Tribute Jesperi Kotkaniemi - Goodbye and Good Luck part II

[McGees]

Imo, we should never be pissed at a player for exercising their free agency rights.

Further, with respect to Danault, the difference may be a lot more than 500k. An offensive role at this time will earn him more money on his next contract.

Nah, he’s not gonna stay a ‘2C’ very long and if anything he’s losing the media attention to help his next contract. Of course he’s free to do whatever he wanted but fans should also feel slighted.

 

[canucklover123]

Last year during the regular season at 5vs5:

KK: 1.37 pts/60 min - Playing with Toffoli, Drouin, Anderson
Evans: 1.31 pts/60 min - On the 4th line

On special teams:

KK: 106 minutes on the PP, 4 points
Evans: 3 minutes on the PP, 0 points

KK: 1 minute on the PK, 0 points
Evans: 85 minutes on the PK, 2 points

Faceoffs taken by zone (OZ/NZ/DZ):

KK: 236/183/130
Evans: 100/136/169

These are pretty putrid stats for KK. Posters blamed his linemates for him looking bad compared to Suzuki and Danault but even Evans makes him look pretty bad. In any case I don't see how he was so offensively superior to anyone on the team at this point.

Damn kk supporters lived by the p/60 stat

 

[Goalfield13]

Damn kk supporters lived by the p/60 stat

When stats fail for them, they mention age and potential. Not a bad argument for them, but to me, that goes out the window when you lose control of the player and are paying him big money.

 

[CHfan1]

Damn kk supporters lived by the p/60 stat

He had a down regular season but his points per 60 most posters talked about was his playoff stats where he was 2nd on the team with 2.08/60. I don’t know why everyone leaves out playoff stats when talking about players (except for Tatar). Teams have a 50% chance of making the playoffs but only 1 of those 16 teams wins the Cup. A player being able to elevate his game come playoff time could be the difference between a 1st round exit and going on a run.

When stats fail for them, they mention age and potential. Not a bad argument for them, but to me, that goes out the window when you lose control of the player and are paying him big money.

Yep Bergevin and the organization really screwed that up by not trying to get KK under contract sooner. At the end they were forced to pick between two bad outcomes, ultimately taking what will probably be a later 1st and 3rd.

I’m expecting Kotkaniemi to break out with Carolina and become a player that the Habs wish they had. The salary is only for 1 season, we’ll see how his contract looks going forward and if he’s overpaid in the 2022-23 season and beyond.

 

[Goalfield13]

Yep Bergevin and the organization really screwed that up by not trying to get KK under contract sooner. At the end they were forced to pick between two bad outcomes, ultimately taking what will probably be a later 1st and 3rd.

I’m expecting Kotkaniemi to break out with Carolina and become a player that the Habs wish they had. The salary is only for 1 season, we’ll see how his contract looks going forward and if he’s overpaid in the 2022-23 season and beyond.

They did try. They can't force KK to sign it. Look at all the RFAs left unsigned right now.

 

[CHfan1]

They did try. They can't force KK to sign it. Look at all the RFAs left unsigned right now.

Agreed they can’t force KK to sign and, maybe, as Dreger was alluding to he wanted out regardless. I’m just not sure how much they say down with him and his agents and tried to hammer out a deal closer to the start of the off-season other than sending him a lowball offer. As far as the other free agents are concerned I think teams waited too long on them too. Teams like Colorado, Dallas got their big RFA’s signed early.

 

[Goalfield13]

Agreed they can’t force KK to sign and, maybe, as Dreger was alluding to he wanted out regardless. I’m just not sure how much they say down with him and his agents and tried to hammer out a deal closer to the start of the off-season other than sending him a lowball offer. As far as the other free agents are concerned I think teams waited too long on them too. Teams like Colorado, Dallas got their big RFA’s signed early.

Everything you say is just conjecture. You do not know what is going on with any negotiation, so to assume that these organizations are just taking too long to get deals signed or sending low-ball offers is just your own bias.

 

[CHfan1]

Everything you say is just conjecture. You do not know what is going on with any negotiation, so to assume that these organizations are just taking too long to get deals signed or sending low-ball offers is just your own bias.

Sure it is, none of us on here really know the full picture. All we know is the final outcome, which in KK’s case was picking the best of two bad options.

I’d give the organization more benefit of the doubt if they had a recent history (last 25 years or so) of drafting and developing highly skillled players or if they had built a perennial contender. They haven’t and thus I’m more skeptical of the moves they make.

 

[Goalfield13]

Sure it is, none of us on here really know the full picture. All we know is the final outcome, which in KK’s case was picking the best of two bad options.

I’d give the organization more benefit of the doubt if they had a recent history (last 25 years or so) of drafting and developing highly skillled players or if they had built a perennial contender. They haven’t and thus I’m more skeptical of the moves they make.

What does drafting and developing players have to do with contract negotiations? You are just being negative for the sake of it.

 

[Not The One]

He had a down regular season but his points per 60 most posters talked about was his playoff stats where he was 2nd on the team with 2.08/60. I don’t know why everyone leaves out playoff stats when talking about players (except for Tatar). Teams have a 50% chance of making the playoffs but only 1 of those 16 teams wins the Cup. A player being able to elevate his game come playoff time could be the difference between a 1st round exit and going on a run.



Yep Bergevin and the organization really screwed that up by not trying to get KK under contract sooner. At the end they were forced to pick between two bad outcomes, ultimately taking what will probably be a later 1st and 3rd.

