WC: Future of Slovak Hockey

[slovakiasnextone]

So it seems that Slovakia has only managed to maintain the spot in the top division of the IHWC thanks to Denmark beating Italy. While I don't believe that it reflects the state of Slovak hockey quite correctly (as way too many players have said no to the NT and the coaching is questionable as well), it has been no secret that Slovak hockey as a whole has struggled in recent years (despite the success of OG 2010, IHWC 2012 & U18 WC 2017).

One might say that the players born 1998 and 1999 and their result show that the tables might turn around soon. But it gets a bit more complicated when you look a bit further down. The ext classes of 2000 and 2001 haven't been faring well in international competition. Also several of the top 1998/1999 players started their career in a private hockey club in Bratislava playing in Czech competition and others have played pretty much their whole careers abroad (like Milos Roman who wouldn't be eligible for Slovakia had he ever obtained Czech citizenship). But the system of play was also thanks to the coach Norbert Javorcik (who is generally expected to become the next u20 naitonal team coach), representing a younger generation and a bit of fresh air in Slovak hockey.

Yet I want to beat the pessimist in me and see a brighter future for Slovak hockey. I remember times when my heart would beat faster when a IHWC game began and I want those times back instead of forgetting to check what time we were playing like I did today.

So onwads to the positive things. While the Slovak team was struggling against Italy and Latvia at the IHWC, 40 personalities met in Jasna in Slovakia for the first ever national hockey seminar. Among the 40 were former NHLers and NT players (such as Miro Satan, Miso Handzus, Richard Lintner or Igor Liba), coaches (such as Jan Filc or above mentined Norbert Javorcik), scouts (such as Rangers chief of European scouting Gajdosik), parents an Slovak federation employees. The Slovak federation compares this seminar to the Swedish one in 2002 and Finnish one in 2009.

The attendees signed the Memorandum of Slovak hockey and the results of the semiar will now presented to the regional federations etc.

One of the lecturers was the development manager of the Finnish ice hockey federation. It seems that Slovakia wants to be inspired by the Fnnish success of recent years which seems like a sound idea to me given that there are many similiarities between the two countries (saying this as someone who has lived in Finland for a bit).

I am hoping that we will see some actual results down the line and that in a few years we can look at this thread as the point where it all started to turn around.

Click to read more...

 

[Hesher]

Hiring an actual coach would be a good start.

 

[slovakiasnextone]

Hiring an actual coach would be a good start.

Cíger's contract expires after this season and as per the Sports law coaches for all the national teams need to be selected in a tender /not sure about this English word, I mean výberové konanie/

 

[ViD]

Can you explain why they iced this terrible team without their leaders ?

 

[slovakiasnextone]

Can you explain why they iced this terrible team without their leaders ?

Everybody else said no because reasons (injured, tired, too old, family etc.)

 

[Jakk123]

Can you explain why they iced this terrible team without their leaders ?

Well, we have almost no leaders. Everyone from the NHL declined either because of an injury or they had no contract. Or they simply didn't want to come. Or they are old. It might be a protest against current head coach, but if that's the case, I really don't know why don't they just say it out loud.

And leaders from Europe? Who? Reway had serious issues with his heart, Zaborsky ended his NT career. Jaros is injured (and it's kind of funny to consider him as a leader, even though I am pretty sure he would have been our best D-man). Bakos, who made 22 points in the KHL, somehow didn't make this team, although I wouldn't consider him a leader as well. Meszaros is also injured if I recall correctly and it's also kind of funny to expect him to be a leader. We don't really have any good players in Europe.

 

[Keyal]

And leaders from Europe? Who? Reway had serious issues with his heart, Zaborsky ended his NT career. Jaros is injured (and it's kind of funny to consider him as a leader, even though I am pretty sure he would have been our best D-man). Bakos, who made 22 points in the KHL, somehow didn't make this team, although I wouldn't consider him a leader as well. Meszaros is also injured if I recall correctly and it's also kind of funny to expect him to be a leader. We don't really have any good players in Europe.

