Confirmed with Link: Guentzel's rights traded to Tampa for 25 3rd

[Big Daddy Cane]

Are some of you this negative and/or emotional in real life? I’ve always wondered.

 

[bleedgreen]

Friedman definitely makes it sound like if we just agreed at 8x8 awhile ago we’d have him. For better or for worse we f’d around and found out. We didn’t say until Thursday we’d give him the deal he wanted awhile ago. By then teams are talking to him. We don’t have the luxury of playing that way with the big time players.

If this is TD I hope for the future he got his wings clipped and he learns from it. I doubt it.

Moving on. We’ll still be a good team.

 

[Justicebork]

Friedman definitely makes it sound like if we just agreed at 8x8 awhile ago we’d have him. For better or for worse we f’d around and found out. We didn’t say until Thursday we’d give him the deal he wanted awhile ago. By then teams are talking to him. We don’t have the luxury of playing that way with the big time players.

If this is TD I hope for the future he got his wings clipped and he learns from it. I doubt it.

Moving on. We’ll still be a good team.

If negotiations with UFAs are this static and linear we should just have basic computer programs conduct them. Bolt on some AI voice functionality to make it cute and consumable.

I think it likely that many here are oversimplifying the chain of events around JG's contract talks. Maybe not, though.

 

[User13452]

I can see us taking a run at stamkos.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

A 2 year deal is not desirable for either side. Management won’t want to walk him to free agency. Necas won’t want to wait 2 years to get long-term security.

Fiala and Reinhart signed 1 year deals in comparable situations and got traded the following Summer.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

To be fair, id rather see an engaged owner that at least has a good vision than the bullshit that is going on with the Panthers in Charlotte. But yeah, sometimes it's not worth winning the negotiation

We need a balance between Karmanos and Dundon. An owner that trusts the GM, trusts their money is being spent wisely, but otherwise stays out of the inner workings and just stays in the owner’s box enjoying the free drinks.

 

[bleedgreen]

If negotiations with UFAs are this static and linear we should just have basic computer programs conduct them. Bolt on some AI voice functionality to make it cute and consumable.

I think it likely that many here are oversimplifying the chain of events around JG's contract talks. Maybe not, though.

The story makes sense. They told us what they wanted and we sat on it too long. Maybe it wasn’t a real ask in the first place. Friedman tends to be well informed. I’m sure there were more twists and turns but it sounds very much like we had a chance before and now we don’t.

All that could change by Monday, time will tell. We’re not even at free agency yet. We had no idea we’d get Orlov. I think it’s fair to note that despite putting out the front that we thought Jake was worth it and the one to spend on - we didn’t get it done when we had the chance. Now it’s up in the air.

 

[dogbazinho]

I always thought JG was gone, really when we traded for him. I foolishly got my hopes up when I heard we matched the ask. The frustrating part is due to this uncertainty we aren't addressing other needs like D or maximizing a return for a player that clearly doesn't want to be here.

Many of the targets have been moved already and we're in a worse spot now than just missing a top line winger we didn't even start the season with. Let's see how July goes...

 

[Justicebork]

The story makes sense. They told us what they wanted and we sat on it too long. Maybe it wasn’t a real ask in the first place. Friedman tends to be well informed. I’m sure there were more twists and turns but it sounds very much like we had a chance before and now we don’t.

All that could change by Monday, time will tell. We’re not even at free agency yet. We had no idea we’d get Orlov. I think it’s fair to note that despite putting out the front that we thought Jake was worth it and the one to spend on - we didn’t get it done when we had the chance. Now it’s up in the air.

Agreed. And I remain optimistic about 7/1 and our team in general.

Still, the truth is literally always in the middle.

EF is likely getting that from the player's camp. I have no doubt that he is reporting what he is told, but obviously the Canes would not broadcast the details around a failure like this. Which means it is influenced by the biases and interests present in JG's camp. And JG's camp has an interest in making JG look spotless, even victimized, in all things.

