Post-Game Talk: ITS OVER- Did we make a huge mistake on Pierre-Luc Dubois Thread?

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

We picked Owen Beck 32nd last draft and people are willing to give away our Florida pick as part of a package deal for Dubois in a much stronger draft.
I never understood how this could even be remotely beneficial to a rebuilding team. Let him come the following year if that is what he really wants. I'd like to see a full year of a healthy Suzuki/Caufield because it will have a direct affect on how much we would be willing to shell out for Dubois.

It's even worst, @Belial was bemoaning the fact Florida's 1st pick fell so now we needed to add more than the (around) 15th pick + prospect he was willing to give up.

In other words, if Florida missed the playoffs, he would've traded that pick + prospect for PLD.

Complete lunacy for a rebuilding team.

 

[Redux91]

We picked Owen Beck 32nd last draft and people are willing to give away our Florida pick as part of a package deal for Dubois in a much stronger draft.
I never understood how this could even be remotely beneficial to a rebuilding team. Let him come the following year if that is what he really wants. I'd like to see a full year of a healthy Suzuki/Caufield because it will have a direct affect on how much we would be willing to shell out for Dubois.

As someone who does want PLD (not at any cost)
I can totally understand this opinion
It's the first time I've been slightly swayed on it lol

 

[Habs]

we need to suck one more year, the next draft after this is going to be a few franchise players if we learn how to tank properly, without all the Rudy's showing up and winning games because they've been buried in the minors for 20 years and suck balls until they got a chance. I hate Belizle and these buttheads for suddenly showing up and winning games for us out of nowhere, piss off. PLD can only come here if Allen is starting, I feel Montembust is going to go on a heater and be a starting goalie after his little gold medal performance.

Run-on -sentences? Come at me

 

[Destopcorner]

It's even worst, @Belial was bemoaning the fact Florida's 1st pick fell so now we needed to add more than the (around) 15th pick + prospect he was willing to give up.

In other words, if Florida missed the playoffs, he would've traded that pick + prospect for PLD.

Complete lunacy for a rebuilding team.

The rebuilding team already have many good offensive prospects with Roy/Mesar/Heineman/Kidney/Beck/Farell/RHP...the Slaf guy.. plus the 11 picks coming up.

But none of them is PLD caliber.

I can't remember the last aquisition even remotly close to him... Kovalev sure but he was older and a winger. Young big well develop centers like this are never available unless things go sour with their team like Eichel.

Don't take the UFA chance and snag him while you can. Quantity for quality.

 

[Milhouse40]

we need to suck one more year, the next draft after this is going to be a few franchise players if we learn how to tank properly, without all the Rudy's showing up and winning games because they've been buried in the minors for 20 years and suck balls until they got a chance. I hate Belizle and these buttheads for suddenly showing up and winning games for us out of nowhere, piss off. PLD can only come here if Allen is starting, I feel Montembust is going to go on a heater and be a starting goalie after his little gold medal performance.

Run-on -sentences? Come at me

Issshhhhhh...... starting next year it will be guys like Roy, Kidney, Heineman, Farrell, Mailloux that they will call up instead of the Rudys,

 

[Deleted member 257557]

Why even watch hockey at all for the next 3-4 years then? Let’s all tune in again in 8 years for the cant-miss stanley cup as these yet to be drafted players suit up and play together for the first time and the master plan comes together exactly as the other 31 teams’ plan falls appart... I might only watch the last game come to think of it seeing as we already know the outcome. I’ll still be reading hf most weeks because I can’t help it for some reason.

I need good entertaining hockey as of next year and a noticeable leap forward thank you.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

The rebuilding team already have many good offensive prospects with Roy/Mesar/Heineman/Kidney/Beck/Farell/RHP...the Slaf guy.. plus the 11 picks coming up.

But none of them is PLD caliber.

I can't remember the last aquisition even remotly close to him... Kovalev sure but he was older and a winger. Young big well develop centers like this are never available unless things go sour with their team like Eichel.

Don't take the UFA chance and snag him while you can. Quantity for quality.

You don't trade a mid first round pick in a great draft year for one year of PLD. It's a dumb idea.

