Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - season begins!

[Lou Bloom]

Devils will have a top end center core as long as Nico/Jack keep playing like they have. 3C is not as hard to fill as a long term RHD regardless if it's Gourde/Suter or whoever. Also I don't think the Devils signed Dillon to the deal he has for his 3rd year but more like that they had to offer that extra year to get him to sign here -- so there's no need to make any decisions based on Dillon's 3rd year when he'll be 36

Hamilton and Pesce are both older defenseman and both have just come off long term injuries and Pesce's style of play is of some who end up on LTIR and Hamilton may become a cap casualty anyway (his contract goes from full NMC to a 10 team trade list this offseason)

Obviously the Devils have two elite centers in Jack and Nico, my point in bringing up Florida, Vegas and Tampa was that they all had elite center depth, not just top end centers. Florida had Bennett/Lundell as their 3C, Vegas had Chandler Stephenson and Nicholas Roy as their 3C and 4C, Tampa had Gourde and Cirelli as their 3C and 4C during their Stanley Cup seasons.

Even if Dillon is just a 7th defenseman in his final season, the Devils will still have Anton Silayev ready to come over who is a much more seamless replacement in the lineup for Dillon's spot.

If the Devils had the same thought on Pesce as you then why would they sign him long term? It makes no sense to sign a player to a 6 year term with the expectation that he doesn't have much shelf life. And even in this scenario the Devils still have Casey in the system who's NHL ready and still have Kovacevic on the roster who they can look to re-sign if they have 0 trust in Pesce/Hamilton.

 

[Triumph]

It shouldn't be hard to find a 3C, even just next year the Devils still have Haula and there'll be guys like Suter and Gourde available in UFA. Doubt any prospect the Devils would get would displace a vet like Haula's usage and they definitely won't displace Nico or Hughes. Meanwhile the Devils have Hamilton who is 31 and Pesce who is 30 so RHD so something which is a strength could soon turn to something the Devils look for if they trade Nemec.

I thought Kovacevic was sort of a mirage from the beginning of the season especially when he started to have some meh games after his start but now I think he's actually what he is showing and if he is that then he will be the be the best RHD on the market this offseason. So I don't think the Devils will be able to re-sign him either if he keeps up his play.

I'd like the Devils to start drafting centers or finding them with college free agents/european free agents as well and all but I don't think they're near a position where they have a need to trade from a strength for a center.

I'd also like to eat crow on Allen lol, super happy with his play

Kovacevic is excellent and the Devils can't replace him. What they can do is offer him a Siegenthaler + inflation + a little more kind of deal to stay, which he might take because he's never been paid anything close to that nor had this sort of role. Obviously if he makes it to market and the Devils go deep in the playoffs, that sort of thing is probably off the table, but to me you have to make the attempt, even if means trading both Hamilton and Nemec and losing both trades.

 

[BostonDevil]

Still can't wrap my head around why people want to move Nemec.

Josh Anderson ain't gonna come cheap

 

[R8Devs]

Obviously the Devils have two elite centers in Jack and Nico, my point in bringing up Florida, Vegas and Tampa was that they all had elite center depth, not just top end centers. Florida had Bennett/Lundell as their 3C, Vegas had Chandler Stephenson and Nicholas Roy as their 3C and 4C, Tampa had Gourde and Cirelli as their 3C and 4C during their Stanley Cup seasons.

Even if Dillon is just a 7th defenseman in his final season, the Devils will still have Anton Silayev ready to come over who is a much more seamless replacement in the lineup for Dillon's spot.

If the Devils had the same thought on Pesce as you then why would they sign him long term? It makes no sense to sign a player to a 6 year term with the expectation that he doesn't have much shelf life. And even in this scenario the Devils still have Casey in the system who's NHL ready and still have Kovacevic on the roster who they can look to re-sign if they have 0 trust in Pesce/Hamilton.

