HFBoards Top 32 Goalies - #11

[Lavar Ball]

Thanks to @LT for starting off these polls, gonna be picking up for him moving forward. Please leave Add suggestions in the comments!

Rank	Player	Votes	Team	GP	W	S%	GAA
1	Andrei Vasilevskiy	73/105 (70%)		63	39	.916	2.49
2	Igor Shesterkin	182/215 (85%)		53	36	.935	2.07
3	Juuse Saros	63/173 (36%)		67	38	.918	2.64
4	Ilya Sorokin	45/136 (33%)		52	26	.925	2.40
5	Connor Hellebuyck	71/167 (43%)		66	29	.910	2.97
6	Thatcher Demko	63/161 (39%)		64	33	.915	2.72
7	Jacob Markstrom	76/106 (72%)		63	37	.922	2.22
8	Frederik Andersen	37/133 (28%)		52	35	.922	2.17
9	Jake Oettinger	30/114 (26%)		48	30	.914	2.53
10	Darcy Kuemper	28/86 (33%)		57	37	.921	2.54
11

To Add:
Philipp Grubauer - SEA
Anton Forsberg - OTT
Karel Vejmelka - ARI

Click to read more...

 

[Buck Naked]

Fleury is just one year removed from a Vezina, he's next in line. Gibson is one year removed from.. Well, another bad season. And before that, another bad season. And so on...

 

[Ace of Hades]

Fleury>Gibson

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Its quite fascinating what's happening to Gibson.

When Markstrom won #7, Gibson had 3 times as many votes as Andersen.
Then Andersen won #8, Gibson had more votes than Oettinger.
Then Oettinger won #9, and Gibson had more votes than Kuemper.
Then Kuemper won #10

There appears to be a Gibson vote group, and then 'the field', the majority that ends up choosing the winner. The Gibson fanclub will only have their win when the rest the voters see fit.

 

[amnesiac]

Gibson

add: Forsberg

to add: Samsonov, Quick, Blackwood, Nedeljkovic, Hart

Fleury is just one year removed from a Vezina, he's next in line. Gibson is one year removed from.. Well, another bad season. And before that, another bad season. And so on...

now imagine if Gibson was on Vegas and Fleury on ANA

 

[Advanced stats]

No Ilya Samsanov yet? Disgraceful.
Should be top 3.

 

[Buck Naked]

now imagine if Gibson was on Vegas and Fleury on ANA

Now imagine if Anaheim was the only bad team in the league and Gibson was the only goalie there. Then wake up and look at what's real. There are plenty of goalies in this league with good numbers on bad teams. Even on Anaheim! Heck, even Stolarz is outperforming him (below)! Not to mention Kuemper in Arizona, Ullmark in Buffalo. Mackenzie Blackwood in New Jersey, Mikko Koskinen in Edmonton, Jonathan Bernier, Adin Hill, and many, many more. All these goalies outperformed him over the past three seasons. And then I'm limiting Kuemper and Ullmark's numbers to their time with bad teams.

	Goalie Stats
Rk	Player	Age	GP	GS	W	L	T/O	GA	SA	SV	SV%	GAA	SO	MIN	QS	QS%	RBS	GA%-	GSAA	adjGAA	GPS
1	John Gibson	28	56	56	18	26	11	172	1789	1617	.904	3.19	1	3236	28	.500	11	103	-5.6	3.28	9.3
2	Anthony Stolarz	28	28	23	12	8	3	67	809	742	.917	2.67	3	1506	15	.652	2	89	8.2	2.75	5.3

Why pretend things about Gibson when the evidence is everywhere? He's a bad goalie and has been for years. His GSAA over the past three years is on par with Brian Elliott.

Can you come up with any real arguments for him being the 11th best goalie in the league, without having to pretend or imagine things?

 

[amnesiac]

Now imagine if Anaheim was the only bad team in the league and Gibson was the only goalie there. Then wake up and look at what's real. There are plenty of goalies in this league with good numbers on bad teams. Even on Anaheim! Heck, even Stolarz is outperforming him (below)! Not to mention Kuemper in Arizona, Ullmark in Buffalo. Mackenzie Blackwood in New Jersey, Mikko Koskinen in Edmonton, Jonathan Bernier, Adin Hill, and many, many more. All these goalies outperformed him over the past three seasons. And then I'm limiting Kuemper and Ullmark's numbers to their time with bad teams.

