Player Discussion David Quinn: Part IV

[will1066]

Today’s game changes nothing.
Quinn blows and should be fired.

Im Jacques Martin, and I approved this message.

 

[effen]

So what causes this recurring problem?

Neither one is an above average skater? If you're looking for the gap between them and Stutzle and Hughes, it's that.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Neither one is an above average skater? If you're looking for the gap between them and Stutzle and Hughes, it's that.

Laf's def an above average skater.

Usage seems like a pretty obvious answer. That and luck if we're discussing TS.

 

[Hire Sather]

You could say Quinn is our worst coach since the dark years

and you'd be 100% right

 

[Tawnos]

You could say Quinn is our worst coach since the dark years

and you'd be 100% right

That would be the lowest possible bar to set.

 

[ElLeetch]

You could say Quinn is our worst coach since the dark years

and you'd be 100% right

Muckler-Low-Trottier was a nightmare.


With Quinn, we thought we were getting a Tom Renny, who did more for the young rangers in 05-08 than Quinn can ever hope to.

 

[Hire Sather]

That would be the lowest possible bar to set.

Well the previous 3 coaches took a lot of heat here.

They weren't perfect, and all were let go at the right time but I'm missing them right now. Especially AV.

 

[Tawnos]

Muckler-Low-Trottier was a nightmare.


With Quinn, we thought we were getting a Tom Renny, who did more for the young rangers in 05-08 than Quinn can ever hope to.

When you really take a close look at Renney's tenure, his track record looks an awful lot like Quinn's so far.

 

[Tawnos]

Well the previous 3 coaches took a lot of heat here.

They weren't perfect, and all were let go at the right time but I'm missing them right now. Especially AV.

The heat those 3 guys took was as ridiculous then as the heat Quinn is taking now.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

You could say Quinn is our worst coach since the dark years

and you'd be 100% right

That’s a pretty dumb threshold...

 

[kovazub94]

Well, the question as posed to me three weeks ago was whether there's a move potentially on the horizon. The answer then was no. I think the Rangers wanted to get their guys back, see how the team responded, etc.

Today, I would say that the Rangers strong preference is still not to make an in-season move. However, that desire is not an infinite get out of jail free card for Quinn. With Panarin coming back, they will be watching to see how the team responds. And it is entirely possible that the next week or so could determine Quinn's fate.

In that scenario, I would be very surprised if Martin isn't named the interim coach. I don't think they'd go outside the organization, not at this time at least.

Hope folks reread this post with last night game added to the context.

Funny how Panarin returning and Zibanejad resembling more of his normal self (and some minor roster tweaks by Wuinn) gets everything else magically fall into place.

 

[kovazub94]

4 top-10 picks in a row having trouble adjusting and/or struggling with what this coaching staff is asking them to do.

One is an incident
Two is a coincidence
Three? Hard to blame it solely on the players
Four? Yeah, good luck excusing that

If we had drafted Mittelstadt, Wahlstrom, Zegras and Stützle would this team be any better off? Are we sure the problems wouldn't arise then? I honestly feel a lot of fans are giving the organization a pass no matter what happens. It's just too much for me to say this is all on multiple individuals and not on the common denominator

Interesting how you brought up Wahlstrom. Why because Trotz has played him limited minutes and on the bottom lines and, for some reason, is not an idiot for it.

 

[kovazub94]

No, it absolutely is the easiest thing to change coaches.

And that’s exactly why people pin everything on them.

Yup, but easiest and smartest are not the same.

 

[kovazub94]

Ok. Then let’s discuss it a different way. What coach is having any sort of success when a goalie lets in beach balls and your top center is playing to the level of a Boo Nieves?

what team has confidence if every single unscreened 50 footer is a goal?

Show me a bad goalie and I show you a coach who’s got bullseye on his back.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Interesting how you brought up Wahlstrom. Why because Trotz has played him limited minutes and on the bottom lines and, for some reason, is not an idiot for it.

Because he's one of the names that gets brought up by fans all the time when complaining about our drafting history

 

[True Blue]

Kakko has 4 points in 19 games.

Lafreniere has having probably the worst D+1 season for 1OA pick ever production-wise.

For such a chest beater of advanced metrics, you sure seem to have a very interesting ways of clinging to counting stats when it suits your argument.

Tell me, which of the previous 1OA picks had to NOT play hockey for 10 months prior to their D+1 season? And then have a two week camp. Can you name one? So before we try to pretend that the circumstances are exactly identical, perhaps a bit of context is necessary?

Miller has had more bad games than good.

Miller has now had more bad games than good? Ahh....first we praise him, then we cast him down when it suits the narrative.

Buchnevich is 26.

And how old was he and with what consistency was he playing when he met Quinn?

Fox is a franchise talent and Lindgren plays every minute with him. If you wanna give that to Quinn, fine, but it's still more bad than good.

Oh, right. I forgot that Fox came to the Rangers are a fully formed top pair defenseman. Must have gotten all of that in Harvard. Right. How could I forget. I am sure you simply KNEW that this 3rd round pick was border-line elite at the time of the trade, right?

And are you actually implying that Lindgren is a Fox creation? I say that because that is exactly what you seem to be doing. I said he developed to which you said that he plays every minute with Fox. That implies that you believe that he is where he due to being paired with Fox.

So not only did Fox come to the Rangers are a fully formed elite defenseman, but he is single handedly responsible for raising Lindgren from a mediocre B level prospect, to a legit top-4 (and frankly has played at a #2 level more than enough) shut down defenseman? Wow. Should get him spend more time with Smith. Think of the wonders he would do there.