 

[Chrispy]

Agreed. And I remain optimistic about 7/1 and our team in general.

Still, the truth is literally always in the middle.

EF is likely getting that from the player's camp. I have no doubt that he is reporting what he is told, but obviously the Canes would not broadcast the details around a failure like this. Which means it is influenced by the biases and interests present in JG's camp. And JG's camp has an interest in making JG look spotless, even victimized, in all things.

Agreed. For all we know, Carolina never budged on the offer and the agent is trying to drum up higher 7/1 offers for Guentzel.

Carolina’s side isn’t leaking this, and Guentzel’s agent only has one persons interest at heart in leaking that.

And it ain’t Guentzel’s, it’s his own.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Agreed. For all we know, Carolina never budged on the offer and the agent is trying to drum up higher 7/1 offers for Guentzel.

Carolina’s side isn’t leaking this, and Guentzel’s agent only has one persons interest at heart in leaking that.

And it ain’t Guentzel’s, it’s his own.

To be fair, the last time we tried this tactic of “Oh, we’re so close to signing this player, we’re gonna get it done, it’s going to happen” was Hamilton. And it came out afterwards that we made a single offer to him that was about $3 million/year lower than what he was getting/expected to get from FA, he (obviously) didn’t respond to such an offer, and we (apparently) sat around twiddling our thumbs, waiting to hear back from him. Even set some bullshit “timeline” about how we need his answer by this date, as if no response wasn’t clear enough.

This team cannot be trusted to negotiate contracts as long as Dundon remains as involved as he is. Even no-brainers like Rod’s new deal apparently almost fell through due to Dundon’s interference.

 

[robbieberns]

Necas one year prove it deal feels right for both parties. Necas isn’t getting paid off the season he just had, and if he doesn’t have an unreal bounce back year he’s not getting much less than he would get from a long term deal signed this summer anyway.

Even if we can’t work out a deal and it goes arbitration, it’s in his best interest to go beast mode next year even if he’s not happy about staying with us. If he puts up an 80 point year and still wants to leave we’d be trading from a position of strength at least.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I know the boy who cried wolf was eventually right, but was chicken little ever right?

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

To be fair, the last time we tried this tactic of “Oh, we’re so close to signing this player, we’re gonna get it done, it’s going to happen” was Hamilton. And it came out afterwards that we made a single offer to him that was about $3 million/year lower than what he was getting/expected to get from FA, he (obviously) didn’t respond to such an offer, and we (apparently) sat around twiddling our thumbs, waiting to hear back from him. Even set some bullshit “timeline” about how we need his answer by this date, as if no response wasn’t clear enough.

This team cannot be trusted to negotiate contracts as long as Dundon remains as involved as he is. Even no-brainers like Rod’s new deal apparently almost fell through due to Dundon’s interference.

This one, to be fair, sounds a lot more serious than Hamilton. At no time had we heard anything about the Canes matching offers.

 

[Brock Anton]

I know the boy who cried wolf was eventually right, but was chicken little ever right?

Yes. Brad Marchand was correct that Sam Bennett punched him.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The story makes sense. They told us what they wanted and we sat on it too long. Maybe it wasn’t a real ask in the first place. Friedman tends to be well informed. I’m sure there were more twists and turns but it sounds very much like we had a chance before and now we don’t.

All that could change by Monday, time will tell. We’re not even at free agency yet. We had no idea we’d get Orlov. I think it’s fair to note that despite putting out the front that we thought Jake was worth it and the one to spend on - we didn’t get it done when we had the chance. Now it’s up in the air.

Another possibility is that just a day or two ago Friedman was saying it was pretty much a done deal with Carolina and now that it’s not, he needs A reason.

I get he’s well connected, but Lebrun is the guy that seems to be the most legit with Carolina, at least when Waddell was here.

I personally felt like Jake was going to UFA from day 1, so it would be more surprising to me if he didn’t.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

We believe Friedman once and get burned.
We are going back to the well just to blame management. Maybe its just a second round of bad information

 

[Gurglesons]

I think Jake was always going to go to UFA.

