, especially with d-men and goalies, maybe this was one of those cases where the new front office felt it was time to cut their losses and move on.

 

[AndBoomGoesTheCannon]

Idk it’s fine value if you want a quantity trade, but I greatly preferred top prospect for top prospect.

 

[CalBuckeyeRob]

My concern is that it seemed like a lot of teams thought they could fix Jiricek. So why couldn't Columbus fix him or why didn't they want to try?

 

[Cujorulesdtown9]

The second the "buy a place" fiasco happened I had the feeling a deal was coming down the road. Not mad with the return.

I do feel like the Jackets mismanaged him quite a bit, however, his agent, and what he was showing on ice, wasnt helping his cause.
As repeated like an echo in a cave, his skating and IQ just never became satisfactory.

If he works in minnesota, ok, but here it was clear things were coming to a head that he was going to be on the nhl roster, or get dealt, and well....

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

My concern is that it seemed like a lot of teams thought they could fix Jiricek. So why couldn't Columbus fix him or why didn't they want to try?

To come at it from this perspective.

What issues are wort spending effort to fix and what are the best to cut bait on. His biggest issue was skating ability. Yes, you can work on that but how likely is it that an adult is willing and able to completely relearn how to skate again?

Some skills are learned and some skills are just natural ability. If you aren't naturally a mobile person, that's not going to be something you can easily fix. Genetics are genetics. His skill set can and will be of value for another organization and that is fine. It's not something that can and will be taught in this organization. It's pretty clear highly mobile players are now valued here and I feel that is not a skill you can easily teach. You either are or you aren't but if someone has those natural tools then you can teach them where to stand on the ice and how to play the system.

 

[Crede777]

I get what you're saying and you very well be right in the end, but we don't know if this makes us better yet. Say we get a 1 for Provorov. I really highly doubt we'll actually make 3 picks next year in the first round. Waddell apparently was in deep talks to acquire Necas this year at the draft. Next year I feel that's the type of deal he actually pulls the trigger on with the draft capital. Then we'll see if that makes us better.

Every year we say they're going to use the multiple 1sts to either trade up or trade for a star player. And every year they just end up using the picks. And most years, none of those picks amount to anything.

 

[MissADD]

I think something people are forgetting is that Hunt was drafted while Dean Evason was coaching there, so he may like Hunt. I think everything is getting blows out of proportion. Yes the player return wasn't what we expected and we got a lot of picks. But you know who else likes picks? Other GMs. So getting 4 picks adds more ammo for GMDW to do something.

Every year we say they're going to use the multiple 1sts to either trade up or trade for a star player. And every year they just end up using the picks. And most years, none of those picks amount to anything.

New GM in charge now. Things can change.

 

[SteelCityCannon]

Every year we say they're going to use the multiple 1sts to either trade up or trade for a star player. And every year they just end up using the picks. And most years, none of those picks amount to anything.

Don't google how we got Provorov

 

[Cowumbus]

This feels like the Johansen deal where the GM is cutting bait to bring in his own guys rather than working with what he's got. And on its face, most CBJ fans would jump for joy with that comparison because Seth Jones worked out really well here. Well, the only problem is there is no Seth Jones in this deal.

There’s no Johansen (or equally valued talent) in this deal either. Johansen had just hit 71 points.

Which D are you taking Jiricek over in the 2022 redraft?

Nemec, Mintyukov, Korchinski, Lane Hutson? Nope. Lane Hutson has shown more flash at the NHL level and he’s 5’9” 162lbs. He actually has more assists than Jiricek has points, in half the games played. Jiricek’s stock has only gone down.

That said I would have been fine waiting/holding on to him. But if GMDW thinks he’s not an NHL guy, I’m glad he moved him.

Don't google how we got Provorov

Please don’t tell me you think Provorov is a star player

 

[SteelCityCannon]

Please don’t tell me you think Provorov is a star player

Well that's not much of a debate lol. But we used a first rounder on a solid NHL player that we desperately needed. It's looking like we'll be able to recoup it too.

I know that they werent at the draft, but we've also recently used firsts on Duchene and for Expansion Draft protection. I'm not sure where that other poster was going. We've used a ton of firsts.

 

[Cowumbus]

My concern is that it seemed like a lot of teams thought they could fix Jiricek. So why couldn't Columbus fix him or why didn't they want to try?

Because there are probably people/teams out there (even us) that saw his issues has deal breakers. Some traits even could have had him on DND boards.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

There’s no Johansen (or equally valued talent) in this deal either. Johansen had just hit 71 points.

Yeah, that’s fair.

Which D are you taking Jiricek over in the 2022 redraft?

Nemec, Mintyukov, Korchinski, Lane Hutson? Nope. Lane Hutson has shown more flash at the NHL level and he’s 5’9” 162lbs. He actually has more assists than Jiricek has points, in half the games played. Jiricek’s stock has only gone down.

I’d take Jiricek long term over Nemec and Hutson. Korchinski is a toss up but lean Korchinski.

 

[Cowumbus]

I’d take Jiricek long term over Nemec and Hutson. Korchinski is a toss up but lean Korchinski.

Sad thing is, Korchinski, Mintyukov, Mateychuk, Hutson were all drafted after him.

I’m prepared for this deal to look horrible in a few years, but it is what it is. I’ve already accepted the distorted reality that Mateychuk was our pick at 5OA, and Jiricek was our “boom or bust” pick in the mid 1st. Also, Hunt can replace Provorov after the TDL so Mateychuk can keep playing in a good situation.

 

[Crede777]

Well that's not much of a debate lol. But we used a first rounder on a solid NHL player that we desperately needed. It's looking like we'll be able to recoup it too.

I know that they werent at the draft, but we've also recently used firsts on Duchene and for Expansion Draft protection. I'm not sure where that other poster was going. We've used a ton of firsts.

We used our own 1st on Duchene and for the Expansion Draft protection. Where I'm going is every time they enter a draft with multiple 1st round picks and are talking about packaging them to move up or trade for a good player, they don't.

At this point it's become a bit of a running joke. 2013 they had 3 and used all 3. 2015 they had 2 and used both. 2021 they had 3 and used all 3. 2022 they had 2 and used both.

 

[S1N4TR4]

Yeah, that’s fair.


I’d take Jiricek long term over Nemec and Hutson. Korchinski is a toss up but lean Korchinski.

you honestly think Jiricek has more potential than Hutson?..

 

[Aaaarrgghh]

Disappointing. I still think they should have seen what Jiricek and a top 5 protected 1st would have landed them. Maybe they did, for all I know. Oh well, let's see what they do with that 1st round pick and the Provorov return down the road. Plus, they basically half a draft class worth of picks. So there is some quantity to potentially turn into quality.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

you honestly think Jiricek has more potential than Hutson?..

I do. Maybe not offensive upside but two way upside yes