Post-Game Talk: Game #56: Canucks lose 4-3 to the Jets

[Wolfhard]

The other half are going to make the playoffs

And the person who posted it said it probably can't get any worse. I'm my opinion it can get a lot worse than 12th in the league.

 

[iFan]

I'm not even mad anymore from loses... There expected now

 

[JSR84]

http://video.canucks.nhl.com/videocenter/?id=552513&catid=6

Kind of a cool segment.

 

[Johnny Canucker]

When phoenix plays their games in hand we will likely be out of the playoffs, maybe THEN people will start to see what i saw on opening day. A non playoff team, bad coaching, goalie that doesnt want to be here, and a thin, easy to play against team.

The first few games early in season vs san jose made me realize just what we have here

 

[opendoor]

This frame pretty much sums up what's wrong with the Canucks this season.

It's not that they're 'old and washed up'. It's not that injuries are becoming a factor.

It's this ********. Block all the Shots. Everyone wants to be a ****ing goalie because otherwise Torts will throw a tantrum.

It's awful to watch, it's ineffective on the ice, and it's really sad watching a team that still has some talent stumble like this.

This team looks like they're having exactly ZERO fun playing hockey. They don't want to be there, anything exciting and fun about hockey is being smothered into oblivion. This is the result we get.

Nice narrative, even if it's not backed up by anything substantial. The Canucks are 10th in the league in blocked shots and their offense is basically identical to last season. Blaming coaching for veteran players putting up junk performances is a huge copout.

This team reminds me of the 07-08 one. Still has some talent but the depth is razor thin and not good enough to sustain injuries combined with some down years from veterans. Unfortunately instead of having 27 year old Sedins, 28 year old Luongo, and 23 year old Kesler this team has a bunch of guys in their 30s.

 

[biturbo19]

Nice narrative, even if it's not backed up by anything substantial. The Canucks are 10th in the league in blocked shots and their offense is basically identical to last season. Blaming coaching for veteran players putting up junk performances is a huge copout.

This team reminds me of the 07-08 one. Still has some talent but the depth is razor thin and not good enough to sustain injuries combined with some down years from veterans. Unfortunately instead of having 27 year old Sedins, 28 year old Luongo, and 23 year old Kesler this team has a bunch of guys in their 30s.

Call it a "narrative" to dismiss it if you want...but this team looks EXACTLY like the Rangers team that got Torts fired. This style of game just doesn't work, and especially not with the sort of collection of players we have. Just go back and look through the GDTs from Rangers games last year and you'll see a direct copy of the sort of things we're going through right now.

It's not a 'lack of depth', it's a refusal to utilize depth. Instead, riding top players into the ground (and injury).

And the argument that this should be pinned on our "veteran players" and their "effort" is asinine in light of the fact that you're trying to paint this as not a coaching issue. Even if hypothetically, the Xs and Os aren't aren't kinds of wrong...wasn't the whole ****ing point of bringing Tortorella in here, to "yell at the Twins and stuff until they're more motivated"? In which case...you're suggesting he's completely failed in that as well. Which...might not be incorrect at all.

But that in combination with the system this team is playing now...it's just bad coaching all around.

 

[CanaFan]

And the person who posted it said it probably can't get any worse. I'm my opinion it can get a lot worse than 12th in the league.

We'll not much point counting league standing, since being ahead of eastern teams doesn't do much for us except get us a lower draft pick. So really we are 8th out of the 14 teams that matter so there are actually less than half of _relevant_ teams that would switch with us. Fall one more spot and we are actually in the *worst* spot of all, namely out of the playoffs but with the lowest draft pick possible. Rather we tumble further, try to pick up another blue chip kid like Horvat, then try again fresh next year sans the injuries and cap constraints. Squeaking into playoffs as the 8th seed and 99% likely get our ***** handed to us hold little appeal to me. If you aren't a contender you should be building for a contender, not hoping for a miracle.

 

[AlphaLackey]

Hey all, Jets fan coming in peace. I just wanted to say that we had a few Canuck fans commenting on our game day thread, and to a person, each and every one of them was respectful and polite, both during game time and even after. Gotta respect that awesomeness on your part; they were a credit to your fan-base, your team and your city.

So, should the Jets falter in the stretch, if it comes down to you and a certain desert-bound hockey team chasing that last playoff spot in the West, I know who I'd be rooting for, and I'll give you a hint, it's not the team Bettman will be rooting for

PS Trade us Lack; we'll give you Pavelec, a Double Gulp, a '68 Schwinn, and whatever's in Dustin Byfuglien's left skate.

EDIT: It could be anything! It could be lint, it could be an extra sock, it might even be $1!