Not talking about leadership but i also think that injured Ďaloga and Viedenský would help this team a bit (100% 1s line centre and defenceman).

 

[Elvs]

Slovakia won't see their glory days of their 70's generation again anytime soon, but I think they are slowly turning things around now. While they aren't scaring the "big 6" in a best on best anymore, they should continue to have an outside chance at bronze medals at the World Championships.

While not all of their prospects will pan out in the NHL, many of them should carve out nice careers for themselves in Europe and be useful for the Slovak national team. Their crops of players born in the 90's should be stronger than the 80's generation, at least depth wise.

Forwards:
Tatar
Panik
Dano
Jurco
Cehlarik
Reway
Viedensky
Bondra
Ruzicka
Bucek
Roman
Hrivik
Hudacek

Defensemen:
Jaros
Marincin
Cernak
Gernat
Fehervary
Bodak
Holenda
Rosandic

Goalies:
Tomek
Huska
Godla

As I'm not Slovak I might have missed someone. But I think this group of 90's players should let Slovakia maintain their position as the 7th-8th best hockey country. While Andrej Sekera is getting older, I think he could have many good years left in him still. The WC of 2019 is taking place in Slovakia. I think they will ice a pretty solid team then. With a good system in place, and a couple of lucky bounces, maybe they can challenge for a medal then.

 

[slovakiasnextone]

Slovakia won't see their glory days of their 70's generation again anytime soon, but I think they are slowly turning things around now. While they aren't scaring the "big 6" in a best on best anymore, they should continue to have an outside chance at bronze medals at the World Championships.

While not all of their prospects will pan out in the NHL, many of them should carve out nice careers for themselves in Europe and be useful for the Slovak national team. Their crops of players born in the 90's should be stronger than the 80's generation, at least depth wise.

Forwards:
Tatar
Panik
Dano
Jurco
Cehlarik
Reway
Viedensky
Bondra
Ruzicka
Bucek
Roman
Hrivik
Hudacek

Defensemen:
Jaros
Marincin
Cernak
Gernat
Fehervary
Bodak
Holenda
Rosandic

Goalies:
Tomek
Huska
Godla

As I'm not Slovak I might have missed someone. But I think this group of 90's players should let Slovakia maintain their position as the 7th-8th best hockey country.

I hope you're right but the 1984/1985 generation for example had good potential at youth levels. There were 17 Slovaks drafted into the NHL in 2004 and 2005. Only Mezsaros and Seker had sucessfull NHL careers, a few had good Euro careers but many of them are forgotten and became a part of the lost generation. The people in Slovak hockey have to work with the players you mentioned to make sure that they won't fade into history and that even if they don't succeed in the NHL, that they will become part of the core of the Slovak NT.

We will seewhat will happen with Reway. It is great news that he is back on ice after the serious illness he went through, but it remains to be seen how much it will influence his career.

 

[Jakk123]

Not talking about leadership but i also think that injured Ďaloga and Viedenský would help this team a bit (100% 1s line centre and defenceman).

Yeah, I forgot them. But still, that is just not enough.

 

[Jablkon]

That example with seminar just shows how things are sometimes done in Czech Republic and Slovakia. How long has slovak hockey been in crizis? Since 2005-2006? And ten years later there is a break up seminar. I mean its good and I hope you guys will be back on track soon. It will hopefully push also czechs in region. One just has to wonder why finnish and swedish crizis lasted 2-3 years and czechoslovak for more than decade.

That being said. If that seminar helps to set up clear and positive enviroment in slovak hockey federation, it will be good starting point. When guys in federation are not respected (also by their results,not only by names) you can hardly expect players to accept invitations to national team or to battle hard for your flag.

Btw are these issues with your hockey bosses already sort out or are there still these two fractions fighting against each other? This is crucial point imo.

