Denis Savard with Montreal (1990-1993): What happened?

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The Panther

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Mar 25, 2014
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Sorry if we discussed this before, but I'm curious of people's (esp. Habs fans') opinions.

So, c. 1989, in Chicago, Mike Keenan started pestering Serge Savard --- repeatedly --- to talk about obtaining Chelios for the Blackhawks. Savard said 'no' several times. Then, something changed circa spring 1990. It might have been that Chelios' rumor-mill vis-a-vis Ronald Corey's wife was too much to deal with, or maybe there was some actual fire there (not just smoke) and the player shagged the boss's wife. The "official" story from Serge Savard is that there was concern about Chelios' leg after he appeared in only 27 games during 1989-90. And then there are rumors about the pressure Chelios was under from law enforcement in Montreal, etc., etc. So, anyway, they traded him in early summer 1990.

Why did Montreal want Savard just then (10 years too late, some would soon say)? Montreal had just had a somewhat disappointing 1989-90 season, where they'd fallen to third in the division from first, and they'd dropped 23 points in the standings. Part of the reason for their 1989 Cup Finals' loss is that the club suddenly couldn't score in games 4, 5, and 6. The offence ran dry. The team offence fell off in 1989-90 (from 5th overall to 12th), but maybe the bigger point of concern was the playoff series vs. Boston, in which the Habs mustered 11 (non-empty net) goals in five games, losing the series. So, they felt the need for more offence up front. So, they acquired Savard.

Being generous about it, Savard was now a 29-year-old veteran of ten seasons, joining a defence-first team, and he went on to produce nearly 180 points in 210 games, which isn't too shabby. But as he'd just come off a 107-point pace season with Chicago (which, if not for missed games, might have placed him as high as 7th in NHL scoring), his returns with Montreal (esp. 59 points in 70 games, in year one) seemed disappointing.

By 1992-93, the Habs were building up a very deep core of players, with the wealth spread around four lines. Savard's stats dropped a bit more with just 16 goals in 63 games (though still getting almost 5 points every 6 games). The final blow was an injury to his ankle that kept him out of most of the 1993 Cup Final (they lost the one game he appeared in, and won the other four).

What's the tale of the tape here? Was Savard a big bust in his home province, or did contemporary accounts judge him too harshly? Is this one of those trades where it's impossible to fairly account for one guy's play in consideration of the other guy's (Chelios') huge contribution to his team? Or, did Savard just lose some of his mojo when he shaved off that porn-stache?
1T_DenisSavard.jpg


Small CBC feature on Savard / The Canadiens here, from late 1990:
 
Savard looked pretty good here, in the Habs' home opener, October 1990:


He had 13 points in Montreal's first 11 games.

Then, he scored only 3 points in the next 11 games.
 
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Chelios was on nilan's podcast about a year ago and talked about the trouble he was often getting into off the ice. He also talked about how he got the co-captaincy after Gainey retired, and he admits that he was not ready for it.

Savard was tired of his ice troubles and decided that there were too many headaches with him.... So there was more to it than the story about his knee.

It was a similar story with corson with respect to the off ice headaches, who they traded a couple years later.

I'm also interested how some older habs fans felt about the deal at the time. I was still a little kid back then.
 
Serge Savard said that he couldn't go anywhere after the trade without a fan stopping him to congratulate him on the deal. Montreal fans were thrilled to have Denis Savard. Trading your top defenceman is never a good move, but the off-ice issues with Chelios may have made it necessary.

What went wrong for the Habs after the deal? Denis Savard and Pat Burns were oil and water. The personality clash was destined to fail.
 
What went wrong for the Habs after the deal? Denis Savard and Pat Burns were oil and water. The personality clash was destined to fail.
Burns was probably bitter about losing a hard-nosed offensive d-man like Chelios for a soft, little guy like Savard.
 
Burns was probably bitter about losing a hard-nosed offensive d-man like Chelios for a soft, little guy like Savard.

Chelios was not an offensive defenseman. He was as complete as they came in those days.

For those in the know, what exactly were Chelios' off ice issues?
 
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Pat Burns demands

Also...age. He was still a terrific player but he joined the Habs the year he turned 30. Just wasnt quite the same player
 
Could be Burns-mtl, but age could be really it.

