Prospect Info: David Reinbacher

[Whitesnake]

Read a lot of outlandish takes on this board but I don’t remember this one.

It was added to the reasons why it was a good thing that we picked him.

 

[Jaynki]

Yep. When he plays NHL games on playstation.

You know i answered that to the poster who akready had Michkov winning awards?

Do.you need more clarification as to why i gave such a worthless answer?

 

[themilosh]

I hear you. We've been so starved for talent, I would have been ready to try to break the mold and win with two lines, with the following two 2 duos:

Michkov - Suzuki - Roy
Caufield - Dach - Slaf

Just would have liked to have seen if they could do it. Maybe down the line we get another big fellow to play on the Suzuki line and Roy moves down to the 3rd line.

Or, after we picked Reinbacher, would Arizona have prefered Hutson to Shimashev? Could we have traded Hutson to Arizona for the 6th pick and taken Michkov after Reinbacher? Should we have even if we could have?

I think that would have been ideal, but my guess is Arizona wanted the big hulking blueliner, once rainbaker was off the board.

Only scenario I could see was to trade our pick to AZ along with Josh Roy and Logan Mailloux for Cooley and their pick.

Result:
Habs get Cooley, Michkov
Yotes get: Roy, Mailloux, Reinbacher

 

[26Mats]

I think that would have been ideal, but my guess is Arizona wanted the big hulking blueliner, once rainbaker was off the board.

Only scenario I could see was to trade our pick to AZ along with Josh Roy and Logan Mailloux for Cooley and their pick.

Result:
Habs get Cooley, Michkov
Yotes get: Roy, Mailloux, Reinbacher

You think they were ready to move Cooley?

It would be interesting to see how much more they value Shimashev than Mailloux. Wharlt would we have had to add to Mailloux to get 6th overall?

 

[themilosh]

You think they were ready to move Cooley?

It would be interesting to see how much more they value Shimashev than Mailloux. Wharlt would we have had to add to Mailloux to get 6th overall?

I think that would have done it (prior to this season). They could have snagged Shimashev with their next pick (instead of Butt)..

Im not a big fan of undersize frwds, so anything more and I would have just stayed put, which is likely what happened.

Our current d corps is shaping up very nicely, with some luck most will pan out, which gives us bargaining chips to snag a frwd from anither team.

Individual talent is so minute in the NHL atm, that the team that wins play as a team from start to finish - with smarts.

Very little room for individual team players, which michkov strikes me as such.

 

[montreal]

How far back do you want me to go? How about back to when I started posting here in 2003?

Andrei Kostitsyn, Corey Urquhart, Corey Locke, Kyle Chipchura, JT Wyman, Matt D’Agostini, Sergei Kostitsyn, David Fischer, Ben Maxwell, Mathieu Carle, Danny Kristo, Louis Leblanc, Jonas Naatinen, Mac Bennett, Alexander Avtsin, Gabriel Dumont, Jarred Tinordi, Morgan Ellis, Nathan Beaulieu, Josia Didier, Olivier Archambault, Darren Dietz, Sebastian Collberg, Dalton Thrower, Tim Bozon, Brady Vail, Charles Hudon, Michael McCarron, Jacob De La Rose, Zach Fucale, Connor Crisp, Sven Andrighetto, Jeremy Gregoire, Nikita Scherbak, Brett Lernout, Daniel Audette, Noah Juulsen (blame injuries if you want here I suppose), Lukas Vejdemo, Simon Bourque, Jeremiah Addison, Ryan Poehling, Josh Brook, Cale Fleury, Cam Hillis.

The list of players who were "slow cooked' was easy to come up with, and you could repeat this same excercise for basically every team and it would be the same.

how in the world could anything think those players were slow cooked? That's insane not one player on the list was slow cooked.

 

[dcyhabs]

How far back do you want me to go? How about back to when I started posting here in 2003?