 

[Jablkon]

Funny I found this article now http://www.hokej.cz/nastvany-ciger-se-oprel-do-sefa-svazu-dela-podraz-za-podrazem/5023290

Slovak coach criticizing sloavk association for not being very helpfull to slovak national team and even reducing its costs

 

[Jakk123]

That example with seminar just shows how things are sometimes done in Czech Republic and Slovakia. How long has slovak hockey been in crizis? Since 2005-2006? And ten years later there is a break up seminar. I mean its good and I hope you guys will be back on track soon. It will hopefully push also czechs in region. One just has to wonder why finnish and swedish crizis lasted 2-3 years and czechoslovak for more than decade.

That being said. If that seminar helps to set up clear and positive enviroment in slovak hockey federation, it will be good starting point. When guys in federation are not respected (also by their results,not only by names) you can hardly expect players to accept invitations to national team or to battle hard for your flag.

Btw are these issues with your hockey bosses already sort out or are there still these two fractions fighting against each other? This is crucial point imo.

Well, Ciger and Svehla were chosen by the previous president, Nemecek. Kohut is the current president, he was the candidate of the opposing side.

To be honest, I am really getting tired of this and I would really like to know the truth concerning the ongoing Ciger vs Kohut situation. People in our hockey should stop acting like children on a playground.

 

[Jablkon]

Well, Ciger and Svehla were chosen by the previous president, Nemecek. Kohut is the current president, he was the candidate of the opposing side.

To be honest, I am really getting tired of this and I would really like to know the truth concerning the ongoing Ciger vs Kohut situation. People in our hockey should stop acting like children on a playground.

I guess thats where it should start. Considering that most of current guys grew up during slovak hockey crizis, I would assume they had to make some big individual effort and commitment to reach their current level. They probably also experienced all that negative things in czech and slovakyouth hockey (I would say when it was generally known inCZ, it would be probably similar in SVK). Most of them, except Reway etc., are good pros. In such case its always hard to find motivation to play for your national team when you know you work for BMW and you have to work for much worse factory when even not everybody gives a **** about its reputation or results. I still have some feeling that our guys like Palat, Sustr etc. ( exactly from generation which had to make all by themselfs because we didnt probably teach them even powerskating) are very reserved towards national team. Why wouldnt they? In my opinion, and this would apply both for czechs and slovaks, once all responsible persons dont work together on clear target, it will never change much. That being said, constructive critics are also heavily needed. In this case, sad to say that, our enviroment here is probably not mature enough, when this "criticism" always ends up as personal or fraction war. I believe this is also one of the biggest differences between us and lets say swedes and finns.

 

[slovakiasnextone]

Funny I found this article now http://www.hokej.cz/nastvany-ciger-se-oprel-do-sefa-svazu-dela-podraz-za-podrazem/5023290

Slovak coach criticizing sloavk association for not being very helpfull to slovak national team and even reducing its costs

While I don't want to paint an idealistic picture of Kohut, I think everything that Ciger and Svehla say needs to be taken wjth a grain of salt:

- Ciger originally supported Lintner against Nemecek than he turned his coat when he was offered the NT coach position
- let's not forget the way Svehla handled communication with players last year (case Panik and Hrivik)
- last year Svehla didn't travel to NA to see players because there was no need, this year he complains that they weren't allowed to

Svehla and Ciger remind me of Slovak politicians who instead of taking the responsibility point the blaming finger at someone else. They have shown that they aren't the most capable in their positions. There aren't solely responsible for everything but they played a big role in the results at the past two IHWCs - Svehla through his communication skills and Ciger through the lack of coaching (PPs, goalie situation).

Plus the way they attack Kohut is way too reminiscent of the way that Lintner used to be attacked by Nemeceks supporters back when he campaigned for SZLH president. Sure Kohut told media that he wouldn't suport them in the future and all his talk about Satan az GM was done pretty early when Svehla was still GM, but it wasn't even a public secret that Kohut had not chosen Svehla/Ciger. There is the question why they didn't end after last season but that technically wasn't even in Kohut's hands.

