Value of: Extended Horvat to Buffalo

[Warh1ppy]

Honestly curious here, because there's been so little trades ever between the teams and as I am unfamiliar with much of the Buffalo structure, the one thing they seem to be missing is a veteran C that can chew up face offs. So lemme know if this is fair value for an extended Horvat

To Buffalo: An Extended Horvat

To Vancouver: Dylan Cozens, Noah Ostlund, Conditional 2023 1st round pick (if top 7, slides to 2024 unprotected)

Is there any actual basis for a trade here? Horvat could potentially make Cozens expendable in the short term at least. Ostlund is a longer term development over Savoie, and from what I understand; the Buffalo blue line is off limits by and large so that protected 1st round that would slide in the event of a top 7

Just genuinely curious on this one.

Click to read more...

 

[PullHard]

I'm not sure I'd move Cozens alone for Horvat. Idk if he'll ever necessarily be as good as Bo, but I don't see the difference between the two as being worth getting older and more expensive right away, nevermind all of the other pieces added on.

 

[Warh1ppy]

I'm not sure I'd move Cozens alone for Horvat. Idk if he'll ever necessarily be as good as Bo, but I don't see the difference between the two as being worth getting older and more expensive right away, nevermind all of the other pieces added on.

Ya, Like I said. Unsure. Cozens on paper seems to be rounding in to a solid player. That blue line is money over the next few years. Decent young prospects still.

Just didn't know what the overall ask should/would be. Normally gaining a vaunted veteran player at position X usually results in a younger player moving on as part of the trade.

 

[Peen]

you guys on cdc are finally coming to the idea of a rebuild?

 

[Fjordy]

No thx, Horvat is not suitable for us given our depth of the center. We have Thompson as 1C and Cozens is already starting to play as 2C.

 

[Warh1ppy]

you guys on cdc are finally coming to the idea of a rebuild?

Who's that? Me? Them?

Them: Still think it's possible to somehow do anything
Me: Ha no, been wanting a rebuild and tear down since 2013

Canucks are kidding themselves with that blue line, bottom 6, lack of depth and superiority complex with their 17 managers. A blow up and rebuild is not just needed it's bloody essential.

No thx, Horvat is not suitable for us given our depth of the center. We have Thompson as 1C and Cozens is already starting to play as 2C.

Counter offer? Like what would that be worth to the Buffalo product?

 

[Irie]

Honestly curious here, because there's been so little trades ever between the teams and as I am unfamiliar with much of the Buffalo structure, the one thing they seem to be missing is a veteran C that can chew up face offs. So lemme know if this is fair value for an extended Horvat

To Buffalo: An Extended Horvat

To Vancouver: Dylan Cozens, Noah Ostlund, Conditional 2023 1st round pick (if top 7, slides to 2024 unprotected)

Is there any actual basis for a trade here? Horvat could potentially make Cozens expendable in the short term at least. Ostlund is a longer term development over Savoie, and from what I understand; the Buffalo blue line is off limits by and large so that protected 1st round that would slide in the event of a top 7

Just genuinely curious on this one.

With the season Horvat is currently having, his new contract's rate and term are going to significantly lower his value.

Unless Vancouver is signing him to that deal then substantially retaining on the contract, there is no chance he is going to return that kind of kings ransom.

 

[Warh1ppy]

With the season Horvat is currently having, his new contract's rate and term are going to significantly lower his value.

Unless Vancouver is signing him to that deal then substantially retaining on the contract, there is no chance he is going to return that kind of kings ransom.

In defense of GMs being unable to control themselves. Giroux, Copp and about 3 dozen trades over the last 4 or 5 years suggest something like this is potentially possible. But I admit my ignorance of where Buffalos youth/assets are currently sitting.

 

[Fjordy]

Counter offer? Like what would that be worth to the Buffalo product?

I didn’t quite understand the question, but our GM will definitely not make such moves. Now is the season of development and evaluation. We'd better improve our defense and find some middle six physical forward.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

That's atrocious for Buffalo.


Why would they have any interest in Horvat in the first place. He doesn't fit the core age at all.


Really terrible.

 

[PullHard]

Ya, Like I said. Unsure. Cozens on paper seems to be rounding in to a solid player. That blue line is money over the next few years. Decent young prospects still.

Just didn't know what the overall ask should/would be. Normally gaining a vaunted veteran player at position X usually results in a younger player moving on as part of the trade.

I'm not a Sabres fan so I'm not super up on their internet politics about who is good/ bad and staying/ going but the general sense I get it is they probably will be patient with most/ all of their young players because it's been yielding good results with players like Dahlin and Thompson.

I think a more realistic base for a trade might be something around Garland and Mittelstadt in a year or two?? Just off the top of my head. Mittelstadt seems like the guy you're thinking of "rebounding" moreso than Cozens, Cozens has been a pro since day one and might be the best F on the team behind Thompson and Tuch IMO. He's relied on for tough match ups and is often carrying rookie wingers with him (very skilled and high end rookies, but you get what I'm saying.)

Mittelstadt is looking like he should settle into being a .5 ppg+ player who can help on the powerplay, but realistically the top 6 Cs are Thompson and Cozens moving forward. If Vancouver moves out Horvat in a different trade, maybe Mittelstadt is a guy they can get for a reasonable deal? Just spit balling ideas too as I'm not a fan of either team.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

In defense of GMs being unable to control themselves. Giroux, Copp and about 3 dozen trades over the last 4 or 5 years suggest something like this is potentially possible. But I admit my ignorance of where Buffalos youth/assets are currently sitting.

Giroux returned a 24 1st which should be a late 1st, a 3rd and a prospect in Owen Tippett who hadn't yet met expectations.
Copp returned Barron who was a decent prospect, a 1st and a 2nd. then some late picks also exchanged.