Also, Eichel is in another league than PLD. You can add all the fanboy qualifiers you like, Dubois comes with many warts and a plausible ceiling of 60-70 points. We already have Dach who should get close to 50-60 points if not more and costs a lot less.

I'm all for signing him at a fair price, because we ADD without spending an important asset.

If the player is so adamant in coming here, let him. It only requires a bit of patience and the gains are much better.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Why even watch hockey at all for the next 3-4 years then? Let’s all tune in again in 8 years for the cant-miss stanley cup as these yet to be drafted players suit up and play together for the first time and the master plan comes together exactly as the other 31 teams’ plan falls appart... I might only watch the last game come to think of it seeing as we already know the outcome. I’ll still be reading hf most weeks because I can’t help it for some reason.

I need good entertaining hockey as of next year and a noticeable leap forward thank you.

If you’re expecting us to overpay Dubois on both aquisition price and money wise and be competitive the next couple of years, you’ll be disappointed. He isn’t that guy.

 

[Destopcorner]

You don't trade a mid first round pick in a great draft year for one year of PLD. It's a dumb idea.

Also, Eichel is in another league than PLD. You can add all the fanboy qualifiers you like, Dubois comes with many warts and a plausible ceiling of 60-70 points. We already have Dach who should get close to 50-60 points if not more and costs a lot less.

I'm all for signing him at a fair price, because we ADD without spending an important asset.

If the player is so adamant in coming here, let him. It only requires a bit of patience and the gains are much better.

The idea he only wants to come here is flawed. You don't wanna let the devil tempt him with a team going nuts like every July first. He's a 25yo top 5% UFA class after all.

If you can control his destiny now, don't hesitate. Sign&trade means cheaper because of the RFA year and no competition, it's simple math.

Long term that first rounder+ b assets are totally worth it.

 

[Wateredgarden]

It's even worst, @Belial was bemoaning the fact Florida's 1st pick fell so now we needed to add more than the (around) 15th pick + prospect he was willing to give up.

In other words, if Florida missed the playoffs, he would've traded that pick + prospect for PLD.

Complete lunacy for a rebuilding team.

I'm with Belial

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

The idea he only wants to come here is flawed. You don't wanna let the devil tempt him with a team going nuts like every July first. He's a 25yo top 5% UFA class after all.

Devil tempt...

He's not some savior and won't move the needle all that much. If he goes elsewhere, it shows he didn't really care all that much about being here, we won't be losing anything. There will be other opportunities. Dubois isn't some once in a lifetime centerman or even among elite centermen, no matter your attempts at throwing him in the same range as Eichel.

If you can control his destiny now, don't hesitate. Sign&trade means cheaper because of the RFA year and no competition, it's simple math.

No it isn't. That's just a narrative you're creating. PLD will ask for his perceived value long term all the same.

Long term that first rounder+ b assets are totally worth it.

Spoken like a true fanboy and no they're not worth it, they're pointless losses to our small asset base, and all the more reason to acquire him through FA. Naming a bunch of prospects is not any guarantee to accrue our asset base. They are unknowables for now, so we're not at the point where we can sacrifice a prime asset (+/-15th overall) just to get one more year of a player we might get for free.

You sound like HabsHalifax, did you happen to change your username again?

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

I'm with Belial

Great for you

 

[Destopcorner]

Devil tempt...

He's not some savior and won't move the needle all that much. If he goes elsewhere, it shows he didn't really care all that much about being here, we won't be losing anything. There will be other opportunities. Dubois isn't some once in a lifetime centerman or even among elite centermen, no matter your attempts at throwing him in the same range as Eichel.



No it isn't. That's just a narrative you're creating. PLD will ask for his perceived value long term all the same.



Spoken like a true fanboy and no they're not worth it, they're pointless losses to our small asset base, and all the more reason to acquire him through FA. Naming a bunch of prospects is not any guarantee to accrue our asset base. They are unknowables for now, so we're not at the point where we can sacrifice a prime asset (+/-15th overall) just to get one more year of a player we might get for free.

You sound like HabsHalifax, did you happen to change your username again?

Put some names out there. Not many proven big centerman available... Your plan is to wait till they hit UFA and choose Montreal of all destinations? Get off our pink cloud, it never happens and ive follow this team for 40 years. Or you wanna trade for the guy? Bet ya it cost more than your beloved 15th pick and b assets.