The Devils still compare well to those teams with Nico/Jack/Haula and I'm pretty confident they'd be able to find a replacement for Haula when the time comes without having to give up Nemec. I also don't think a rookie/first year 3C is what the Devils would actually run with when they're in their contention window.

Pesce was signed as a win now deal, similar to Palat - I don't think GMs sign these guys expecting these UFAs to fulfill the term of their deal but if they don't get term they won't sign, so you just deal with the ramifications later. Maybe they thought it was an appropriate risk with the cap potentially being 100mil+ by the middle of Pesce's deal.

 

[Lou Bloom]

The Devils still compare well to those teams with Nico/Jack/Haula and I'm pretty confident they'd be able to find a replacement for Haula when the time comes without having to give up Nemec. I also don't think a rookie/first year 3C is what the Devils would actually run with when they're in their contention window.

Pesce was signed as a win now deal, similar to Palat - I don't think GMs sign these guys expecting these UFAs to fulfill the term of their deal but if they don't get term they won't sign, so you just deal with the ramifications later. Maybe they thought it was an appropriate risk with the cap potentially being 100mil+ by the middle of Pesce's deal.

The Devils definitely don't have similar center depth talent as those other teams. Jack and Nico are definitely as good a one two punch as you'll find but after them there's a huge drop off in center talent organizationally.

How is betting on a blue chip forward prospect that's NHL ready to perform any different then expecting one of Casey/Nemec to perform. Either way you're betting on youth in that scenario.

Yeah, I understand that teams are willing to lose on the backend of FA contracts sometimes in order to get the value up front. the difference is that Pesce just signed his 6 year deal this past offseason. At minimum the Devils should be expected high end play out of him for 3 seasons of that contract. Hamilton is still only 31 years old and has 3 more years left on his contract.

If these guys stay healthy and performing then that means you're going to have a logjam at RD and if you are worried about not having the depth in case of injury/underperformance then why not re-sign Kovacevic to a reasonable deal.

 

[R8Devs]

Kovacevic is excellent and the Devils can't replace him. What they can do is offer him a Siegenthaler + inflation + a little more kind of deal to stay, which he might take because he's never been paid anything close to that nor had this sort of role. Obviously if he makes it to market and the Devils go deep in the playoffs, that sort of thing is probably off the table, but to me you have to make the attempt, even if means trading both Hamilton and Nemec and losing both trades.

Idk it's just hard to see a guy who hasn't had a big contract yet not going to market with potentially the biggest jump in the cap ceiling in years, 27 years old, being the best available player in a desired position while also having one of the most desired traits by GMs by being 6'5. I think the Devils would probably offer that kind of deal deal you alluded to but it's hard to imagine that they'll give him the biggest offer he'd get. Also Hamilton may be pretty hard to trade with his trade protections but yeah we'll see. It'll be interesting to see how they handle RHDs this coming offseason

The Devils definitely don't have similar center depth talent as those other teams. Jack and Nico are definitely as good a one two punch as you'll find but after them there's a huge drop off in center talent organizationally.

How is betting on a blue chip forward prospect that's NHL ready to perform any different then expecting one of Casey/Nemec to perform. Either way you're betting on youth in that scenario.

Yeah, I understand that teams are willing to lose on the backend of FA contracts sometimes in order to get the value up front. the difference is that Pesce just signed his 6 year deal this past offseason. At minimum the Devils should be expected high end play out of him for 3 seasons of that contract. Hamilton is still only 31 years old and has 3 more years left on his contract.

If these guys stay healthy and performing then that means you're going to have a logjam at RD and if you are worried about not having the depth in case of injury/underperformance then why not re-sign Kovacevic to a reasonable deal.

Haula's usage is not one they'd give that forward prospect, I think the guys you're talking about might be moved to wing and/or in the press box when playoffs start whereas Nemec can play a regular 3rd pair's usage.

I think Kovacevic's play has priced him out of that reasonable contract range for depth.