Andrei Kostitsyn, Corey Urquhart, Corey Locke, Kyle Chipchura, JT Wyman, Matt D’Agostini, Sergei Kostitsyn, David Fischer, Ben Maxwell, Mathieu Carle, Danny Kristo, Louis Leblanc, Jonas Naatinen, Mac Bennett, Alexander Avtsin, Gabriel Dumont, Jarred Tinordi, Morgan Ellis, Nathan Beaulieu, Josia Didier, Olivier Archambault, Darren Dietz, Sebastian Collberg, Dalton Thrower, Tim Bozon, Brady Vail, Charles Hudon, Michael McCarron, Jacob De La Rose, Zach Fucale, Connor Crisp, Sven Andrighetto, Jeremy Gregoire, Nikita Scherbak, Brett Lernout, Daniel Audette, Noah Juulsen (blame injuries if you want here I suppose), Lukas Vejdemo, Simon Bourque, Jeremiah Addison, Ryan Poehling, Josh Brook, Cale Fleury, Cam Hillis.

I was tempted to add Jesse Ylonen and Mathias Norlinder, but it might be a tad early to start writing them off.

But all of the rest of the players above were "slow cooked" in their respect junior or European league, then again in the AHL, but none of them had anywhere near the impact many were hopeful of.

You got guys like Kostitsyn or Chipchura who had decent careers, but not anywhere near close what was expected of them.

The list of players who were "slow cooked' was easy to come up with, and you could repeat this same excercise for basically every team and it would be the same.

But no one ever talks about how THAT'S reason why they didn't work out...but as soon as a player is brought up earlier than fans think they should, and they end up flopping, it ends up becoming THE reason.

All of the excuses for some of the players i'm expecting to read, don't apply when we're talking about "rushing" players...injuries, mismanagement, etc...none of that ever matters when we're talking about 18-19 year olds.

It can't go both ways...and that's just a general comment, not pointing that directly at you.

Jesse Ylonen was drafted in 2018, more than 5 years ago.

Since then he's racked up

127 Liiga games
120 AHL games

He's still struggling to get any meaningful icetime in the NHL and could get waived any day...if he does, is anyone going to say it's because he was "slow cooked". He's not any closer to being an NHLer despite being picked 35th overall more than 5 years ago and 247 games played outside of the NHL.

Some of these players were harmed by having Lefebvre as a coach. Lefebvre managed to do everything wrong, bad attitude in the room, bad player usage, pushing players to fight and get concussed. I doubt that someone working for rival teams to sabotage habs development intentionally could have done more damage.

A bunch of the others were poor picks. Urquhart wasn’t making the NHL with any development path.

Some others did as well as could be expected. AK was good for a while, and his problems were mostly off ice.

A bunch of those guys, Dietz, Ellis, etc. were low picks who came close. Some might have had a chance if there had been decent development coaches in the AHL or the NHL for them to learn from.

A bunch of those guys were destroyed by bad development, but I don’t see AHL time as the problem. AHL time with a decent coach would have helped a bunch oc them, Tinordi, Leblanc.

Hudon is about the only guy on the list who was left to stagnate in the AHL when he had peaked. He might have done better if he’d been given a shot at the right time, but his game wasn’t really suited to the NHL.

Development and drafting really stunk for a long time.

 

[admiralcadillac]

I think that would have been ideal, but my guess is Arizona wanted the big hulking blueliner, once rainbaker was off the board.

Only scenario I could see was to trade our pick to AZ along with Josh Roy and Logan Mailloux for Cooley and their pick.

Result:
Habs get Cooley, Michkov
Yotes get: Roy, Mailloux, Reinbacher

Are you serious?

 

[417]

how in the world could anything think those players were slow cooked? That's insane not one player on the list was slow cooked.

Not one?

Ok well I mean not going to go over every single player in greater detail.

Let's look at Kyle Chipchura

Drafted in 04

- played 28 games in the WHL in 05’ (I think he hurt his knee IIRC)

- played 59 games in the WHL in 06’ + 8 more in the AHL with the Hamilton Bulldogs

- played 80 games in the AHL + 22 AHL playoff games in 07’

- he split the 08’ season playing 36 NHL games + 38 AHL games

- he split the 09’ season playing 13 NHL games + 51 AHL games + 6 AHL playoff games.

