Five members from Canada’s 2018 world junior team (Hart, McLeod, Dube, Foote and Formenton) told to surrender to police, facing sexual assault charges

[Danarqhy]

If Formenton is cleared, he will more than likely get another crack at the NHL. It’s no different than Virtanen

If Formenton is "Player 1", he is not "getting cleared". The prosecution might not be able to convict beyond a reasonable doubt, but it's very clear just from the facts that are agreed upon by both parties that he pulled a fast one on this girl, broke her trust and took advantage of her. This is either a case of no consent, or dubious consent at best. If a team signs a player like that, this will create a massive shitstorm not only for the team but also for the league. He is done.

 

[HBK27]

It’s highly unlikely that he comes out of this unscathed

100% agree.

None of the accused players are coming out of this unscathed. I'm just saying that at this point, we have no clue how this could go if they are not found guilty - I don't think it's a slam dunk either way that some teams might offer them a contract vs. them unofficially being blackballed from the league. I think that depends on what details emerge from the case.

Again, a long, long way to go before that even becomes a remote possibility.

 

[Ezekial]

If you're going to say that something is "exactly what you said", how about you quote exactly what I said.

For example, you are claiming that I am "placing blame on the women", when I specifically wrote "if these allegations are true the players themselves are 100% at fault".

Again, you are so far away from actually grasping what I wrote...which really isn't all that complicated.

How do you feel about men "getting shit faced and heading up to a hotel room with a woman they just met"

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Can the players accept a plea deal? It means the end of the hockey careers. Seems to me they have little incentive to plea unless there is very strong evidence supporting a conviction.

Huh? Please explain how taking any hypothetical deal would end their careers...?

 

[4thline]

It’s highly unlikely that he comes out of this unscathed

I can't see how they do. They might avoid conviction, but it's unlikely to be pretty.
Unless all 5 plus the 3 witnesses sing the exact same tune (and provide evidence to make it believable) of her being a cheerful enthusiastic participant who is lying through her teeth, they're going to look like unmitigated pieces of shit regardless of the legal result

That's a very hard tune to sing if there's video evidence of a visibly upset girl barely keeping it together. How do you deny her crying and being visibly upset if she's recorded wiping tears? If perhaps there's worried texts between them the next day noting her unhappiness/ upsetness? If one of the witness players has given a statement acknowledging it? When you've admitted to police that you wanted the video because you were afraid of her going to the police? (Why Player 1, what made you scared that this cheerful enthusiastic participant would go to the police?)

If it's established that her account is accurate and she really was upset and not acting "into it" maybe you can use the videos to mount a technical legal defense and plant reasonable doubt that since she said it was ok and didn't fight like hell to get out that you couldn't have known she didn't want it. But doing so is tantamount to hanging flashing sandwich board around your neck proclaiming "I'm a predatory asshole devoid of empathy"

 

[MXD]

Huh? Please explain how taking any hypothetical deal would end their careers...?

Any hypothetical deal would involve pleading guilty to ... well, something.

 

[Cosmix]

I believe Arizona terminated Galchenyuk's contract over 'material breach' after he was only arrested

It depends upon the contract text and legal precedents related to what employers may do and not do. Being accused of something could have a penalty attached to it (e.g., a suspension); however, if the person is not found guilty in a court of law the punishment b y the employer would be affected. Perhaps one of our lawyer commenters can provide some insights.

 

[HBK27]

How do you feel about men "getting shit faced and heading up to a hotel room with a woman they just met"

Also putting themselves in a potentially bad situation and something I 100% will discuss with my sons as they get older.

It's obviously a bit of a different situation for men versus women, as men are unlikely to be physically overpowered by a woman or sexually abused. Still, they put themselves at an increased risk of being falsely accused of sexual misconduct for whatever reason.

 

[Darcy Tucker]

How do you feel about men "getting shit faced and heading up to a hotel room with a woman they just met"

It happens every night to many people. They're just getting scape goated because they're hockey players with nice incomes.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Any hypothetical deal would involve pleading guilty to ... well, something.

Obviously. If they were accepting a hypothetical deal though, you'd certainly think it would be something pretty minor with no possiblity of jail

If that's your line of thinking, their careers are already over then. Being acquitted of more serious charges in a trial won't do anything to move perception. Perhaps even the case being thrown out wouldn't either.

Other than a potential starting goalie, the guys we think being charged are all role players anyway. That goalie has been very up and down in his career, too.

In terms of getting another chance, the talent of the players matters, whether right or wrong.

 

[Ezekial]

It happens every night to many people. They're just getting scape goated because they're hockey players with nice incomes.

You really think they're just being scapegoated because they have money?

Weird, I think someone invited his buddies over to take advantage of a person sexually.

We'll see how this plays out.

 

[4thline]

Still, they put themselves at an increased risk of being falsely accused of sexual misconduct for whatever reason.

Also, and more importantly- increased risk of committing non-violent sexual misconduct, on a spectrum from simple impairment of their emotional intelligence/ ability to accurately read and appropriately react to the behaviour of their sexual partner, all the way to impaired judgement/loosening of inhibition causing them to act in ways they wouldn't normally.

 

[inthewings]

If Formenton is "Player 1", he is not "getting cleared". The prosecution might not be able to convict beyond a reasonable doubt, but it's very clear just from the facts that are agreed upon by both parties that he pulled a fast one on this girl, broke her trust and took advantage of her. This is either a case of no consent, or dubious consent at best. If a team signs a player like that, this will create a massive shitstorm not only for the team but also for the league. He is done.