 

[alko]

So it seems that Slovakia has only managed to maintain the spot in the top division of the IHWC thanks to Denmark beating Italy.

Actually, thank you should go to Libor Hudacek. He scored the goal to 2:2 in the 59. minute in game vs Italy. Without it, nothing could help us.

Anyway, worse cant it be. This is the level, Slovakia will never crawl under. Im sure about it. And it is good as a alarm. Now they realize, that something must really be done.

We are safe in 2018, so lets build a team for 2019 in Slovakia. Test young guys, talk with everyone that has the level to be there (Zaborsky...) and make a good head coach decision. Please, dont sign any foreign guy (like Mark Messier what was in game few years ago). We have good ones also at home.

 

[Jablkon]

While I don't want to paint an idealistic picture of Kohut, I think everything that Ciger and Svehla say needs to be taken wjth a grain of salt:

- Ciger originally supported Lintner against Nemecek than he turned his coat when he was offered the NT coach position
- let's not forget the way Svehla handled communication with players last year (case Panik and Hrivik)
- last year Svehla didn't travel to NA to see players because there was no need, this year he complains that they weren't allowed to

Svehla and Ciger remind me of Slovak politicians who instead of taking the responsibility point the blaming finger at someone else. They have shown that they aren't the most capable in their positions. There aren't solely responsible for everything but they played a big role in the results at the past two IHWCs - Svehla through his communication skills and Ciger through the lack of coaching (PPs, goalie situation).

Plus the way they attack Kohut is way too reminiscent of the way that Lintner used to be attacked by Nemeceks supporters back when he campaigned for SZLH president. Sure Kohut told media that he wouldn't suport them in the future and all his talk about Satan az GM was done pretty early when Svehla was still GM, but it wasn't even a public secret that Kohut had not chosen Svehla/Ciger. There is the question why they didn't end after last season but that technically wasn't even in Kohut's hands.

Quite a long post where in the end no one knows what the current situation is. It shouldnt matter who said what imo. If they are not able to commit their egos for sake of slovak national team, then what they are even try to do? Any sport organization which wants success needs to be clear, transparent and healthy and needs to have vision imo. Especially when we are competing with Canada, USA, Sweden and Finnland where they to some extent follow these basic conditions (Russia is specific case imo). Unfortunately slovaks and czechs seem they even struggle to set up this basic enviroment despite for example czechs arranged a lot of things in terms producing hockey quality. Still I can hardly say enviroment is totally healthy here. I am not even talking about producing elite NHL talent, just 50 points players.

Funny thing is that its not that complicated, once players feel your hockey program helped them grow they will come to WHC whenever they can imo. But sometimes I am wondering whats in Hossa's head when he comes to this from Blackhawks? Or the 2006 OG czech players who later leaked that they basically coached it by themselfes.

 

[slovakiasnextone]

Quite a long post where in the end no one knows what the current situation is. It shouldnt matter who said what imo. If they are not able to commit their egos for sake of slovak national team, then what they are even try to do? Any sport organization which wants success needs to be clear, transparent and healthy and needs to have vision imo. Especially when we are competing with Canada, USA, Sweden and Finnland where they to some extent follow these basic conditions (Russia is specific case imo). Unfortunately slovaks and czechs seem they even struggle to set up this basic enviroment despite for example czechs arranged a lot of things in terms producing hockey quality. Still I can hardly say enviroment is totally healthy here. I am not even talking about producing elite NHL talent, just 50 points players.

Funny thing is that its not that complicated, once players feel your hockey program helped them grow they will come to WHC whenever they can imo. But sometimes I am wondering whats in Hossa's head when he comes to this from Blackhawks? Or the 2006 OG czech players who later leaked that they basically coached it by themselfes.

