Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Christmas Presents

[krutovsdonut]

The tried Podkolzin as an energy guy with better players. His cluelessness defensively limited him to limited minutes. The final straw IMO was Game 82 last year against Winnipeg where he was lost defensively on 3 different goals and turned in maybe the worst performance of his career, after they'd been doing everything possible to get him to sort these issues for 2 years. Again : this player was not tossed away lightly in terms of either effort or time. They badly wanted him to be part of this team going forward. He just didn't do his part.

Tocchet wanted to use Hoglander just fine last year. Hoglander played the best hockey of his career under Tocchet. The organization extended him. Then he regressed to the garbage play that made Green and Boudreau bench him, too. It's so tiresome hearing that Hoglander's problems are Rick Tocchet instead of the bad habits and low IQ that have plagued him for pretty much his entire career. Tocchet was the only one to actually fix these things, albeit temporarily.

the fact a player repeatedly struggles under a coach does not mean it is the player's fault. it also does not mean it is the coach's fault.

many such cases.

 

[Canucker]

Well one has 5 points in 30 games and is a -5 and the other has 14 in 29 and a +10. Why would the Rangers make this trade if they're trying to improve their team?

Kakko is a disgruntled player who likely wants out after being benched and Drury is desperate to get something changed before he gets shit canned...I'm leveraging that. I'm not completely averse to the idea of adding something but I certainly wouldn't be giving much more for a guy like Kakko who hasn't really shown much promise.

 

[bossram]

Kakko is a disgruntled player who likely wants out after being benched and Drury is desperate to get something changed before he gets shit canned...I'm leveraging that. I'm not completely averse to the idea of adding something but I certainly wouldn't be giving much more for a guy like Kakko who hasn't really shown much promise.

Not sure what I would add, but I would be trading Hoglander for Kakko instantaneously.

 

[bossram]

Seriously, especially now that we know Hughes doesn't need Hronek to dominate, a 2nd pairing anchored on a real 2LD with Hronek could really move the needle.

I'm not really seeing that.

Hughes is simply phenomenal, so he's going to tilt the play no matter what. But visually, I think his OZ offensive dynamism has been significantly hampered by losing Hronek. There is no other blueline threat, so opposition can play him very high and pressure him more. And there just isn't the natural chemistry/interplay, where we see Hronek and Hughes switching sides and overlapping frequently.

 

[Canucker]

Not sure what I would add, but I would be trading Hoglander for Kakko instantaneously.

Yeah, as much as I liked the "idea" of Hoglander, his play has not met his skill level....they really should have cut bait on him last off season...I think most fans saw his limitations despite the gaudy ES numbers. I'd do Kakko straight up, but I'm not sure how much he actually helps anything other that the potential cap space from not tendering him an RFA offer.

 

[dbaz]

for kakko id think youd be looking at like hoglander and a 3rd? or prospect/ pikc and prospect

willander, lekk, mynio, d petey, kudry i wouldnt include for him.

so youd be looking at one of the following:
alrikkson, bains, fernstrom, sassons, aman
+ a 4th/5h

 

[Wisp]

i will add, the 'it seems inevitable' thing - JT Miller getting traded seemed inevitable at one point and then traded Horvat. Boeser had requested a trade, Garland seemed on his way out. Things rarely go how we perceive.

I still feel like Miller isn't exactly the career Canuck type, would not surprise me to see him exit the town in a Kesler-like fashion even in the short term. He's the one who just came off needing a mid-season hiatus... Not that I fault him for that, but could see 'needing a reset' building to 'needing a change of scenery' very quickly.

 

[calnuck]

for kakko id think youd be looking at like hoglander and a 3rd? or prospect/ pikc and prospect

willander, lekk, mynio, d petey, kudry i wouldnt include for him.

so youd be looking at one of the following:
alrikkson, bains, fernstrom, sassons, aman
+ a 4th/5h

Hoglander, Desharnais and a 2nd?

 

[Nuckles]

Canucks scout at the Buffalo/Montreal game

 

[Canucker]

for kakko id think youd be looking at like hoglander and a 3rd? or prospect/ pikc and prospect

willander, lekk, mynio, d petey, kudry i wouldnt include for him.

so youd be looking at one of the following:
alrikkson, bains, fernstrom, sassons, aman
+ a 4th/5h

Honestly, if the goal is to try and get out of the mistake of signing Hoglander then I'd probably just prefer to trade him to some other team who would just assume his contract for nothing...I'm sure there is a team out there that with the cap space who could make a reclamation project out of him that we wouldn't have to pay additional assets for....but if the pro-scouts like Kakko and feel its a better proposition to add an asset and try to make something out of him, go for it...I'm just not sure how much its worth half a season to try and mine some value out of Kakko before dumping him as an unsigned RFA. I certainly wouldn't want to give up much.