Until he made his NHL debut in 08’ he had played a total of 110 AHL games and he added another 95 AHL games before he baecame a full time NHL player.

205 AHL games after 4 years in the WHL…

Not one??

How long do you think players should be in the AHL for? No team is keeping one of their top prospect down in the AHL for 3-4 years like Plekanec back in the day.

 

[CHwest]

I think that would have been ideal, but my guess is Arizona wanted the big hulking blueliner, once rainbaker was off the board.

Only scenario I could see was to trade our pick to AZ along with Josh Roy and Logan Mailloux for Cooley and their pick.

Result:
Habs get Cooley, Michkov
Yotes get: Roy, Mailloux, Reinbacher

Do you really believe that could happen?

 

[Mrb1p]

he may not be as exciting, but rest assured he was the better pick for "key" player core, even if unpopular. We already have a "michkov" in CC.. small snipers (not names Patty Kane) are limited threats in 5v5. You can't win a Cup with PP specialists (or 3v3 OT heros), you need a solid back end (and goalie) before building the forwards.

by the time our D have properly developed, I imagine the focus will shift back to forward. We will need to trade one of our D for a similar F (but at least we can target the right piece).

Ya, the thing is Michkov may just be that, Patty Kane.

 

[themilosh]

Do you really believe that could happen?

The alternative was what I proposed in the summer: CC for Cooley and AZ 1st..

Then we draft Rainmaker and Michkov, which is a much better fit for our window which is in 3 yrs.

Ya, the thing is Michkov may just be that, Patty Kane.

I dont see him being a Patty Kane... he reminds me more of Mats Zuccarello, which is still a really good player.

 

[Yasuo]

Not one?

Ok well I mean not going to go over every single player in greater detail.

Let's look at Kyle Chipchura

Drafted in 04

- played 28 games in the WHL in 05’ (I think he hurt his knee IIRC)

- played 59 games in the WHL in 06’ + 8 more in the AHL with the Hamilton Bulldogs

- played 80 games in the AHL + 22 AHL playoff games in 07’

- he split the 08’ season playing 36 NHL games + 38 AHL games

- he split the 09’ season playing 13 NHL games + 51 AHL games + 6 AHL playoff games.

Until he made his NHL debut in 08’ he had played a total of 110 AHL games and he added another 95 AHL games before he baecame a full time NHL player.

205 AHL games after 4 years in the WHL…

Not one??

How long do you think players should be in the AHL for? No team is keeping one of their top prospect down in the AHL for 3-4 years like Plekanec back in the day.

Your logic is flawed because if a player is not good enough to be great in the Ahl in what world does promoting him to a tougher league will help him develop or help the team? Even if the team wanted they dont have 60 roster spot to give nhl games to below .7ppg ahl forward and average ahl dman. Injuries are the only reason that a lot of these guy get nhl games to prove their worth and if they dont prove anything its normal they go back to the ahl. By your logic John Mysak should be called soon or he is doomed despite him showing that even the nhl is to much for him? Plekanec would have spent 2 years in the ahl if not for the lock-out you really think he should have been called up after his 40 points ahl season as a 3rd rounder?

 

[Jaynki]

Not one?

Ok well I mean not going to go over every single player in greater detail.

Let's look at Kyle Chipchura

Drafted in 04

- played 28 games in the WHL in 05’ (I think he hurt his knee IIRC)

- played 59 games in the WHL in 06’ + 8 more in the AHL with the Hamilton Bulldogs

- played 80 games in the AHL + 22 AHL playoff games in 07’

- he split the 08’ season playing 36 NHL games + 38 AHL games

- he split the 09’ season playing 13 NHL games + 51 AHL games + 6 AHL playoff games.

Until he made his NHL debut in 08’ he had played a total of 110 AHL games and he added another 95 AHL games before he baecame a full time NHL player.

205 AHL games after 4 years in the WHL…

Not one??

How long do you think players should be in the AHL for? No team is keeping one of their top prospect down in the AHL for 3-4 years like Plekanec back in the day.

They just cant accept that NHL talent dont sleep outside the NHL.