 

[quat]

Hey all, Jets fan coming in peace. I just wanted to say that we had a few Canuck fans commenting on our game day thread, and to a person, each and every one of them was respectful and polite, both during game time and even after. Gotta respect that awesomeness on your part; they were a credit to your fan-base, your team and your city.

So, should the Jets falter in the stretch, if it comes down to you and a certain desert-bound hockey team chasing that last playoff spot in the West, I know who I'd be rooting for, and I'll give you a hint, it's not the team Bettman will be rooting for

PS Trade us Lack; we'll give you Pavelec, a Double Gulp, a '68 Schwinn, and whatever's in Dustin Byfuglien's left skate.

EDIT: It could be anything! It could be lint, it could be an extra sock, it might even be $1!

or, dare I say ... Mr Byfuglien himself!

Glad you enjoyed the game, and it's good to see the Jets turn things around of late.

 

[PRNuck]

Is it weird that at this point I'm just glad the game was clean without any after the whistle BS or diving/embellishing?

 

[biturbo19]

Hey all, Jets fan coming in peace. I just wanted to say that we had a few Canuck fans commenting on our game day thread, and to a person, each and every one of them was respectful and polite, both during game time and even after. Gotta respect that awesomeness on your part; they were a credit to your fan-base, your team and your city.

So, should the Jets falter in the stretch, if it comes down to you and a certain desert-bound hockey team chasing that last playoff spot in the West, I know who I'd be rooting for, and I'll give you a hint, it's not the team Bettman will be rooting for

PS Trade us Lack; we'll give you Pavelec, a Double Gulp, a '68 Schwinn, and whatever's in Dustin Byfuglien's left skate.

EDIT: It could be anything! It could be lint, it could be an extra sock, it might even be $1!

My money is on it being a piece of bacon or maybe a french fry.

 

[Wilch]

Would rather get lottery pick than suck ass in the playoffs.

 

[AlphaLackey]

My money is on it being a piece of bacon or maybe a french fry.

If you think Dustin Byfuglien would let anything that tasty get past his lips, you don't know him at all. Why do you think he has a beard? Mother nature's doggy bag!

Is it weird that at this point I'm just glad the game was clean without any after the whistle BS or diving/embellishing?

This is actually a very good point. Probably both the cleanest played and best officiated game in the NHL so far this year.

or, dare I say ... Mr Byfuglien himself!

Glad you enjoyed the game, and it's good to see the Jets turn things around of late.

Maybe Mr. Byfuglien himself. I think he's wasted on a mediocre team. He's a special asset that can turn a good team into a great one, yet here, he's a third line forward for the sole reason that, as shallow as we are at D, we're worse at forward. So yeah, because our universe has Chris Thorburn on the second line, Buff being a third-line forward is 'sane'. I'd rather he go to a contender for his true value, or ever 90% thereof.

But yeah; wins and losses not withstanding, every game under Paul Maurice, I've seen the Jets give it their all. They could run the gauntlet in reverse as long as they came with it every night, but the last couple months under 'dead man walking' Noël were torture. If nothing else, we'll spice up the West playoff race a bit.

 

[BoHorvatFan]

Would rather get lottery pick than suck ass in the playoffs.

That week of playoff games goes by pretty fast as we've found out the last two years.

 

[opendoor]

Call it a "narrative" to dismiss it if you want...but this team looks EXACTLY like the Rangers team that got Torts fired. This style of game just doesn't work, and especially not with the sort of collection of players we have. Just go back and look through the GDTs from Rangers games last year and you'll see a direct copy of the sort of things we're going through right now.

It's not a 'lack of depth', it's a refusal to utilize depth. Instead, riding top players into the ground (and injury).

And the argument that this should be pinned on our "veteran players" and their "effort" is asinine in light of the fact that you're trying to paint this as not a coaching issue. Even if hypothetically, the Xs and Os aren't aren't kinds of wrong...wasn't the whole ****ing point of bringing Tortorella in here, to "yell at the Twins and stuff until they're more motivated"? In which case...you're suggesting he's completely failed in that as well. Which...might not be incorrect at all.

But that in combination with the system this team is playing now...it's just bad coaching all around.

I never once mentioned effort. Burrows having trouble keeping up with Sestito's point pace isn't due to lack of effort; it's because he can barely make a pass at this point and has flubbed chance after chance. Daniel doesn't look like a 3rd liner because he's lazy or unmotivated. If anything, this team looks like it's working as hard as ever. They're just lacking a lot of talent either through injury or underperformance which has led to some ugly hockey.

I guess it depends on how much of an impact you think one good coach has vs. another or how big of a factor they are in individual player performances. Given that coaching changes have historically had little effect on teams' long term trajectories I'm inclined to think they only really have an effect at the margins. If they could completely turn around a team then why are they making less money than Jannik Hansen?