 

[RSeen]

I'd love for us to be able to keep Kovacevic if we didn't have Nemec. Unless you can trade Nemec for an equivalent forward, I don't think you can keep Kovacevic.

Casey is there too obviously, will be tough to find room for 2 out of 3 of these players.

 

[NJDevs26]

And we let him slip through our fingers.

As did the Avalanche, who dumped him back on waivers after picking him up in Oct.

As are the Jets, who are using Comrie as their back-up while Kahkonen is in the AHL.

Just stunning how every NHL organization is dumber than one very indignant HFBoards poster.

It was more than one poster who wanted Kahkonen as the backup, either as Allen’s understudy or his replacement.

 

[NJDevs26]

Hamilton is only 31 with an NMC and 3 years left at $9M after this season. He's still providing elite level offense and was one of the biggest FA signings in recent memory for the Devils. Unless he starts having injury issues and goes the LTIR route he's finishing that contract.

Pesce just turned 30 and just signed a 6 year FA contract less than 5 months ago. Casey is NHL ready and killing it in the AHL, Kovacevic has been great and could be a potential re-sign candidate.

I'm also not saying to trade Nemec away for some older player, I'm saying if a scenario arises where a team has a similarly talented blue chip forward, it would make sense do to a logjam at RD vs a forward group that is shallow after the top 6.

If there's no team willing or able to make that trade then the Devils just hold onto Nemec and Casey and deal with a good problem in having too many talented defensemen.

At the very least the whole ‘we’re dumping him this offseason’ meme should be off the table.

 

[Emperoreddy]

 

[Emperoreddy]

People still want to empty the coffers for Brady?

 

[Guttersniped]

It was more than one poster who wanted Kahkonen as the backup, either as Allen’s understudy or his replacement.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being intrigued by Kahkonen but going overboard with it is another thing entirely.

 

[Guadana]

It's not an indictment on Nemec to be willing to trade him for a player I had as a top 10 prospect in a loaded 2023 class that fits a big organizational hole at center.

The Devils have Pesce and Hamilton locked in for the next 3 seasons, even if they don't re-sign Kovacevic you're still going to have one of Nemec or Casey as a depth defensemen with Luke, Siegenthaler and Dillon all locked up on the Left side and Silayev hopefully NHL ready in 2 years. As much as depth is important there does come a point where you're hoarding too many valuable defenseman and the forward depth will suffer.

Its great that you have Moore as top ten prospect of his year, it doesn't change the fact that Nemec is much better prospect.

Again - long term plan is about having best players. Dougie has only one NMC year, Casey is great offensively but bad defensively for NHL. He needs time to polish his game, Kovachevic can leave this team after this season.
This group of management are trying to build the team not for three years only but for next ten years. Nemec is better player for the next three years than Casey and Moore, Nemec is much more important and better better for the next ten years than Casey and Moore.

 

[Saugus]

People still want to empty the coffers for Brady?

That seems like an absurd overpayment. Probably what it would take to swing that trade, but likely not worth it for us.

 

[MartyOwns]

i'd rather trade casey and a 5th for batherson.

 

[Triumph]

Idk it's just hard to see a guy who hasn't had a big contract yet not going to market with potentially the biggest jump in the cap ceiling in years, 27 years old, being the best available player in a desired position while also having one of the most desired traits by GMs by being 6'5. I think the Devils would probably offer that kind of deal deal you alluded to but it's hard to imagine that they'll give him the biggest offer he'd get. Also Hamilton may be pretty hard to trade with his trade protections but yeah we'll see. It'll be interesting to see how they handle RHDs this coming offseason

He was drafted low, he was waived and also traded this past offseason for a 4th round pick in a draft 2 years away, he's not very physical (around 1 hit per game), and he brings no offense. I don't know if teams are going to be willing to give a guy like this a deal of 5M+ per for 5+ years.