Saying we have a small asset base is ridiculous, our prospect pool is gorgeous and we have 11 picks coming up.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

There is way to make a trade that is worth around a mid 1st round pick but a lot of Habs fans would not want it.

Either trade 2024 1st top 3 protected for PLD or trade away 5th overall for 18th overall + PLD

Not claiming I would do it but it's feasible.

 

[ReHabs]

You don't trade a mid first round pick in a great draft year for one year of PLD. It's a dumb idea.

That sounds like a dumb idea indeed. What if you trade a lower first round pick for a pre-committed 8 year contract PLD?

 

[nhlfan9191]

Put some names out there. Not many proven big centerman available... Your plan is to wait till they hit UFA and choose Montreal of all destinations? Get off our pink cloud, it never happens and ive follow this team for 40 years. Or you wanna trade for the guy? Bet ya it cost more than your beloved 15th pick and b assets.

Saying we have a small asset base is ridiculous, our prospect pool is gorgeous and we have 11 picks coming up.

If we’re going to give up serious assets for a Center or anyone threw a trade, it’s going to be for a better player then Dubois. It’s as simple as that. This thread literally gets treated like a PLD fan page at points. Reading some of the posts, you would think this guy is a healthy Eric Lindros. The trade is just one of many issues here. If we come out of this rebuild with Dubois being the highest paid player on the team and expecting him to live up to that, it means that we’ve messed up somewhere.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

That sounds like a dumb idea indeed. What if you trade a lower first round pick for a pre-committed 8 year contract PLD?

You're still burning a first rounder for just one year of PLD. I don't see the hurry in acquiring him. Furthermore, with how Qc born stars seem to fail in this venue and his stated desires, I'd rather he'd put money where his mouth is and sign in FA.

 

[ReHabs]

You're still burning a first rounder for just one year of PLD. I don't see the hurry in acquiring him. Furthermore, with how Qc born stars seem to fail in this venue and his stated desires, I'd rather he'd put money where his mouth is and sign in FA.

Is a first round pick (say, Filip Mešár) not worth trading for PLD? Was a (much higher) first round pick worth trading for Kirby Dach last year? This past trade deadline teams sold first round picks in exchange for the likes of Bertuzzi, Hronek, Jeannot, Lundkvist, etc. Across the NHL it has been recognized that after the top-half (as in not playoff teams) the value of a first round pick falls off and It's not a very important or precious asset worth clutching onto.

Consider that the Habs haven't been able to develop a forward who can be expected to regularly hit 60pts/season in a while. Also consider he's 24, has a large frame, and will certainly be a top6 player.

If he's keen to sign a long-term deal I don't see why he's not worth a first round pick and some prospect. If we think he would help our team now and into the future, banking on signing him as a UFA seems not worth the risk it doesn't happen. Where else will we get a 60pt+, big body 24 year old? How many of them have we had go through our ranks over the years?

Additionally -- it isn't going to be ONE YEAR of PLD. If the Habs acquire him it will be with a multi-year deal.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Is a first round pick (say, Filip Mešár) not worth trading for PLD? Was a (much higher) first round pick worth trading for Kirby Dach last year? This past trade deadline teams sold first round picks in exchange for the likes of Bertuzzi, Hronek, Jeannot, Lundkvist, etc. Across the NHL it has been recognized that after the top-half (as in not playoff teams) the value of a first round pick falls off and It's not a very important or precious asset worth clutching onto.

All those first round values have no relation to the reasons I don't want to throw one away. The reason remains that it's pointless because he'll be a FA. Add the fact that the Jets don't have much leverage.

Consider that the Habs haven't been able to develop a forward who can be expected to regularly hit 60pts/season in a while. Also consider he's 24, has a large frame, and will certainly be a top6 player.

Caufield and Suzuki say hi. All those reasons, again, have npthing to do with my own reasons that I stated. Whether he's 24 or 30, we can get him for free next year.

If he's keen to sign a long-term deal I don't see why he's not worth a first round pick and some prospect.