Those are a far cry from a kid who is 21 and showing a ton of progress in Cozens (20 games, 15 points and driving possession) a recent 1st who is playing extremely well in his D+1 in Ostlund, and a top 7 protected 1st in an incredibly deep draft by most scouts takes. That first will very possibly be in that 7 - 10 range.

 

[Irie]

In defense of GMs being unable to control themselves. Giroux, Copp and about 3 dozen trades over the last 4 or 5 years suggest something like this is potentially possible. But I admit my ignorance of where Buffalos youth/assets are currently sitting.

Kevyn Adams is attached to his young players and his picks. Getting him to move a 1st or the perceived young core for vets with hefty contracts is likely an exercise in futility.

He's an extremely patient guy(see Eichel trade), with basically no pressure from ownership to win this season. If he were targeting Horvat, he would likely wait to see if he makes it to UFA.

Unless you blow him away with an offer that is great for Buffalo's future, I don't think he would part with his blue-chip assets. I will admit that anything can happen and GMs change their positions, but everything he has said and done so far in his tenure suggest that he is not a GM that is "unable to control himself".

 

[HaNotsri]

That's way, way more than we got for Eichel.
Horvat is a good player but not a fit when it comes to age and style.

Buffalo needs:
Veteran RHD that is good
Fast and strong forward(s)

 

[Qwijibo]

“An extended Horvat” is way too generic. The terms of the deal would affect the value of the return. Given the difficulty of the negotiations and the fact that the Canucks seem to have broken off talks, it seems like he’s determined to hit free agency. I’m not actually sure an extended Horvst is a realistic asset you can offer

 

[Gabe Kupari]

I'm sure horvat would be thrilled to be moved from a non playoff team to a non playoff team

These proposals make no sense ever.

Why wouldn't Buffalo just wait to extend him in this unlikely scenario and keep Cozens. Just pay the rental price which is never what hfboards.com proposals think it is

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

LOL Horvat will be 28 when his new deal starts, And he's way too old for what the current core the Sabres have.

 

[MardyBum]

In defense of GMs being unable to control themselves. Giroux, Copp and about 3 dozen trades over the last 4 or 5 years suggest something like this is potentially possible. But I admit my ignorance of where Buffalos youth/assets are currently sitting.

Copp got two seconds(conditions on both) and an okay prospect(nowhere near any of the pieces in the OP)

He only returned a 1st because the Rangers went to the conf final which immediately made the 1st round pick one of the last 4 in the 1st round.

That's 3 first round picks in the OP, and one of those guys is an NHL player.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

If im Buffalo I'd rather see if he becomes available as FA over letting this go. their division isn't very easy right now either. what would be the point of this? just to waste some of your top assets including a 1st

 

[toddkaz]

Honestly curious here, because there's been so little trades ever between the teams and as I am unfamiliar with much of the Buffalo structure, the one thing they seem to be missing is a veteran C that can chew up face offs. So lemme know if this is fair value for an extended Horvat

To Buffalo: An Extended Horvat

To Vancouver: Dylan Cozens, Noah Ostlund, Conditional 2023 1st round pick (if top 7, slides to 2024 unprotected)

Is there any actual basis for a trade here? Horvat could potentially make Cozens expendable in the short term at least. Ostlund is a longer term development over Savoie, and from what I understand; the Buffalo blue line is off limits by and large so that protected 1st round that would slide in the event of a top 7

Just genuinely curious on this one.

Cozens could turn out to be just as good as Horvat and you want a 1st and Noah Ostlund?

Cozens is 21 has 15 points in 20 games is in your face, solid defensively. I wouldn't trade Cozens straight up for Horvat.

 

[Djp]

Honestly curious here, because there's been so little trades ever between the teams and as I am unfamiliar with much of the Buffalo structure, the one thing they seem to be missing is a veteran C that can chew up face offs. So lemme know if this is fair value for an extended Horvat

To Buffalo: An Extended Horvat

To Vancouver: Dylan Cozens, Noah Ostlund, Conditional 2023 1st round pick (if top 7, slides to 2024 unprotected)

Is there any actual basis for a trade here? Horvat could potentially make Cozens expendable in the short term at least. Ostlund is a longer term development over Savoie, and from what I understand; the Buffalo blue line is off limits by and large so that protected 1st round that would slide in the event of a top 7

Just genuinely curious on this one.

f*** no


his contractwill be bad after 1-3 years.

not trading Cozens++ for him.

 

[Djp]

Ya, Like I said. Unsure. Cozens on paper seems to be rounding in to a solid player. That blue line is money over the next few years. Decent young prospects still.

Just didn't know what the overall ask should/would be. Normally gaining a vaunted veteran player at position X usually results in a younger player moving on as part of the trade.

Obviously you don’t know.

Who's that? Me? Them?

Them: Still think it's possible to somehow do anything
Me: Ha no, been wanting a rebuild and tear down since 2013

Canucks are kidding themselves with that blue line, bottom 6, lack of depth and superiority complex with their 17 managers. A blow up and rebuild is not just needed it's bloody essential.


Counter offer? Like what would that be worth to the Buffalo product?

buffalo has a bunch of young centers in Cozens, Savoie, Kulich, snd Ostlund
they also just extended tage thompson

so signing Hor at to a long contract will kill their prospect line even as a UFA blocking their prospects.

on top of that you are asking for a top 10 pick, a pick in the teens and more.

that’s the kind of stuff you give up for mcdavid…Horvat doesnt cut it.

 

[SoupNazi]

Rumor: - Bo Horvat All Purpose Thread (Part 2) - Update - Seravalli First Top 20 Trade Bait Board

Part 1 - Rumor: - Bo Horvat All Purpose Thread (1) Continue Here

forums.hfboards.com