Ok, so let's have a longer and (hopefully) more informative post. I wasn't able to write one previously due to time constraints and also because Kohut had not had the chance to comment on Ciger's and Svehla's comments by then, which he has done now (SOURCE).

Let's look at it comment by comment and reaction by reaction:

Ciger:
"I'm not happy that someone is talking such a long time ahead, that they aren't counting on you. When you know that you will no longer be there (in the future), how do you work?"
"He should have told me that he doesn't want me. I would go to do something else, such as spending time with my family. I don't want to talk to a person like that. He's not hones, it's a dirty trick after a dirty trick. But I stayed for the boys. I'm not a person who gives up a fight."
(He says that Kohut didn't call him like he claims): "He sent me a SMS, but that doesn't help you. For me it's false, like a game and that's not me. I like hockey and want to help Slovakia, I'm not a politician"

Kohut:
"I was in the locker room and I shook hands with every player. I was in the locker room prior and after a game. I talked to the boys and supported them, I even shook hands with the whole NT leadership.
Until now I didn't know about any tension (between him and Ciger). I had normal meetings with Zdeno prior to the IHWC, I shook hands with him during the IHWC. Before the team left for Cologne I was in the locker room, I gave a book to everyone, I was at a dinner with the players and leadership, I talked to everyone, so I don't know what happened."
"Friendship is one things, management is a different matter. Professional life taught me that contracts should be adhered and you have to let the people that you manage know ahead of time when you are no longer counting on them. I think that I acted in the way that I should have acted."


Ciger: "Some things don't work like they should. We can't be making savings on skates, food supplements or drinks. The young boys can feel this."

Kohut: "I think that everyone who watched the games can tell whether the performance of Slovak players was caused by skates, sticks or bad ice. I don§t think those were reasons for the Slovak team to perform how they did. We need to do a depth analysis of everything that happened at the IHWC, then we can take precautions to help Slovak Hockey develop." "Did you feel as though the players didn't have skates on the ice? What he is talking about were reserve skates. They were given to all players who asked for them. The players had 100% conditions. That wasn't the problem. Slovak hockey has much larger issues than skates and sticks. I think that it's a bit unfair what's happening now. I came to hockey with the ambition to make order in Slovak hockey, to get the right people to the right positions and this is the mission that I'm working with."

There have been similar complaints made by some of the people from the u16 and u17 teams. General secretary of the federation claimed that this was in order to make things more effective and save money, claiming that players would get for example gels that they had no idea how to use and this was a waste of money. SOURCE


Ciger:"One year there is a boycott, the next year there is a sabotage. This wasn't a boycott, this was a sabotage. And an intended one which makes me angry. Nobody knows who is responsible. Not everyone wanted to play for the NT, they didn't help the young boys. Hats off to them, but sadly everyone is just ciritcising and looking for faults. That's our mentality"


"Kohut:This is not a new thing that needs to be communicated now. I said prior to the IHWC that order needs to be done in all areas. EVen in the way a player approaches the NT. I told the players that if they are injured or are out of shape that they should tell us. And if they aren't able to work with the NT leadership that it's better if they don't come to the IHWC as they would cause bad atmospehere in the locker rooms. That was my statement. Nothing has changed about that.

Kohut mentioned this in an interview prior to the IHWC, he also mentioned that he didn't let Ciger and Svehla travel to NA to meet with the players as they skyped instead. Why are Ciger and Svehla bringing attention to these facts now after the IHWC and long after Kohut said them?