I’m expecting Kotkaniemi to break out with Carolina and become a player that the Habs wish they had. The salary is only for 1 season, we’ll see how his contract looks going forward and if he’s overpaid in the 2022-23 season and beyond.

Let's talk about the playoffs. He had some key goals, absolutely but what was his overall contribution?

FO stats (OZ/NV/DZ)

KK: 51/65/38
Suzuki: 148/94/86
Danault: 77/126/301

The team simply did not trust him at all for faceoffs, especially in the DZ. Danault had to take the vast majority of them to allow the others more offensive deployment. Scoring points was all he had to do.

Here is his game-by-game log:

NHL Stats

As you can see, after the first game of the 2nd round he had 1 goal and 3 assists in 12 games. He had zero PP points in 25 minutes in total in the playoffs.

This isn't really the kind of contribution we expect from a "2nd line Center" with the quality of the minutes he had. Who knows what could have happened with Dvorak instead of him on the team?

 

[angusyoung]

The Chargers.

I suspect you're speaking of the football team and not what is more commonly known among my inner circle in referring to my ex's going on a shopping spree

 

[CHfan1]

Let's talk about the playoffs. He had some key goals, absolutely but what was his overall contribution?

FO stats (OZ/NV/DZ)

KK: 51/65/38
Suzuki: 148/94/86
Danault: 77/126/301

The team simply did not trust him at all for faceoffs, especially in the DZ. Danault had to take the vast majority of them to allow the others more offensive deployment. Scoring points was all he had to do.

Here is his game-by-game log:

NHL Stats

As you can see, after the first game of the 2nd round he had 1 goal and 3 assists in 12 games. He had zero PP points in 25 minutes in total in the playoffs.

This isn't really the kind of contribution we expect from a "2nd line Center" with the quality of the minutes he had. Who knows what could have happened with Dvorak instead of him on the team?

His contribution was scoring the first goal of a game 3 times (which was big in Habs victories), an overtime goal in an elimination game where the Habs were struggling in that period, another goal in an elimination game, and 2 assists on game winning goals. All of these were big contributors to the Habs run.

 

[cphabs]

That's good , we won't have to hear his name 150 times during game day.

Never thought of that! You’re right!

 

[cphabs]

Not for free we couldn't afford him

Then we should have traded him

 

[aresknights]

Then we should have traded him

Maybe they got more from the OS compensation than offered in a trade?
That what was said by the org if I recall correctly. And Carolina didn't publicly dispute that.
So should they have traded him for less?

 

[PKWeber]

If there is one thing I learned from this whole KK fiasco is that the Carolina Hurricanes have the most cringe fanbase in Hockey. I feel bad for KK who now has to do that stupid “dance” at the end of games.

 

[CHfan1]

What does drafting and developing players have to do with contract negotiations? You are just being negative for the sake of it.

I’m probably being too negative, I’m just not happy, as a fan, of the outcome of the KK situation. I do expect him to turn into a player the Habs wish they had in the future (I realize some posters here don’t share that outlook (which is fine, we all can’t have the same opinion or this forum would be pretty boring)).

 

[Ozmodiar]

I suspect you're speaking of the football team and not what is more commonly known among my inner circle in referring to my ex's going on a shopping spree

LOL
/ beer spit take

 

[ECWHSWI]

Let's talk about the playoffs. He had some key goals, absolutely but what was his overall contribution?

FO stats (OZ/NV/DZ)

KK: 51/65/38
Suzuki: 148/94/86
Danault: 77/126/301

The team simply did not trust him at all for faceoffs, especially in the DZ. Danault had to take the vast majority of them to allow the others more offensive deployment. Scoring points was all he had to do.

Here is his game-by-game log:

NHL Stats

As you can see, after the first game of the 2nd round he had 1 goal and 3 assists in 12 games. He had zero PP points in 25 minutes in total in the playoffs.

This isn't really the kind of contribution we expect from a "2nd line Center" with the quality of the minutes he had. Who knows what could have happened with Dvorak instead of him on the team?

For all we know, with Dvorak on the team, the OT goal vs Leafs is not being scored...

 

[1909]

Are we gonna have new posts about KK everytime he is farting ?

 

[aresknights]

For all we know, with Dvorak on the team, the OT goal vs Leafs is not being scored...

Or that DVO scored in reg to win it

 

[loudi94]

For all we know, with Dvorak on the team, the OT goal vs Leafs is not being scored...

True, but for all we know, with Dvorak on the team, Spezza doesn't score the Leafs first goal and the game never goes into OT at all.

 

[Habs Icing]

I feel bad for KK who now has to do that stupid “dance” at the end of games.

What makes you think he doesn't enjoy it?

 

[Habs Icing]

Are we gonna have new posts about KK everytime he is farting ?

No! We'll also have posts when he burbs and picks his nose.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

I’m probably being too negative, I’m just not happy, as a fan, of the outcome of the KK situation. I do expect him to turn into a player the Habs wish they had in the future (I realize some posters here don’t share that outlook (which is fine, we all can’t have the same opinion or this forum would be pretty boring)).

Perhaps KK develops into a star and perhaps he does not.......either way, signing the offer sheet would have been stupid because it did not remotely reflect his current value and would have made far superior players like Suzuki and Caufield easy targets for an OS in each of the next two off seasons not to mention how much it could inflate their demands.