ToneDog
56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
You think the GM who signed Mrazek last year can find somebody cheap that can step up when it matters?
Freidman: don't expect Campbell to be back Leafs inital offer was 2.75 million per year
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Kuemper is making it very obvious you don't need good goaltending to win.
There are like 5 goalies I'd pay good money for in this league, Campbell is not one of them.
There are like 5 goalies I'd pay good money for in this league, Campbell is not one of them.
Dubas has stuck with this vision of not expending high draft capital on a goalie prospect and running a 1A/1B tandem for less cap hit.
It never made sense from the jump. You have a top heavy cap allocation which handicaps icing four deep lines. So with a tandem, you have an average at best starter playing half the game behind sub par bottom six talent and the other half behind offensively minded stars in the top six. Not to mention a D-core built around an OFD in Rielly.
The tandem approach works with a balanced cap allocation, a defensively minded blueline built around a horse like Slavin/Pietrangelo/etc., and four competitive two-way forward lines.
It's a fine logic in a vacuum considering the amount of 1st rd goalie selections that bust and the inconsistent nature of the average goalie's career, but this is not the team build for that approach.
Gibson is the best option right now and his term bides you time to draft and develop a future homegrown starter, but you have to start spending top 60 picks to do that. Campbell/Kuemper/Blackwood/etc. caliber starters are only going to get more exposed as Muzzin, Giordano and Brodie age out.
It never made sense from the jump. You have a top heavy cap allocation which handicaps icing four deep lines. So with a tandem, you have an average at best starter playing half the game behind sub par bottom six talent and the other half behind offensively minded stars in the top six. Not to mention a D-core built around an OFD in Rielly.
The tandem approach works with a balanced cap allocation, a defensively minded blueline built around a horse like Slavin/Pietrangelo/etc., and four competitive two-way forward lines.
It's a fine logic in a vacuum considering the amount of 1st rd goalie selections that bust and the inconsistent nature of the average goalie's career, but this is not the team build for that approach.
Gibson is the best option right now and his term bides you time to draft and develop a future homegrown starter, but you have to start spending top 60 picks to do that. Campbell/Kuemper/Blackwood/etc. caliber starters are only going to get more exposed as Muzzin, Giordano and Brodie age out.
.920 save % 3 of the last 4 years.
Yeah he's ass.
The avs have 7.5 mil invested in goalies (6.5 after they paid a hefty price for retention). With an upper tier D.
We should run mrazek and see what happens though
BayStBullies
Burn the Boats!
- Apr 1, 2012
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Are you watching the playoffs?
He's been terrible, he has a .898.
Kuemper is a good goalie but has been terrible all playoffs, are you suggesting the regular season is important now?
Has played well enough when they need him to.
I'm sure you good with running with mrazek and Kallgren since goal tending doesn't matter then
Fogelhund
Registered User
- Sep 15, 2007
- 24,381
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Francouz's cap hit is $2 mil, his salary $1.7 mil
Kuemper's cap hit is $4.5 mil, his salary is $5.5 mil... note Kuemper had $1 mil salary retained by Arizona.
So Goalie Cap hit is $5.5 mil, and salary is $6.2 mil.
Kuemper is 1m retained. Colorado is spending 3.5m on Kuemper and 2m on Francouz. They have 5.5m allocated to goaltending.
Fogelhund
Registered User
- Sep 15, 2007
- 24,381
- 29,517
I was editing as you posted. Correct.
Note also... Kuemper has played well enough to get them this far... but he probably cost them the game last night. Second best goalie for sure. The goal on Rutta was pretty weak. Leafs always have the second best goalie, and it seems to cost us.
If you look at who Colorado has played, it was mostly Ingram, Husso, and Smith... Kuemper has not had to play well for obvious reasons (good team in front of him, and battling bad goalies).
Colorado basically had two "lucky" things happen to them that allowed them to get where they are.
They randomly had a terrible year that led to Makar (I don't think that could happen to us, our players are too consistent) and they had their arguable best player break out after he signed his contract, the opposite happened to us.
ToneDog
56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
Kadri, Byram, Girard, Toews, Nichuskin, Burakovsky, Manson, kuempher, Sturm, lehkonen, cogliano were also strokes of luck.
Why can't we be so lucky ?
Dreakmur
Registered User
It’s not luck.
We managed the cap poorly, so we can’t afford to bring in most of the players that would make us better.
You listed a lot of futures given up and a lot of mediocre players, I pointed out the biggest factors in their success, feel free to dispute Mac growing into an 11 million dollar player and them having a fluke terrible season to draft Makar as the biggest factors of their success.
Kuemper, Manson, Strum, and Cogliano, are all replaceable.
The Duchene trade was great for them, a good trade (Byram, Girard)
Kadri has not been good in the playoffs for them outside this year, and they are currently 1-1 against their first real test with him in the lineup, good player, not sure he is a difference-maker.
Toews was a good trade, hugely overrated D though (good job Lou)
I don't think Nichuskin was some secret, but good on Sakic pitching him to sign there.