And the whole thing with sabotage. Perhaps he should recall the way he and Svehla handled the players last year case Panik SOURCE, case Hrivik SOURCE)

And then there's Ciger's girlfriend and her personal attacks aimed at Slovak players on social media:

SOURCE from last year

and on Lintner (foul language as a bonus):
http://sportky.zoznam.sk/c/162236/c...lintnera-on-to-rozd-be-ale-ma-teple-miestecko

and now she's sharing this (a post which is blaming Miro Satan of all people for the performance of the Slovak NT):
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...41117304.1073741826.1336357108&type=3&theater

One has to wonder why some players might not have wanted to play under Ciger...must have been some huge conspiracy organized by Lintner and Satan

/sorry about the crappy translations/

 

[tobu]

I'm not even going to read the post above. It's better that we mark a period behind it all, because it does no longer matter who said what and who did what. Ciger and Svehla are done and all energy should be focused on what's next. New federation management, new team management and hopefully a new approach in a better atmosphere. We have two years to experiment without repercussion, let's get the best available players in the team, lets practice the hell out of getting a working hockey system on ice with the team as well as a two way respect between players and the federation.

 

[Canuckistani]

With so few top-tier hockey nations to begin with, it really sucks to see Slovakia fall from grace. A contender throughout the early 2000s, semifinalists in Vancouver 2010, silver at 2012 WHC, and then a massive slump.

I looked up Slovakia's records over the past five years vs the top-six...

At the WHC from 2013-2017, they're 2-14 with only one QF appearance.

In Sochi, 0-3.

At the World Juniors, 3-18 - with all three wins during a surprise bronze-winning performance in 2015.

More of the same at the U-18s: 2-15.

Worst of all, they seem to regularly lose to the likes of Denmark, Latvia, Norway, Slovenia etc.

Hope they can get back on track soon.

 

[slovakiasnextone]

I'm not even going to read the post above. It's better that we mark a period behind it all, because it does no longer matter who said what and who did what. Ciger and Svehla are done and all energy should be focused on what's next. New federation management, new team management and hopefully a new approach in a better atmosphere. We have two years to experiment without repercussion, let's get the best available players in the team, lets practice the hell out of getting a working hockey system on ice with the team as well as a two way respect between players and the federation.

This is true, I just wanted to elaborate on what happened as Jablkon pointed out Ciger's commentary.

Whom do you see as the new coach/GM?

 

[QnebO]

I'm not even going to read the post above. It's better that we mark a period behind it all, because it does no longer matter who said what and who did what. Ciger and Svehla are done and all energy should be focused on what's next. New federation management, new team management and hopefully a new approach in a better atmosphere. We have two years to experiment without repercussion, let's get the best available players in the team, lets practice the hell out of getting a working hockey system on ice with the team as well as a two way respect between players and the federation.

I read it, seemed classic "Start losing->not fun -> every one blaming each other for losing -> no one taking responsibility" situation.

I dont even know what that was that I just read, but it doesn't sound good. Apparentally they're also saving money on minor stuff like sticks or food and stuff.

 

[PapaQ]

New GM most likely Miro Satan.

I think the change needs to come from within the organization first, start replacing all the relics of the old era, one by one. Get more experienced people involved (including retired players), generally people who really care about hockey.

 

[slovakiasnextone]

I read it, seemed classic "Start losing->not fun -> every one blaming each other for losing -> no one taking responsibility" situation.

I dont even know what that was that I just read, but it doesn't sound good. Apparentally they're also saving money on minor stuff like sticks or food and stuff.

They were saving on those things, but the reason why they did were supposedly the debts of the previous federation leadership. The new president is a manager from the private sector and his tactics in this regard sound like the tactics of a few managers that I have worked with.

Supposedly they went to extremes especially with the u16 and u17 team, but hopefully it will change once they pay the debts and the federation is no longer in a crisis regime.

For example Ciger complained that the players didn't get skates. He was referring to reserve skates and all the players who asked for them got them. Why should they give them out to the players who didn't?

Everyone in Slovak hockey always complains that there is no money, so it's refreshing to see someone actually do something to save some (albeit in a fashion that's a bit overboard).

 

[ThrashersfanSVK]

I think the change needs to come from within the organization first, start replacing all the relics of the old era, one by one.

Almost done already. Jozef Frühauf, Andrej Výboh, few people from SZĽH registry or media officer have quitted.