 

[TruKnyte]

Kakko is a disgruntled player who likely wants out after being benched and Drury is desperate to get something changed before he gets shit canned...I'm leveraging that. I'm not completely averse to the idea of adding something but I certainly wouldn't be giving much more for a guy like Kakko who hasn't really shown much promise.

Sure, and that might work if we're the only team offering something. Would be surprised though if there's aren't better packages available.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Canucks scout at the Buffalo/Montreal game

So in summary (someone correct me if I'm wrong) -

- Friedman pulls a wild Vancouver/Buffalo proposal seemingly out of thin air
- Dhaliwal says the Canucks and Sabres have talked
- Dreger says that well placed sources say there isn't anything going on between Vancouver and Buffalo
- Pagnotta says the Sabres and Canucks have talked about Bowen Byram
- Buffalo has a scout in Vancouver last night
- Canucks have a scout watching Buffalo tonight

Is that all about right?

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Canucks scout at the Buffalo/Montreal game

Rich Peverley working.

Good for him.

 

[Rowlet]

Well one has 5 points in 30 games and is a -5 and the other has 14 in 29 and a +10. Why would the Rangers make this trade if they're trying to improve their team?

Because Kakko just publicly called out the team to the media

 

[wonton15]

Canucks scout at the Buffalo/Montreal game

The Blues sent who???!

 

[Vector]

Don't see a fit for Byram unless it's Willander+.

I'm trying to figure this out by using recent comparables.

 

[Nuckles]

Imagine if all this ends up being Hoglander for Jordan Greenway (50%)

I believe the Canucks were interested in him in the past, and they're rumored to want another winger. Could also be Zucker but he carries a higher cap hit

 

[Vector]

Imagine if all this ends up being Hoglander for Jordan Greenway (50%)

I believe the Canucks were interested in him in the past, and they're rumored to want another winger

The media, Dhaliwal especially, certainly pushed that the Canucks wanted Greenway. Was mostly seen as an alternative to Joshua, though.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

I'm trying to figure this out by using recent comparables.

Given mgmt also wants a W and Buffalo has a glut of them, perhaps a larger deal?

 

[Vector]

Given mgmt also wants a W and Buffalo has a glut of them, perhaps a larger deal?

Fully possible but those are harder to figure out. @Nuckles might be on the right track with Hoglander for Greenway. If you include Desharnais it's pretty much a wash cap-wise.

Maybe possible to make a much bigger trade that involved Byram. Could try to mimic the Hronek trade a bit and include the 1st and the Sabres would then be comfortable trading a 1st away for a different player.

 

[TruKnyte]

Because Kakko just publicly called out the team to the media

And so there's probably 30 other teams who are thinking the same thing.

 

[Rowlet]

And so there's probably 30 other teams who are thinking the same thing.

The question wasn't why would they take Hoglander, it was why would they consider moving Kakko.

 

[TruKnyte]

The question wasn't why would they take Hoglander, it was why would they consider moving Kakko.

I was originally responding to the first part if you go back to an earlier post. Read a little further back.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Fully possible but those are harder to figure out. @Nuckles might be on the right track with Hoglander for Greenway. If you include Desharnais it's pretty much a wash cap-wise.

Maybe possible to make a much bigger trade that involved Byram. Could try to mimic the Hronek trade a bit and include the 1st and the Sabres would then be comfortable trading a 1st away for a different player.

McLeod + Byram.

Move Suter to the wing and McLeod center the 3rd line.

 

[Hansen]

Fully possible but those are harder to figure out. @Nuckles might be on the right track with Hoglander for Greenway. If you include Desharnais it's pretty much a wash cap-wise.

Maybe possible to make a much bigger trade that involved Byram. Could try to mimic the Hronek trade a bit and include the 1st and the Sabres would then be comfortable trading a 1st away for a different player.

I do think that Byram could be a shrewd acquisition a la Hronek and it doesnt have to be an earth shattering deal. Hes in a tough spot behind Dahlin/Power.