He has a cup, he has been woefully underpaid and is most likely the best forward on the market.

 

[Chrispy]

To be fair, the last time we tried this tactic of “Oh, we’re so close to signing this player, we’re gonna get it done, it’s going to happen” was Hamilton. And it came out afterwards that we made a single offer to him that was about $3 million/year lower than what he was getting/expected to get from FA, he (obviously) didn’t respond to such an offer, and we (apparently) sat around twiddling our thumbs, waiting to hear back from him. Even set some bullshit “timeline” about how we need his answer by this date, as if no response wasn’t clear enough.

This team cannot be trusted to negotiate contracts as long as Dundon remains as involved as he is. Even no-brainers like Rod’s new deal apparently almost fell through due to Dundon’s interference.

Which is another reason the “Carolina moved to match Guentzel’s demands” seems like misinformation: it’s out of character for this front office.

 

[Brock Anton]

We believe Friedman once and get burned.
We are going back to the well just to blame management. Maybe its just a second round of bad information

It wasn’t just Friedman. LeBrun, Kaplan (who went as far to say that a deal was close to being announced) and Johnston all said things were moving in a positive direction.

They all couldn’t have been lying.

 

[bleedgreen]

Another possibility is that just a day or two ago Friedman was saying it was pretty much a done deal with Carolina and now that it’s not, he needs A reason.

I get he’s well connected, but Lebrun is the guy that seems to be the most legit with Carolina, at least when Waddell was here.

I personally felt like Jake was going to UFA from day 1, so it would be more surprising to me if he didn’t.

I think we’re going to be fed conflicting stories so it’s probably irrelevant. I also never believed he was staying, but had hoped at times. We’ll see what tomorrow through the week brings.

 

[chaz4hockey]

If you ask for 8x8, and the team says, yes, we will do 8x8 , then you drag your f***ing feet and say ehhhhhhhh no thanks, you still look like an ass. And why would you even care about looking like an ass to a team you will never play for again.

Every player in this league is a cock tease anyway.

I'll also add that if he would have signed for 8x8 weeks ago and we f***ed around with it and that led us to this? Yeah, eveything they say about our management is 100% true

His agent: NHL Contracts by Agent Ben Hankinson | Puckpedia

Friedman definitely makes it sound like if we just agreed at 8x8 awhile ago we’d have him. For better or for worse we f’d around and found out. We didn’t say until Thursday we’d give him the deal he wanted awhile ago. By then teams are talking to him. We don’t have the luxury of playing that way with the big time players.

If this is TD I hope for the future he got his wings clipped and he learns from it. I doubt it.

Moving on. We’ll still be a good team.

Private equity guys do learn so there is hope.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

It wasn’t just Friedman. LeBrun, Kaplan (who went as far to say that a deal was close to being announced) and Johnston all said things were moving in a positive direction.

They all couldn’t have been lying.

They all were convinced it was a done deal, but now that it’s not it means the Canes took too long? If the Canes took too long, why did they say it was a done deal a day or two ago?

My view from day 1 was that he was going to test the market regardless. The Canes offer just gave him ammo.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I don’t buy the 8 x 8 from the get go argument.

Lebrun said we were offering just under 8 over 8 years. I mean if its 7.75, thats 2 total million. If its 7.85 mil, its 1.2 million total. So the guy decided to go to FA because we didn’t offer 150k-250k each season from the get go? Sounds highly improbable

 

[Daeavorn]

I don’t buy the 8 x 8 from the get go argument.

Lebrun said we were offering just under 8 over 8 years. I mean if its 7.75, thats 2 total million. If its 7.85 mil, its 1.2 million total. So the guy decided to go to FA because we didn’t offer 150k-250k each season from the get go? Sounds highly improbable

Precisely, he just used us and our offer to show other team (like Tampa) what his floor value is so he can get at least 60 million.

Sucks but that's the way the cookie crumbles with our team.