 

[MB3]

If you can trade for Tkachuk without touching a current starting player, I think you kind of have to do it.

Tkachuk-Hughes-Bratt
Meier-Hischier-Mercer
Cotter-Haula-Noesen

That's a Stanley Cup winning top-9.

Nemec, Gritsyuk, a 1st and a 3rd?

I wonder if Fitz is going to be active early this year, rather than wait until closer to the deadline. He's lamented in interviews that Meier didn't have enough time to really learn the system / get comfortable. I imagine that acquiring any top-9 talent this year would happen sooner than later.

 

[njdevils1982]

as if the columbus franchise wasnt starving enough, that's quite the slice of pie they have.

annnnnd, im not surprised....they've been cursed their whole existence

 

[Triumph]

If you can trade for Tkachuk without touching a current starting player, I think you kind of have to do it.

Tkachuk-Hughes-Bratt
Meier-Hischier-Mercer
Cotter-Haula-Noesen

That's a Stanley Cup winning top-9.

Nemec, Gritsyuk, a 1st and a 3rd?

I wonder if Fitz is going to be active early this year, rather than wait until closer to the deadline. He's lamented in interviews that Meier didn't have enough time to really learn the system / get comfortable. I imagine that acquiring any top-9 talent this year would happen sooner than later.

Tkachuk is a horrendous fit with Hughes - a tunnel vision forward who plays very little defense. Think about how bad Meier is with Hughes and it's worse than that. Also it is not possible to do this, obviously, as the Devils do not have the cap room for it - even somehow jettisoning Palat doesn't leave room enough.

 

[None Shall Pass]

Neat

 

[TheBeerNerd]

as if the columbus franchise wasnt starving enough, that's quite the slice of pie they have.

annnnnd, im not surprised....they've been cursed their whole existence

Part of the tragedy is that if not for injuries and death, they might have taken a leap into a playoff spot this year. They're playing hard in spite of all of this.

 

[tailfins]

as if the columbus franchise wasnt starving enough, that's quite the slice of pie they have.

annnnnd, im not surprised....they've been cursed their whole existence

Having competent ownership / management matters so much to a franchise. The fans in Columbus really want to support that team, but they're irrelevant.

They seem to be building an impressive prospect pool, but they're directionless.

Waddell and Evason do not seem like long term solutions there. Rick Nash seems like the up and coming guy on the hockey ops side. It'd be a huge boost if he's at least semi-competent.

 

[TheBeerNerd]

The fans in Columbus do support the team, quite a lot in fact. In spite of them being the most cursed team in sports, their attendance is excellent. I'm not entirely sure how. I guess man cannot survive on Buckeyes sports alone.

 

[Bleedred]

Neat

Wait a minute. I mentioned this yesterday that I’ve noticed when looking at the game logs on the NHL app when a goalie allows an own goal it lists him as allowing one goal than he allowed, but it also says 23 saves on 25 shots, but only credits him with one goal allowed.

When I go to hockey reference he was listed as allowing two goals.

I’m not sure why they’re complicating this. If a goalie gives up a goal on fewer shots on goal, it’s gonna hurt his save percentage. Not help it.

I don’t understand this and never heard anything about this before this season.

So instead of 2 goals on 25 shots it’s 2 goals on 24 shots?

Hockey reference still has him listed at 2 goals on 25 shots for the game log on Saturday.

I think it only doesn’t count as a shot on goal on the NHL app. And even on there it counts as a shot, just not a goal lol.

 

[njdevils1982]

Having competent ownership / management matters so much to a franchise. The fans in Columbus really want to support that team, but they're irrelevant.

They seem to be building an impressive prospect pool, but they're directionless.

Waddell and Evason do not seem like long term solutions there. Rick Nash seems like the up and coming guy on the hockey ops side. It'd be a huge boost if he's at least semi-competent.

i always thought waddell was a doofus going back to his atlanta days