How many jobs are on the line?

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Nope you're right. Gotta be 88............. and Kerfoot


You do when they can't win in the playoffs and take up a huge amount of your cap


You do when they can't win in the playoffs and take up a huge amount of your cap

I see them keeping the top 4 forwards, heck they've been pretty equal in the post season, so other than Tavares you could move any of them and retain at least half your production. Be hard pressed to give anyone of them a free pass based on actual production.


I think most here were in agreement post-season is more important than regular-season.
 
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seriously considering giving the captaincy to Matthews.


First, you do not strip the captaincy and embarrass the current captain like that. Second, Matthews has never been the captain at any level he has played at so why make him the captain?
 
So we should just accept that that is who he is?

I mean he also put up 7 points in the last 3 games. If you play lazy Kovalev moments and are a 40 point player won't be in the NHL for long. If you have lazy Kovalev moments and put up a point per game and show up in the playoffs, it's the cost of doing business.
 
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I have a hard time being overly "reactionary" in this situation and wanting heads to role. Not because I'm a "keep the status quo" type of guy, but because I think Dubas and Shanahan actually had a really good game plan, that was derailed by Covid-19 and salary cap stagnation. They're trying to pivot and adapt to what they have to work with, and, thus far, it's come up short, with a chance to take another step forward on Saturday night.

Like it, or not, when Kyle Dubas signed Matthews, Tavares, Nylander and Marner to the deals, he, Shanny, Pridham and company did so, like all other business people, by projecting out the salary cap moving forward. Absolutely nobody could have predicted multi-year cap stagnation, followed by multi-year minor cap growth, caused by a once in a lifetime pandemic. Did Dubas pay a little bit extra to get deals done with Tavares (who was reportedly offered more), Matthews and Marner? Yep, I'm not trying to deflect from that, or bury that reality. But when you talk about the deficiencies in goal and defensively, the honest reality, all emotion aside, is that Dubas was expecting to have about $90 million to spend right now, rather than $81.5 million. That lost cap space is the difference between this team being really good, and being an absolute monster.

For some context, in the last 4 seasons, despite a new TV deal and an expansion franchise being added to the league, the salary cap has grown only $2 million, due to the pandemic. In 2018-2019, the cap was $79.5 million, where as this year, it's $81.5 million. That's an average of a $500,000 rise in cap per year. For comparison sake, in the previous 4 years to that (2015-2016 to 2018-2019) the cap rose from $71.4 million to $79.5 million, a total of $8.1 million dollars, or $2 million per year (4x the rate it has grown in the last 4 years). $8 million would make an enormous difference to this roster, especially in the goaltending and defensive departments. Dubas was planning on it. The pandemic killed his plan.

Moving forward, the cap is going to continue to increase slowly for the next couple years (unfortunately). As a result, so tough roster moves are going to be neccessary, but that's the reality of the situation we've been left in. That said, I would not panic sell the Big 4, rather, I'd continue to build and tinker around them. Moves I'd make in the case of a first round exit would include...

Traded out / released in FA / money off the cap...

Jake Muzzin ($5.6 million)
Petr Mrazek ($3.8 million)
Alex Kerfoot ($3.5 million)
Justin Holl ($2.0 milliin)
Ilya Mikheyev ($1.7 million)
Phil Kessel ($1.2 million)

- I'd extend Lyubushkin and play him on the third pair with Sandin.

- I'd extend Giordano on team friendly, Spezza type deals, where he can play out the rest of his career at home.

- Liljegren and Sandin should be extended on bridge deals, with the understanding that they will get considerable raises when the cap starts to go up at a regular rate.

- I'd negotiate with Campbell for the sake of extension, however, I'm not paying him like a big time #1. If he wants a lot of money, I let him walk and start over with my goaltending.

Defense core would look like this...

Reilly-Addition
Giordano-Liljegren
Brodie-Lybushkin
Sandin

Forward core would start with...
C: Matthews
C: Tavares
C: Kampft
C: ?
LW: Bunting
LW: Robertson
LW: Blackwell
LW: ?
RW: Marner
RW: Nylander
RW: Engvall
RW?
13th: Simmonds

Essentially, you need 3 forwards from either your system, via trade, or FA, a partner for Rielly and a solution to the goaltending situation. The cap is going up $1.0 million. With a couple raises due (Liljegren, Sandin and Lyubushkin) and Rielly's raise kicking, you're tying up about $4.5-$5.0 million, assuming Giordano starts taking deals near league minimum.

You're going to have some money to add the forwards and goalies you need. Not a ton, but enough to make an impact.
 
Trade Willie for a young #2 dman with term, that can play with #44.
Rielly has been playing with Boosh against top opposition??? C'mon bruh

They have a #2 D man that can play with #44 TJ Brodie.

He did the vast majority of the season and then they went away from it for some reason
 
We've been watching different teams this series. I have seen a lot of heart and character. We just need to settle on our goaltending, and move a couple contracts such as Holl and Kerfoot to sort out the cap.

No matter what actually happens in a game, there are lots of fans that will say they lost because they have no heart or didn't try hard enough.
 