Burakovsky is a good trade.
Not seeing some crazy GM moves, it has taken Sakic 10 years to get here, he's made some good moves along the way, but I still think the greatest thing to happen to him was the 48pt season and Mac breaking out after he signed his contract.
Colorado managed the cap well by making sure their best player didn't get good until after he signed his contract, otherwise he is making close to McDavid money.
Jmo89
Registered User
- Mar 21, 2010
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Yep. Campbell doesn't take all of the blame, but you simply can't win with his OT numbers.
And if the argument is that the only goalies available are more of the same, then I guess it's better they get more of the same for a cheaper price or at least with the potential to not have a 625 save percentage in OT.
ToneDog
56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
While I don’t disagree with the conclusion you arrive at that this team would be better off with a clear cut #1 goaltender than a tandem situation, I don’t really agree with some of the assessments you make along the way there…
1) I disagree with calling our star forwards offensive minded, as that carries a negative connotation. All star forwards generally speaking are offensively minded, the insinuation of qualifying our players as such is that they aren’t very good defensively, which is far from true. In fact, our collection of star forwards are closer to among the better two-way stars you’ll find in the league.
2) There’s nothing inherently wrong with building around an offensive defenseman on the backend. Really just comes down to ensuring you are surrounding with the right pieces. I think we looked dramatically closer to that this year than any in previous memory, but I would like to see us find more bite in front of our net. Can’t just be Muzzin and Lyubushkin doing it.
Those are my only issues. Otherwise, good post
I think the Leafs have a good young team with a bright future.
They have enough veteran leadership to carry them. Most of their key players are in or approaching their prime years. This year – for the first time in a long time – they have no dead contract space. They're coming off a very successful regular-season, and another first-round playoff loss to the two-time defending Stanley Cup champions who are now going into the sixth game of the Stanley Cup final.
As with almost every other contending team, there are salary-cap pressures and holes in the lineup. I don't think there is an all-star team at every position at bargain basement prices in the National Hockey League.
Like every other team, the Leafs could do better, but on the whole I like the direction they're heading and I'm looking forward to next year.
I don't really care so much about water that's already passed under the bridge.
They have enough veteran leadership to carry them. Most of their key players are in or approaching their prime years. This year – for the first time in a long time – they have no dead contract space. They're coming off a very successful regular-season, and another first-round playoff loss to the two-time defending Stanley Cup champions who are now going into the sixth game of the Stanley Cup final.
As with almost every other contending team, there are salary-cap pressures and holes in the lineup. I don't think there is an all-star team at every position at bargain basement prices in the National Hockey League.
Like every other team, the Leafs could do better, but on the whole I like the direction they're heading and I'm looking forward to next year.
I don't really care so much about water that's already passed under the bridge.
thusk
Registered User
Manson is a good exemple how playing in a trash team and switch to elite team can make all the difference of the world...
How many people here was talking about manson who was trash or not even more a good dman and now how many still considerate Manson like an awful D?
Sure when youre team is trash and unable to keep the puck and you played like 3/4 of the game without the puck sure as dman or goalie you will be expose...
Nylanderthal
Registered User
- Jun 9, 2010
- 7,901
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I don’t think many consider Manson as suddenly good. He’s been pretty pedestrian these playoffs and not really a factor in their success at all.
Colorado is still in the finals without giving up those assets.
I see you’re gonna try and twist this into give up the farm for a .904 goalie and no one’s buying what you’re selling
DarkKnight
Professional Amateur
- Jan 17, 2017
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thusk
Registered User
We dont talk about superstar but a good 4th dman like giordano. And yes he had an impact like gio had an impact... like lehkonen, compher and a lot of depht player had a huge impact... sur he didn't have as much impact of makar but you dont expevt it from a 4th to be better than your #1
Gibson we talk about the most importsnt player on the ice.
No goalie in the NHL had a wordload as hard than Gibson. He played with one of worst offensive and one of worst defensive.
Kuemper when he had his huge season in arizona, arizona was 14 th in GAx and 18 in scoring chance against
Since 4 season anaheim are 29 th in scoring chance against and GAx They are 30 th of 31 in high danger chance ( only chicago was worst)
Larcos_Unal
Registered Nurse
Let me get this straight:
You gave perennial plug underachiever sieve useless bastard Mrazek $3.75 for 3 years.
You offer All-Star, dependable, likeable, loved by his team Campbell $2.75 per year.
Dubas will die by this sword
You gave perennial plug underachiever sieve useless bastard Mrazek $3.75 for 3 years.
You offer All-Star, dependable, likeable, loved by his team Campbell $2.75 per year.
Dubas will die by this sword
Dependable is not a good way to describe a goalie who collapsed until he was unplayable in his only starter role season. By all star I assume you mean because he played in the nhl all star game, not generally speaking. But he will get a premium somewhere and good for him.
The Mrazek deal was so bad though. Scrambling at its finest.