Its not slow cooking or development. Its just not being good enough. They can't grasp it or understand it.

They also think playing in the NHL is like being in the gulag, instead of something invaluable and an insane privilege.

 

[NotProkofievian]

They just cant accept that NHL talent dont sleep outside the NHL.

Its not slow cooking or development. Its just not being good enough. They can't grasp it or understand it.

They also think playing in the NHL is like being in the gulag, instead of something invaluable and an insane privilege.

True, nobody playing outside the NHL currently will ever succeed in the NHL. People just don't understand this.

 

[Jaynki]

True, nobody playing outside the NHL currently will ever succeed in the NHL. People just don't understand this.

You can temporarily be not good enough and develop into an NHL talent, especially if you are a young player.

Dont know i had to specify that, i thought it was obvious.

But actual NHL talent sleeping outside the NHL usually don't take long before joining the big league, especially not years.

 

[RabbleMasterBlaster]

The alternative was what I proposed in the summer: CC for Cooley and AZ 1st..

Then we draft Rainmaker and Michkov, which is a much better fit for our window which is in 3 yrs.


I dont see him being a Patty Kane... he reminds me more of Mats Zuccarello, which is still a really good player.

If the ceiling for Michkov is Zucs, then no one is mad we passed on him brother.

 

[cave troll]

True, nobody playing outside the NHL currently will ever succeed in the NHL. People just don't understand this.

Yep. Seems like Reinbacher Hutson, Mesar and Roy are already doomed.

 

[NotProkofievian]

You can temporarily be not good enough and develop into an NHL talent, especially if you are a young player.

Dont know i had to specify that, i thought it was obvious.

But actual NHL talent sleeping outside the NHL usually don't take long before joining the big league, especially not years.

No true NHL talent would ever need time to develop outside the NHL. The hits keep coming.

 

[Jaynki]

No true NHL talent would ever need time to develop outside the NHL. The hits keep coming.

That is not even close to what i said but i don't see any point in continuing this discussion when you are doing it in bad faith.

 

[DAChampion]

Not one?

Ok well I mean not going to go over every single player in greater detail.

Let's look at Kyle Chipchura

Drafted in 04

- played 28 games in the WHL in 05’ (I think he hurt his knee IIRC)

- played 59 games in the WHL in 06’ + 8 more in the AHL with the Hamilton Bulldogs

- played 80 games in the AHL + 22 AHL playoff games in 07’

- he split the 08’ season playing 36 NHL games + 38 AHL games

- he split the 09’ season playing 13 NHL games + 51 AHL games + 6 AHL playoff games.

Until he made his NHL debut in 08’ he had played a total of 110 AHL games and he added another 95 AHL games before he baecame a full time NHL player.

205 AHL games after 4 years in the WHL…

Not one??

How long do you think players should be in the AHL for? No team is keeping one of their top prospect down in the AHL for 3-4 years like Plekanec back in the day.

Chipchura was a very good prospect until his skating declined due to the injury.

He took a long time to make it because he was no longer a good player, at the time some fans felt he was blocking Lapierre.

 

[NotProkofievian]

That is not even close to what i said but i don't see any point in continuing this discussion when you are doing it in bad faith.

How does it differ from what I said?

 

[DAChampion]

That is not even close to what i said but i don't see any point in continuing this discussion when you are doing it in bad faith.

It kind of does come off that way.

 

[Jaynki]

It kind of does come off that way.

My bad then.

Mesar for example, may be an NHL talent next year or in two year, but he is not this year. Otherwise, he would be in the NHL, we would have seen it in training camp. NHL talent dont sleep long outside the NHL.

Hope it is clearer

 

[DAChampion]

My bad then.

Mesar for example, may be an NHL talent next year or in two year, but he is not this year. Otherwise, he would be in the NHL, we would have seen it in training camp. NHL talent dont sleep long outside the NHL.

Hope it is clearer

Thanks.

I think the misunderstanding is that you're using the word talent the way others use the word skill.

To a tough approximation: skill = talent + experience + conditioning.

Mesar doesn't currently have the skill to play in the NHL, but he does have the talent, or at least I hope he does.