Yeah, agreed. There isn't going to be a situation where Player 1 is completely exonerated and welcomed back to the NHL. This will, at best for the players, be a situation where shady things happened, but the crown couldn't quite meet the evidenciary standard for a conviction. The court of public opinion has a different standard. I don't think any of these 5 players are playing another NHL game, regardless of how things play out in the courtroom.

 

[GeoRox89]

Huh? Please explain how taking any hypothetical deal would end their careers...?

Mitchell Miller is persona non grata in the NHL. It’s incredibly difficult to imagine a world wherein any NHL team or the league itself is prepared to sign or play anyone who pled guilty (even to a lesser charge) in this case

 

[Ezekial]

He’s not wrong. It happens in every sport, every business, everyone who has power and everywhere in the world. Sad but true.

People with money and power never commit sex crimes.


Who was that guy that flew rich, famous, and powerful people to an island to commit sex crimes? I forget.

 

[shaner8989]

People with money and power never commit sex crimes.


Who was that guy that flew rich, famous, and powerful people to an island to commit sex crimes? I forget.

Lol no never. Epstein? Nobody with money and power there right? Lol

 

[PunchImlach is Alive]

Also, and more importantly- increased risk of committing non-violent sexual misconduct, on a spectrum from simple impairment of their emotional intelligence/ ability to accurately read and appropriately react to the behaviour of their sexual partner, all the way to impaired judgement/loosening of inhibition causing them to act in ways they wouldn't normally.

That really doesn't hold up. There's plenty of guys who have no trouble drinking without turning into creeps and weirdos. If you don't have self control as a person sober, you should probably not be drinking. It's not some strange elixir that magically turns you into a different person.

 

[daver]

That really doesn't hold up. There's plenty of guys who have no trouble drinking without turning into creeps and weirdos. If you don't have self control as a person sober, you should probably not be drinking. It's not some strange elixir that magically turns you into a different person.

You don't think that drinking causes people to lose their self control?

 

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

C'mon now...there's a big difference between "leaving the house" and getting shit faced and going up to the hotel room of some random guy you just met.

Obviously, if these allegations are true the players themselves are 100% at fault, but you can at least acknowledge that there are ways to reduce risk.

I did acknowledge that there are ways to reduce risk (i.e. stating that the mom gave good advice.) But my post was responding to someone who was being dismissive of the threats that women face in our society so I merely stated the fact that women are subjected to harassment or worse in many situations.

I might also be misreading the tone of your post, but the first part sounds pretty victim-blamey.

 

[ERYX]

If Formenton is "Player 1", he is not "getting cleared". The prosecution might not be able to convict beyond a reasonable doubt, but it's very clear just from the facts that are agreed upon by both parties that he pulled a fast one on this girl, broke her trust and took advantage of her. This is either a case of no consent, or dubious consent at best. If a team signs a player like that, this will create a massive shitstorm not only for the team but also for the league. He is done.

What facts have been agreed upon by "both parties", as in the complainant and the accused hockey players. I'm not aware of any agreed statement of facts being filed with any court. There was an out-of-court settlement in civil court, but as it was out of court, no facts were agreed.

Is there something further that I missed? Please share a link as I'd be interested to see what has already been admitted (if anything) by these players.

 

[Moose Head]

It happens every night to many people. They're just getting scape goated because they're hockey players with nice incomes.

Quite contrary. People with money, celebrity, power and nice incomes have a better chance of getting away with crimes

 

[Ezekial]

That really doesn't hold up. There's plenty of guys who have no trouble drinking without turning into creeps and weirdos. If you don't have self control as a person sober, you should probably not be drinking. It's not some strange elixir that magically turns you into a different person.

It doesn't change you into a different person, but it certainly impairs judgement and your ability to read other people - which is what that poster said.

 

[PunchImlach is Alive]

You don't think that drinking causes people to lose their self control?

If drinking causes you to uncontrollably r*pe people, then they would pull it off the shelves. It doesn't hold up as an excuse whatsoever.

 

[Coaches Coroner]

C'mon now...there's a big difference between "leaving the house" and getting shit faced and going up to the hotel room of some random guy you just met.

Obviously, if these allegations are true the players themselves are 100% at fault, but you can at least acknowledge that there are ways to reduce risk.

Same goes for the players, as noted very well below.

ah yes we must deflect at least some amount of responsibility for the sexual assault she was a victim of, onto her, and we must defend that stance if there is any push back because that is much easier than self reflection...it's clear to me that many of you don't know any women, or certainly didn't when you were college aged, because so many are acting like getting drunk at a bar and having a 1 night stand with a guy is a coin flip for rape that all women should know as fact, yet it happens many times a night with neither party feeling wronged...most guys aren't trying to pick up a girl and then have his friends run train against her will; this is well beyond a conflict or 'misunderstanding' between 2 people.

It's very strange that people are acting like it is a moral failing for a women to drink and have casual sex, and that doing so make you more accountable for a crime of this nature being perpetrated against you. It just wreaks of identifying with the guys in the position of doing a sexual assault much more so than the victim.

 

[LTIR]

Yeah, agreed. There isn't going to be a situation where Player 1 is completely exonerated and welcomed back to the NHL. This will, at best for the players, be a situation where shady things happened, but the crown couldn't quite meet the evidenciary standard for a conviction. The court of public opinion has a different standard. I don't think any of these 5 players are playing another NHL game, regardless of how things play out in the courtroom.

If the court finds one 'not guilty' and NHL does not allow them back then I hope they sue the league and anyone who treats them with prejudice.
Player 1 or not..if you aren't convicted you get to live 'normally'