81-82 scoring leader
RkPlayerAgeTmPosGPGAPTS
+/-PIMPSEVPPSHGWEVPPSHSS%TOIATOI
1Wayne Gretzky*21EDMC8092120212802619.768186127939237024.9
2Mike Bossy*25NYIRW806483147692213.347170105330030121.3
3Peter Šťastný*25QUEC804693139-10919.82716335933122720.3
4Dennis Maruk26WSHC806076136-712811.03820213837126822.4
5Bryan Trottier*25NYIC805079129708811.230182105717521723.0
6Denis Savard*20CBHC8032871190827.9248044938023113.9
7Marcel Dionne*30LAKC785067117-10508.83217154126034614.5
8Bobby Smith23MNSC80437111410828.72320045615026116.5
9Dino Ciccarelli*21MNSRW765551106141389.23520043417028919.0
10Dave Taylor26LAKRW783967106-31307.52613033828123216.8
11Glenn Anderson*21EDMRW80386710545718.0299085215025215.1
12Dale Hawerchuk*18WINC804558103-7477.93312023422233913.3
13Mike Rogers27NYRC8038651031437.2316123431021317.8
14Neal Broten22MNSC7338609814427.6297243919218820.2


Bossy was out of the league by 30, Maruk virtually out of the league by 32, Trottier-Hawerchuck-Smith-Anderson did not turn 30 that well.

Dionne-Gretzky obviously and Ciccarelli aged well, but Savard is not out of place in that group about how he turned 30 and other the 90s corrner
 
Chelios was not an offensive defenseman. He was as complete as they came in those days.

For those in the know, what exactly were Chelios' off ice issues?
Theres rumours of stuff serious enough to involve the law

But the gist of it was he was frequently drunk, and broke team rules (usually related to not being drunk)

I think its public record that chelios was drunk for the 1986 cup parade
 
Savard and Chelios are one year apart in age difference. It doesn't seem that way because Chelios played so long at a high level and Savard was done by the mid 1990's.

Montreal had good young defensemen in the pipeline.

What I don't get is why Chicago got a draft pick also. What the hell? There should have been a draft pick going the other way instead.
 
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I've long been curious as to whether or not the Jets made inquiries about being able to get Chelios for Hawerchuk, instead of going with Housley. My first guess would be that Chelios would not have wanted to play in Winnipeg.

I would assume that since Hawerchuk was 2 years younger than Savard, he would have had more value in '90. Funny that Savard and Hawerchuk would get into a fight - or whatever you'd like to call it - not long after they were wearing new uniforms.
 
Theres rumours of stuff serious enough to involve the law

But the gist of it was he was frequently drunk, and broke team rules (usually related to not being drunk)

I think its public record that chelios was drunk for the 1986 cup parade

he was also the the top dog back in the prohibition days. all that shit that capone was running in the joints in chicago ran through chelios first.
 
Theres rumours of stuff serious enough to involve the law

But the gist of it was he was frequently drunk, and broke team rules (usually related to not being drunk)

I think its public record that chelios was drunk for the 1986 cup parade
Chelios said all the rumors weren't true and Savard told him why but he can't tell us yet (I assume he means as long as Serge is around).
 
Serge Savard said that he couldn't go anywhere after the trade without a fan stopping him to congratulate him on the deal. Montreal fans were thrilled to have Denis Savard. Trading your top defenceman is never a good move, but the off-ice issues with Chelios may have made it necessary.

What went wrong for the Habs after the deal? Denis Savard and Pat Burns were oil and water. The personality clash was destined to fail.

Trading one of the leagues top defensemen is never a good move*
 
Chelios said all the rumors weren't true and Savard told him why but he can't tell us yet (I assume he means as long as Serge is around).

Chelios did mention that he had some run in with the law just before being traded. It might have been something to do with urinating in public, but I can't remember for sure.

He thought serge had called him because he found out about the incident, but it was actually to tell him that he got traded.
 
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Chelios did mention that he had some run in with the law just before being traded. It might have been something to do with urinating in public, but I can't remember for sure.

He thought serge had called him because he found out about the incident, but it was actually to tell him that he got traded.

Sheesh, what young man hasn’t taken a whizz in an alley after a night of partying.
 
Chelios was a much better player than Savard at the time of the trade.

Savard was always overrated, was never as good as his numbers.
 
There are several factors at play here. One Mtl, as you said, was a defense first team that spread talent through three, and sometimes four, lines.

Two, Montreal had good wingers, but nobody that suited Savard as well as Secord and Larmer.

Three, burnout. Savard smoked like a chimney, was high strung, and lived and died with the game. He was a lot like Lafleur in that way. He just wasn't close to the same player in Montreal as in Chicago. The thrill was gone...

Edit: someone else mentioned it, but the change in play from the 80s to the early 90s was noticeable. The dpe did not start until about 94, but led by Montreal and Boston, teams started to batten down the hatches as early as 90. There were outliers in Pittsburgh and LA.
 
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