	Goalie Stats
Rk	Player	Age	GP	GS	W	L	T/O	GA	SA	SV	SV%	GAA	SO	MIN	QS	QS%	RBS	GA%-	GSAA	adjGAA	GPS
1	John Gibson	28	56	56	18	26	11	172	1789	1617	.904	3.19	1	3236	28	.500	11	103	-5.6	3.28	9.3
2	Anthony Stolarz	28	28	23	12	8	3	67	809	742	.917	2.67	3	1506	15	.652	2	89	8.2	2.75	5.3

Why pretend things about Gibson when the evidence is everywhere? He's a bad goalie and has been for years. His GSAA over the past three years is on par with Brian Elliott.

Can you come up with any real arguments for him being the 11th best goalie in the league, without having to pretend or imagine things?

at least compare with goalies with similar GP..... come on, man! You think Stolarz (or any of those other goalies) maintains his 917 SV% over 56GP on ANA? please.

Kuemper had that one great season in ARI, and then played 29 and 27 GP the next 2 seasons. That said, I have no problem with having Kuemper over Gibson (or Jarry or Talbot for that matter)

As for Fleury, you could argue too, but his problem is age. His Vezina was 2 seasons ago. Were talking about today.

 

[Connor McConnor]

I’d take Swayman over any of these guys

 

[Evergreen]

Gibson is winning? What year is it? Gibson is not a top 15 goalie in the league at this point.

 

[Buck Naked]

at least compare with goalies with similar GP..... come on, man! You think Stolarz (or any of those other goalies) maintains his 917 SV% over 56GP on ANA? please.

Kuemper had that one great season in ARI, and then played 29 and 27 GP the next 2 seasons. That said, I have no problem with having Kuemper over Gibson (or Jarry or Talbot for that matter)

As for Fleury, you could argue too, but his problem is age. His Vezina was 2 seasons ago. Were talking about today.

Okay, let's talk about goalies who played more like Gibson. Among goalies with 5000+ minutes over the last three seasons he's 26th of 30 in sv% and GSAA, behind Blackwood, Koskinen, Reimer, and others.

If you go season by season among goalies with about the same workload:

19/20: 25th out of 30 in sv%, 26th in GSAA, behind studs such as Jonathan Bernier in Detroit and Linus Ullmark in Buffalo.
20/21: 23rd out of 27 in sv% and GSAA, behind studs such as Kevin Lankinen in Chicago and Anton Khudobin in Dallas.
21/22: 22nd out of 26 in sv% and GSAA, behind studs such as Carter Hart in Philadelphia and James Reimer in San Jose.

It doesn't matter how you break it down, he comes out as shit anyway.

 

[amnesiac]

Okay, let's talk about goalies who played more like Gibson. Among goalies with 5000+ minutes over the last three seasons he's 26th of 30 in sv% and GSAA, behind Blackwood, Koskinen, Reimer, and others.

If you go season by season among goalies with about the same workload:

19/20: 25th out of 30 in sv%, 26th in GSAA, behind studs such as Jonathan Bernier in Detroit and Linus Ullmark in Buffalo.
20/21: 23rd out of 27 in sv% and GSAA, behind studs such as Kevin Lankinen in Chicago and Anton Khudobin in Dallas.
21/22: 22nd out of 26 in sv% and GSAA, behind studs such as Carter Hart in Philadelphia and James Reimer in San Jose.

It doesn't matter how you break it down, he comes out as shit anyway.

Fair, he probably does get too much of a benefit of the doubt, riding off his seasons from 3+ seasons ago. I do still think if you put him on a slightly better team, hes better than what his ~904 SV% shows (much like Price in MTL).

Grubauer remains the best example of how going from a great D to bad D changes everything no matter who the goalie is.

 

[biturbo19]

Its quite fascinating what's happening to Gibson.

When Markstrom won #7, Gibson had 3 times as many votes as Andersen.
Then Andersen won #8, Gibson had more votes than Oettinger.
Then Oettinger won #9, and Gibson had more votes than Kuemper.
Then Kuemper won #10

There appears to be a Gibson vote group, and then 'the field', the majority that ends up choosing the winner. The Gibson fanclub will only have their win when the rest the voters see fit.

It feels like there's maybe a "Gibson vote group"...but at the same time, there's a pretty vocal "Anti-Gibson vote group". A sort of "anyone but Gibson" truthers sect.

It's definitely an interesting phenomenon, how polarizing he seems to be here. Feels a bit like the goaltending version of the "stats vs eye test" focal point player. Like a reverse Dougie Hamilton.

 

[Xspyrit]

Varlamov seems underrated to me

At the same time, he's on the decline like Fleury

Very hard to vote here, there's been a drop-off

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

i'll go with Binner but all these guys are interchangeable tbh

 

[Lavar Ball]

Bump

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Tough between Gibson and Fleury. Went Gibson.

 

[Buck Naked]

Tough between Gibson and Fleury. Went Gibson.

Thornton next up for best center as well?

 

[yzerman]

Thornton next up for best center as well?

No Lemieux