We've had four top-10 forward picks since 2017 and all of them have had comically bad outcomes -- Kakko's rookie year, Lafreniere's rookie year, Kravtsov's heart-rate shitshow, Andersson's everything. Something is wrong here. If it's not Quinn, tell us what it is.

Ummm.....Andersson? Really? You are so desperate that you want to rehash that again?

It would also do you well to remember that Kravstov came back and stood out at the bubble and stood out this year at Traktor. But that would also muddle up the narrative, so why would you do that? And as I disagree that Lafreniere or Kakko are disappointing right now, I cannot really point any finger for you.

 

[True Blue]

Show me a bad goalie and I show you a coach who’s got bullseye on his back.

Funny how that is

 

[duhmetreE]

Funny how that is

Shesterkin was playing like a top5 goalie when he got hurt.

Georgiev has sucked and has received too many starts to begin with.. That's half on Quinn.

 

[True Blue]

Shesterkin was playing like a top5 goalie when he got hurt.

Georgiev has sucked and has received too many starts to begin with.. That's half on Quinn.

Shesterekin was playing in 70% of the previous games when he got hurt. Look at the preceding 10-15 games. No coach is going to start a rookie goalie for 10 straight games.

At the beginning of the year, both were atrocious.

 

[True Blue]

OK Boomer, everything is on course. Quinn is an amazing coach and getting everything we can expect out of the youngsters. In 2025 we are gonna rock this league.

Not sure that not beliving that this team was not really a contender makes one a Boomer or a Millennial. I would say that if you believed that this team was a contender, you were and are pretty much delusional.

Let me break this you gently. The team will not really be a true contender for a few more years.

 

[duhmetreE]

Shesterekin was playing in 70% of the previous games when he got hurt. Look at the preceding 10-15 games. No coach is going to start a rookie goalie for 10 straight games.

At the beginning of the year, both were atrocious.

I thought we glanced over this already. It was a 60/40 split. Still too heavy in Georgievs favor

If Shesterkin can't take a NHL starter load, we have another 'need'... as in a reliable backup

 

[True Blue]

You could say Quinn is our worst coach since the dark years

and you'd be 100% right

Clearly you do not remember Low or Muckler

 

[True Blue]

I thought we glanced over this already. It was a 60/40 split. Still too heavy in Georgievs favor

If Shesterkin can't take a NHL starter load, we have another 'need'... as in a reliable backup

Look at the preceding 10-15 games or so.

No coach is going to start a rookie goalie for 10 straight games. Not a one.

 

[Machinehead]

For such a chest beater of advanced metrics, you sure seem to have a very interesting ways of clinging to counting stats when it suits your argument.

Tell me, which of the previous 1OA picks had to NOT play hockey for 10 months prior to their D+1 season? And then have a two week camp. Can you name one? So before we try to pretend that the circumstances are exactly identical, perhaps a bit of context is necessary?

Gee, it's almost as if scoring is also important.

Do you really think "analytics chest-beaters" want guys with nice charts and zero points?

Miller has now had more bad games than good? Ahh....first we praise him, then we cast him down when it suits the narrative.

Been saying it in just about every GDT. This isn't a shift in narrative at all. I love Miller as a prospect but he had a long stretch this season where he was woeful. Both can be true.

And how old was he and with what consistency was he playing when he met Quinn?

Who cares? He's not a prospect. Talk about choosing things to fit the narrative.

Oh, right. I forgot that Fox came to the Rangers are a fully formed top pair defenseman.

Yes.

And are you actually implying that Lindgren is a Fox creation? I say that because that is exactly what you seem to be doing. I said he developed to which you said that he plays every minute with Fox. That implies that you believe that he is where he due to being paired with Fox.

I'm not implying that he's a Fox creation but playing with Fox is an easy job and Lindgren hasn't had the challenges that other players have. It's an easy situation to coach.

So not only did Fox come to the Rangers are a fully formed elite defenseman, but he is single handedly responsible for raising Lindgren from a mediocre B level prospect, to a legit top-4 (and frankly has played at a #2 level more than enough) shut down defenseman? Wow. Should get him spend more time with Smith. Think of the wonders he would do there.

In the limited time Fox and Smith were together this year, they had an xGF% of 51%. Again, yes.

I like how you create these gotcha scenarios that are the exact thing that happened.

Ummm.....Andersson? Really? You are so desperate that you want to rehash that again?

Andersson fits a specific criteria of player I'm talking about. I think he just sucks regardless of who the coach is but it would be silly to just pretend he didn't exist. I'm glad you decided to harp on that.

It would also do you well to remember that Kravstov came back and stood out at the bubble and stood out this year at Traktor. But that would also muddle up the narrative, so why would you do that? And as I disagree that Lafreniere or Kakko are disappointing right now, I cannot really point any finger for you.

Kravtsov didn't play in the bubble. Glad to hear he "stood out" watching from upstairs. Also glad to hear he stood out at Traktor where David Quinn isn't his coach, the entire f***ing point of the thread you're posting in.

 

[duhmetreE]

Look at the preceding 10-15 games or so.

No coach is going to start a rookie goalie for 10 straight games. Not a one.

Who said anything about starting him 10 straight games? I think you keep confusing the Boston game where Georgiev started and played but Shesty got the loss for a goal against when Georgiev was in concussion protocol.

Either way, Shesty should have been allowed to get in the groove from the beginning of the season. 80% of games is not a reach for a #1. Which would be 44-45 starts this season.... instead we have a hodgepodge rotation at 60/40.