Look at NYR; it's not like they're doing any better this year after getting rid of Tortorella. They have a worse points % and they're a -14 compared to where they were last year in terms of goal differential. Not to mention Stepan, Richards, Nash, and Callahan are all producing at a lower rate compared to last year.

 

[Outside99*]

It is scary how bad the team is right now.

 

[Vancouver_2010]

When phoenix plays their games in hand we will likely be out of the playoffs, maybe THEN people will start to see what i saw on opening day. A non playoff team, bad coaching, goalie that doesnt want to be here, and a thin, easy to play against team.

The first few games early in season vs san jose made me realize just what we have here

we have an upgrade on coaching this year. Anyone is better than AV, in my opinion. He plays a big role on why we lost to Boston.

 

[arttk]

It is scary how bad the team is right now.

It's really scary how hard some guys are slumping.

Burrows: If the face shield is really affecting him that much, don't bloody play. His ****** performance is actually hurting the team more than helping it.

Booth: It's like he forgot how to use his stick.

Hansen: He needs to be in a role where he plays around 14 minutes.

Hamhuis: He and backdoor play should never be in the same sentence again.

Daniel: He needs to stick handle the damn puck and get to the middle of the ice and shoot it. It's like he is trying to pass the puck asap every time he gets it.

 

[biturbo19]

we have an upgrade on coaching this year. Anyone is better than AV, in my opinion. He plays a big role on why we lost to Boston.

He also played a big role in why we got there in the first place.

 

[Vancouver_2010]

He also played a big role in why we got there in the first place.

We have won a lot of games in spite of him, not because of him. There is no reason that we nearly choke away a 3-0 lead against Chicago, and there is no reason why we only score 8 goals in 7 games against Boston. Clearly AV hasn't prepared his team enough, despite given the necessary talent to succeed.

 

[604]

Main complain is that our team has no ability to kill a game off. When you are injury riddled and tied in the 3rd, you should be able to nurse the game to OT to at least guarantee a point.

Our team has been awful at being able to lock things down defensively (I know we have Bieksa and Tanev hurt).

 

[iFan]

It's really scary how hard some guys are slumping.

Burrows: If the face shield is really affecting him that much, don't bloody play. His ****** performance is actually hurting the team more than helping it.

Booth: It's like he forgot how to use his stick.

Hansen: He needs to be in a role where he plays around 14 minutes.

Hamhuis: He and backdoor play should never be in the same sentence again.

Daniel: He needs to stick handle the damn puck and get to the middle of the ice and shoot it. It's like he is trying to pass the puck asap every time he gets it.

Slumping? Booth and Danny aren't slumping their just not that great anymore, I've given up on Booth and I'm really hoping Sedin figures it out cause 7 million for what he brings is horrible. Hamhuis is having a down year and I hope to god he turns it around next year.

 

[HSD19]

Were still right in it because of how crappy everyone has played around us. But boy do we need to start getting points. Hopefully Hank is back soon and fully healthy.

 

[Blue Suede Shoes]

Would rather get lottery pick than suck ass in the playoffs.

But making the playoffs is a lottery ticket for the Stanley Cup... sure we're not likely to win - that's what a lottery is - but it's a chance! And Even a team like Chicago is only a bit higher than 1/16 odds imo. It's all about luck, getting puck bounces, and getting favourable officiating (so Boston has much higher than 1/16 chance...). And injuries. Injuries are a big part of it.

There's so much more to winning in the playoffs than just how skilled your team is on paper. I mean, we had the best team in the NHL bar none in 2011. How did that work out for us? We had the best team in the league again the following season, and nothing came from it. I don't really care about having the best team on paper during the season. All I want is


Now if we start to look like Calgary... maybe we should start aiming for high draft picks.

...But then again, isn't that what Edmonton has been doing the last 6 years? And what has it gotten them? (Besides being the laughing stock of the league). Sure they have some good NHLers, but every team in the league does also.

I say when you have a chance to compete for the cup, go for it. We could sell off our talent and rebuild and spend the next 20 years just trying to get back into the playoffs (as Edmonton may).

Now I'm not saying to go all in, because I don't think we have the team with which to try that. We're not talented enough. And to be honest, I'm looking forward to a reasonably high draft pick if we fall in the playoffs. However, I don't think we should be aiming for as high a draft pick (ie. as poor a finish) as possible. We shouldn't be aiming to become Edmonton. No one should be aiming to become Edmonton.

 

[AlphaLackey]

But making the playoffs is a lottery ticket for the Stanley Cup... sure we're not likely to win - that's what a lottery is - but it's a chance!

Quoted for truth. The there most coveted placings in the NHL are #1, #16 and #30. Didn't the LA Kings teach us anything a couple years ago? The Cup playoffs are a whole second season, and a short one at that, where anything is possible.