I have a hard time being overly "reactionary" in this situation and wanting heads to role. Not because I'm a "keep the status quo" type of guy, but because I think Dubas and Shanahan actually had a really good game plan, that was derailed by Covid-19 and salary cap stagnation. They're trying to pivot and adapt to what they have to work with, and, thus far, it's come up short, with a chance to take another step forward on Saturday night.

Like it, or not, when Kyle Dubas signed Matthews, Tavares, Nylander and Marner to the deals, he, Shanny, Pridham and company did so, like all other business people, by projecting out the salary cap moving forward. Absolutely nobody could have predicted multi-year cap stagnation, followed by multi-year minor cap growth, caused by a once in a lifetime pandemic. Did Dubas pay a little bit extra to get deals done with Tavares (who was reportedly offered more), Matthews and Marner? Yep, I'm not trying to deflect from that, or bury that reality. But when you talk about the deficiencies in goal and defensively, the honest reality, all emotion aside, is that Dubas was expecting to have about $90 million to spend right now, rather than $81.5 million. That lost cap space is the difference between this team being really good, and being an absolute monster.

For some context, in the last 4 seasons, despite a new TV deal and an expansion franchise being added to the league, the salary cap has grown only $2 million, due to the pandemic. In 2018-2019, the cap was $79.5 million, where as this year, it's $81.5 million. That's an average of a $500,000 rise in cap per year. For comparison sake, in the previous 4 years to that (2015-2016 to 2018-2019) the cap rose from $71.4 million to $79.5 million, a total of $8.1 million dollars, or $2 million per year (4x the rate it has grown in the last 4 years). $8 million would make an enormous difference to this roster, especially in the goaltending and defensive departments. Dubas was planning on it. The pandemic killed his plan.

Moving forward, the cap is going to continue to increase slowly for the next couple years (unfortunately). As a result, so tough roster moves are going to be neccessary, but that's the reality of the situation we've been left in. That said, I would not panic sell the Big 4, rather, I'd continue to build and tinker around them. Moves I'd make in the case of a first round exit would include...

Traded out / released in FA / money off the cap...

Jake Muzzin ($5.6 million)
Petr Mrazek ($3.8 million)
Alex Kerfoot ($3.5 million)
Justin Holl ($2.0 milliin)
Ilya Mikheyev ($1.7 million)
Phil Kessel ($1.2 million)

- I'd extend Lyubushkin and play him on the third pair with Sandin.

- I'd extend Giordano on team friendly, Spezza type deals, where he can play out the rest of his career at home.

- Liljegren and Sandin should be extended on bridge deals, with the understanding that they will get considerable raises when the cap starts to go up at a regular rate.

- I'd negotiate with Campbell for the sake of extension, however, I'm not paying him like a big time #1. If he wants a lot of money, I let him walk and start over with my goaltending.

Defense core would look like this...

Reilly-Addition
Giordano-Liljegren
Brodie-Lybushkin
Sandin

Forward core would start with...
C: Matthews
C: Tavares
C: Kampft
C: ?
LW: Bunting
LW: Robertson
LW: Blackwell
LW: ?
RW: Marner
RW: Nylander
RW: Engvall
RW?
13th: Simmonds

Essentially, you need 3 forwards from either your system, via trade, or FA, a partner for Rielly and a solution to the goaltending situation. The cap is going up $1.0 million. With a couple raises due (Liljegren, Sandin and Lyubushkin) and Rielly's raise kicking, you're tying up about $4.5-$5.0 million, assuming Giordano starts taking deals near league minimum.

You're going to have some money to add the forwards and goalies you need. Not a ton, but enough to make an impact.

this isn't reactionary

because it would be 6 years in a row that can't be reactionary

reactionary would have been after 2018

it's 2022
 
First, you do not strip the captaincy and embarrass the current captain like that.
It's been done numerous times throughout history. Obviously, it is not an ideal situation, but after an 0-8 record in series clinching games with Tavares as Captain, perhaps it would need to be seriously considered?

Second, Matthews has never been the captain at any level he has played at so why make him the captain?

Simply, because he's the franchise. When we need a big goal, when we need a big play, we all look to #34 to provide it. If giving him the C makes him even 1% more invested in this team than it is worthwhile IMO.
 
It's been done numerous times throughout history.

Just because it has been done does not mean that it should be done again.


Obviously, it is not an ideal situation, but after an 0-8 record in series clinching games with Tavares as Captain, perhaps it would need to be seriously considered?

How is he responsible?


Simply, because he's the franchise.

So what? Being the franchise player does automatically make one a good leader.
 
First, you do not strip the captaincy and embarrass the current captain like that. Second, Matthews has never been the captain at any level he has played at so why make him the captain?
Not giving Matthews the captaincy was probably one of the smartest things the Leafs have ever done. Takes some of the pressure off Matthews to not be the voice person in one of the biggest markets and allows him to just focus on playing hockey. The room knows he’s one of the leaders and that’s all that really matters.
 
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This is Keefe's first 82 game season as Leafs HC, and first playoff with fans. Not a good idea to get rid of someone that fast, especially if you are going to try and hire a big name to replace him.