Because it's a pointless loss of an asset and our asset base is still weak. I'm all for getting him for free. I'm also extremely wary of players saying they want to come here. Also as I stated before, we have Dach already.

If we think he would help our team now and into the future, banking on signing him as a UFA seems not worth the risk it doesn't happen. Where else will we get a 60-pt, big body 24 year old?

Too bad then, because it would simply mean his statements about wanting to be here were full of hot air and in this case, we've avoided a disaster.

Also if Hughes was willing to burn a 1st rounder for PLD, the trade would've happened already, anyway.

 

[BLONG7]

The rebuilding team already have many good offensive prospects with Roy/Mesar/Heineman/Kidney/Beck/Farell/RHP...the Slaf guy.. plus the 11 picks coming up.

But none of them is PLD caliber.

I can't remember the last aquisition even remotly close to him... Kovalev sure but he was older and a

I like the idea of obtaining PLD, that said not for just any price.....................and let's be real, he is a 60 pt player.....
He has some tools, but seriously there are a ton of guys his age that are 60 pt players......

 

[CHwest]

The rebuilding team already have many good offensive prospects with Roy/Mesar/Heineman/Kidney/Beck/Farell/RHP...the Slaf guy.. plus the 11 picks coming up.

But none of them is PLD caliber.

I can't remember the last aquisition even remotly close to him... Kovalev sure but he was older and a winger. Young big well develop centers like this are never available unless things go sour with their team like Eichel.

Don't take the UFA chance and snag him while you can. Quantity for quality.

Seriously? You are comparing him to Kovalev.........

 

[dinodebino]

Most of you are running this thread under the assumption we will suck as much next year; we won’t. With PLD or not.

This year, upper management let the tables run because of the quality of the draft. So they sent injured players packin’ early, without making any deals to compensate, relying on AHLers.

Won’t happen next season. Draft is said to be not as deep, obviously. So trying to tank as much as possible will not be worth it. And if you got HuGo’s and Molson’s messages, you prolly understood that the team still needs to grow but will not be as bad as this season or the previous one. I expect them to finish in the 12-14 bottom range next season. No more top 10 unless lucky AF at the lottery.

I expect some movement going forward by HuGo once the Finals are over.

So PLD is not a must. But we ain’t tanking anymore. Get that out of your heads already. That is now done. Our Calgary first round pick (from 2025 I think) is our next ‘chance’ at a top 5-10 pick in the draft.

 

[Deleted member 257557]

If you’re expecting us to overpay Dubois on both aquisition price and money wise and be competitive the next couple of years, you’ll be disappointed. He isn’t that guy.

Please quote and bold in my posts where I mention anything about overpaying? Or how this one guy takes the habs over the top? Or even paying at all?

Habs need a near FULL ROSTER they suck and are not entertaining.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Most of you are running this thread under the assumption we will suck as much next year; we won’t. With PLD or not.

This year, upper management let the tables run because of the quality of the draft. So they sent injured players packin’ early, without making any deals to compensate, relying on AHLers.

Won’t happen next season. Draft is said to be not as deep, obviously. So trying to tank as much as possible will not be worth it. And if you got HuGo’s and Molson’s messages, you prolly understood that the team still needs to grow but will not be as bad as this season or the previous one. I expect them to finish in the 12-14 bottom range next season. No more top 10 unless lucky AF at the lottery.

I expect some movement going forward by HuGo once the Finals are over.

So PLD is not a must. But we ain’t tanking anymore. Get that out of your heads already. That is now done. Our Calgary first round pick (from 2025 I think) is our next ‘chance’ at a top 5-10 pick in the draft.

With the projected state of the Calgary team, that draft pick may be one of our most valuable assets. A wonderful example of insightful asset management.

 

[salbutera]

The idea he only wants to come here is flawed. You don't wanna let the devil tempt him with a team going nuts like every July first. He's a 25yo top 5% UFA class after all.

If you can control his destiny now, don't hesitate. Sign&trade means cheaper because of the RFA year and no competition, it's simple math.

Long term that first rounder+ b assets are totally worth it.

Not that I disagree but what is the absolute basis of being flawed?

Panarin, Fox, Trouba only wanted NYC, Bobrovsky, Tkachuk only wanted South Florida, Tavares wanted to go home etc.