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World Cup: if Sweden goes to the final - are they the 2nd best hockey nation?

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rj said:
Winners of every tournament this century:

2002 Olympics - Canada
2004 World Cup of Hockey - Canada
2006 Olympics - Sweden
2010 Olympics - Canada
2014 Olympics - Canada
2016 World Cup of Hockey - it's looking like Canada

The Czechs have not won anything since '98. The Americans since '96. The Finns are the Finns. And Russia has to go way back to 1992 when NHLers were not on the ice and they competed as the Unified Team in Albertville.

You've sent B lineups and won the past two IIHF World Championships as well. Last Worlds in the final you shutout Finland 2-0 with Cam Talbot in net.

This century at the Worlds, Canada has won 5 times, the Russians 4, the Czechs 3, the Swedes twice, the Finns once in 2011, and the Slovakians once in 2002.

You're clear unquestioned #1 and any time you lose it's to an underdog until someone proves otherwise.
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Canada is number one. There's no question about that. Olympic gold back to back on NA and on international sized ice proves it beyond a doubt. For any other nation to challenge Canada, they need a healthy roster and they need to play at the absolut peak of their abilities.
 
How are they not? They're the only team other than Canada to win Olympic gold in 15 years. They've had the best defenseman in the world for 25 years straight. They still have arguably the best goalie of the past decade. They're getting long in the tooth at forward but they reliably produce good players.

The US is a political sham and Russia has struggled to produce anything other than hotshot snipers since the Soviet era. The Czechs at one point had the best skater and goalie in the world, but those days are gone.
 
gretskidoo said:
No, and i say this as a Swede, because this isn't a real international tournament.

Even if the team wins everything, it means nothing.
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I wouldn't say it means nothing. Outside of the Olympics this is the closest it gets to a best on best tournament. It certainly means more than the world championships.
 
Slimmy said:
I agree. World Cup, even if "sanctioned" by the IIHF, is purely for entertainment purposes.
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IIHF rankings? I at least thought that this discussion was about reality. IIHF sanctioning the tournament or not has zero relevance in the reality in which I rank the teams.

Furthermore World Cup Olympics and local peewee tournament all have one thing in common - they are all purely for entertainment purposes and again IIHF or not, it does not make any difference.
 
Sweden already is. They don't have the offense of Russia but they produce better two way players, team players, defensemen and goalies than Russia. I don't even think this is a debate.
 
gretskidoo said:
No, and i say this as a Swede, because this isn't a real international tournament.

Even if the team wins everything, it means nothing.
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As a Canadian, I believe that Sweden is there right now but that has nothing to do with the results of this tournament. If Canada or Sweden win the entire thing it would not count as a positive in my books neither does it count against the US or Finland for losing their 3 games.

Sweden may have become the second nation in hockey right now, but that is due to the players that are being produced and success in the most recent Olympics not due to any potential success in this WCH.
 
Orange Dragon said:
IMO, current rankings looks like this:

Canada


Sweden
USA/Russia

Finland

Czechs

Switzerland/Slovakia
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This is how I'd rank them as well. Sweden is the clear #2 right now imo. They have a well balanced team with few weaknesses. Some of their main guys at fwd are getting long in the tooth though. I think team USA will probably go into SK as the #2 if they send NHLers.
 
Chimp said:
I concur that Sweden is the second best hockey nation and has been for quite a while now. Russia has the better offensive stars, but Sweden makes up for it with the defense and two-way game.

The results speak for themselves, Sweden almost always medal when they can form a team with their best players.

As for the World Championships, Sweden almost never get any of their best players, just a bunch of players from SEL and KHL.
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Wasn't that more a case of MÃ¥rts alienating many NHL players?
 
The team that wins the final is the best team.

The team that loses in the final is the second best team.

Sports yo, it ain't so difficult.
 
21 said:
I don't give a damn, I love watching all the best players in the world play at the same time, it's a very fun tournament.

World championships is like a joke these days.

Also I want NHL sized rinks in Sweden, Finland, Czech Republic and Russia now, I want to be entertained.
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I'd prefer the NHL had IIHF sized rinks. Go figure..

NHL rinks are too small these days mainly because the players have gotten bigger. We often hear, there is no room out there.
 
Confucius said:
I'd prefer the NHL had IIHF sized rinks. Go figure..

NHL rinks are too small these days mainly because the players have gotten bigger. We often hear, there is no room out there.
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i dont recall any fireworks hockey on big ice in sochi
 
Jussi said:
Wasn't that more a case of MÃ¥rts alienating many NHL players?
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Yes, but even if he hadn't been there, a lot of Swedes do not feel anything special when playing for the national team anymore. Nationalism is deemed "bad" in Sweden, unlike in Finland and Russia, where most players usually show up unless really good reasons.


And btw. Sweden is nearing the end of current "peak", when veterans like the Sedins, Zetterberg, Kronwall, Lundqvist will probably not return to any best on best tournaments after this one (barring one last showing if the NHL releases the players 2018). And even though we have a packed back-end, we don't have any superstar forwards taking their place.

If NHL:ers go to the Olympics in 2018, our team will probably be completely different than it is today. I have a really hard time seeing the twins coming back, Z & Kroner are out to 99% and who knows about Lundqvist. Steen will be 34 etc.



Eriksson-Bäckström-Forsberg

Landeskog-Nylander-Hörnquist

Rakell-Wennberg-Nyquist

Hagelin-Kruger-Silfverberg

Zibanejad, Johansson, Backlund, Lindholm, Rask, A.Nylander, Burakovsky, Arvidsson, Larsson etc. Decent depth, but probably not close to Russia, USA & Canada when it comes to star-power. Then there's Finland who has a very bright future and will probably also be stronger.

Lindholm-Karlsson

Strålman-Hedman

OEL-Hjalmarsson

Brodin, Klefbom, Larsson, Liljegren, Ekholm, Edler etc. Great defence, probably top-2 like right now.


Lehner
Lundqvist (36 in 2018)
?


Defence will still be great, forwards and goalies will probably not.
 
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Sorey said:
if Sweden reach the final, they have been in consecutive finals in best of best tournaments.

Are they ahead of Russia and USA in rankings?
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Well golly gee, I'm sure the US missing a quarter of their players due to the NA team has nothing to do with this. Completely irrelevant to evaluating a hockey nation I guess.

:laugh:
 
Europé: 9.300 000 km² 730.000.000 men and women
Russia: 17.000.000 km², 144.000.000 souls
Canada: 10.000.000 km², 34.000.000 people
.
.
.
Sweden: 450.000 km² , 10.000.000 inhabitants = FEW ... Think "EN gubbe på ISLAND"!! Lagerbäck btw)
 
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Cogsbreakaway said:
Yes, but even if he hadn't been there, a lot of Swedes do not feel anything special when playing for the national team anymore. Nationalism is deemed "bad" in Sweden, unlike in Finland and Russia, where most players usually show up unless really good reasons.
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Sweden and Canada the "what can we do for each other" Nations where Nationalism and chest thumping or gloating of any kind is deemed "bad"

#1 and #2 in world hockey rankings.

USA and Russia the "what can you do for me" Nations where Nationalism and chest thumping is the status quo are #'s 3 and 4.

Feels good, man.
 
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