Dubas has done a great job the Foligno mess was really the only bad move. It's really hard to blame him for anything, he's made some great signings and trades lately.

What player are you going to get rid of that you can replace with someone better?
I think you can sub out Holl Mrazek Campbell kerfoot and Muzzin with Gio boosh sandin liljegren Robertson and some legit top end goaltending.
 
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Can't see a scenario where Nylander is here if we lose to be honest. The new GM will be forced to make a huge shake up and Nylander is the only realistic move that could create that shake up. But yeah Dubas will most likely be gone and the new GM will but in a coach of their choice.
 
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I'd like to see Bettman get the axe. This sport has become a circus now under his watch.

Regardless of the outcome, I will at the very least be boycotting the regular season next year. I mkght catch the odd Saturday game for a period or two, but I feel like a fool watching this sport

"Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice (ten times?), shame on me"
 
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People who are advocating a blow up, you know what that entails right?

That's several years of basement finishes in the hopes that you draft lottery tickets that pan out better than the ones we had when this era started.

Or you are hoping that a Matt Duchene-esque deal lands in our laps for Nylander/Marner and we remain competitive while another team is bad for us.
And even that ignores that the Leafs were terrible for a long time, with periodic stretches of being good. Since the NHL implemented the draft, the Leafs have had exactly TWO #1 overalls. Do the "blow it up and reabuild" crowd realize that there's a good chance it's another 30 years before we see another #1? And that could just as easily be a Patrik Stefan?
 
And even that ignores that the Leafs were terrible for a long time, with periodic stretches of being good. Since the NHL implemented the draft, the Leafs have had exactly TWO #1 overalls. Do the "blow it up and reabuild" crowd realize that there's a good chance it's another 30 years before we see another #1? And that could just as easily be a Patrik Stefan?

I don't think there's a single person who wants to blow it up. But cap allocation has to be considered, and one of the core guys moved in my mind.
 
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Holy shit. Can you imagine Dubas feeling pressured into making a big trade? Jesus. Pennies on the dollar for 88? f*** that.

Win game 7 for god's sake.
 
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Bill and the Captain just dragged this team through game 6. Honestly I don’t think you move any of the big guys, regardless what happens Saturday.
There’s plenty of other money to juggle around to change the team up without giving away a ppg or better player because we’re upset about losing a hard battled series to the back to back defending champs.
Kerfoot muzzin Holl mrazek Campbell are $16.5m in cap to readjust the roster with if you want to talk about changeable pieces.
Yeah but they need to be replaced. We'd have no goalies and a big hole on D and 16.5 isn't all that much. Mik probably gone, Blackwell and Gio UFA, Kase, Engvall Lily Sandin RFA
 
I was firm that this was a last chance season here. I don't know now. Blowing it up might be a big mistake, grass isn't always greener etc. Let's discuss after we see what happens Saturday.
Blowing the team up isn't "might be a mistake" it's would be a mistake. They're in the top 10 of the league for the last 6 years and have made the playoffs and taken most series to 7 games without any luck. Quitting on the team after many years of bad luck is only going to lengthen the wait because of a new rebuild.
 
Blowing the team up isn't "might be a mistake" it's would be a mistake. They're in the top 10 of the league for the last 6 years and have made the playoffs and taken most series to 7 games without any luck. Quitting on the team after many years of bad luck is only going to lengthen the wait because of a new rebuild.

At the same time, Matthews contract is slowly creeping towards it's final year. If we ran it back and then lost in round 1 again, it would be a pretty terrible legacy.

Dubas is a very good GM, I think we should consider moving on if we lose again in the 1st round but only because he will never make the drastic changes which may be required. If we let him go, he would be hired immediately somewhere else and I would wish him all the best in the world. He's a really likeable guy.
 
I'd like to see Bettman get the axe. This sport has become a circus now under his watch.

Regardless of the outcome, I will at the very least be boycotting the regular season next year. I mkght catch the odd Saturday game for a period or two, but I feel like a fool watching this sport

"Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice (ten times?), shame on me"

no you won't you are like every person that says they are done done with the sport whenever there is a lockout and then the second the lockout is over they come back why? because they are addicted hockey is like crack to them.

You are no different you might say you will boycott the season but you won't because you are addicted the Leafs just like everybody else on this board, and you could argue HFBOARDS in general

Yeah but they need to be replaced. We'd have no goalies and a big hole on D and 16.5 isn't all that much. Mik probably gone, Blackwell and Gio UFA, Kase, Engvall Lily Sandin RFA

you can replace Kerfoot for less than 3.5 million, Bunting proved that.
 
Let’s hope we win so we can avoid all of the above.
However, if we don’t, I don’t think Dubas and the core should be blamed as harshly.
Against Columbus and Montreal, they totally owned the criticism, but this time we have been the better team and it’s some miracle Tampa is still alive. What can you say? There isn’t a scapegoat here this time.
Maybe a coaching change for sure. Is Trotz available? He managed to get the yearly playoff disappointment Capitals over the hump.
Obviously some hard change will have to happen because you can’t keep losing. But let’s see what happens.
 

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