Confirmed with Link: Dave Cameron Fired (along with Tourigny, Wamsley) (starts at post 208)

[SixthSens]

http://senators.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=878443

Click to read more...

 

[Knave]

I think he needs to go. The system isn't working or the players have checked out on him (since before we were out of the playoff race).

I don't think you can leave the coaching staff as is. It may not be entirely on Cameron and his staff but a change needs to be made... and it's easier to change the coaching than it is to overhaul the roster.

We have Karlsson, Stone who have shown they're the real deals.

We have a ton of young pieces in the NHL like Ceci, Zibanejad, Pageau and also prospects.
We have guys like Ryan, MacArthur, Methot and Phaneuf who can be important role players.
We need to figure out if it can work or not before we ship them out.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

MacLean had the exact same problem at the end of his tenure here.

When two coaches have the roster failing to perform the most basic defensive plays I think it's fair to say that problem isn't just the coach.

 

[ChelFan31]

MacLean had the exact same problem at the end of his tenure here.

When two coaches have the roster failing to perform the most basic defensive plays I think it's fair to say that problem isn't just the coach.

Oh I agree completely. The real issue resides above the coaches ie: management. We desperately need an upgrade there. Hopefully Melnyk finally clues in this time...but as Alfies says 'Probably not'

 

[ChelFan31]

I can totally see Melynk skimming on the coaching/ scouting/ and whole Sens organization as a whole ...until relocation to LeBreton ...where he'll probably double up in value & sell

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Oh I agree completely. The real issue resides above the coaches ie: management. We desperately need an upgrade there. Hopefully Melnyk finally clues in this time...but as Alfies says 'Probably not'

Ownership, management and the coaches can't play the game for the players.

My point is that the issues probably run deeper than just at the coaching level: it doesn't mean coaching cannot be improved to help address the issue but failure to execute the most basic plays and stick to the plan can't only be on the coach and/or management.

 

[Back in Black]

Fire Murray, move on......

 

[Mingus Dew]

Ownership, management and the coaches can't play the game for the players.

My point is that the issues probably run deeper than just at the coaching level: it doesn't mean coaching cannot be improved to help address the issue but failure to execute the most basic plays and stick to the plan can't only be on the coach and/or management.

I agree with this. Maclean's downfall looked eerily similar to what we have seen from Cameron: come in and have immediate success --> slowly lose the room until it looks like a firing is inevitable.

 

[aragorn]

Ownership, management and the coaches can't play the game for the players.

My point is that the issues probably run deeper than just at the coaching level: it doesn't mean coaching cannot be improved to help address the issue but failure to execute the most basic plays and stick to the plan can't only be on the coach and/or management.

Again I`ve been saying this for sometime, the players have to take some responsibility for their reckless play, their unwillingness to play more of a defensive style & for all their turnovers & penalties & inability on the special teams. It will be very interesting if Ottawa brings in a new head coach like a Julien who is defensivley minded & wants his team to play a defence first mentality what that will do with some of these players. What if he wants Karlsson to take less risks & be much more defensive minded & his point totals drop dramtically? Ryan & Hoffman could be in his doghouse too.

I agree with this. Maclean's downfall looked eerily similar to what we have seen from Cameron: come in and have immediate success --> slowly lose the room until it looks like a firing is inevitable.

Exactly, we have seen this before from the Adams winner. It's not all the coaches fault, there are players on this team who don't want to play the game the way they are being coached & want to run & gun which is more fun but also more reckless.

We saw it in games all the time this yr when they are too high along the boards & can't seem to wait to get out of the D-zone. We see a few guys like Smith, Pageau & Stone come deep in the defensive zone to help defend & we also see Ryan & Hoffman sitting close to the blueline waiting to get the hell out & not defending. Zibanejad, Ryan & Hoffman should only be together if we are behind & need to catch up in the 3rd period. Otherwise they need to keep those three apart & play them with defensive players since they can't seem to play as well defensively together.

 

[slamigo]

Ownership, management and the coaches can't play the game for the players.

My point is that the issues probably run deeper than just at the coaching level: it doesn't mean coaching cannot be improved to help address the issue but failure to execute the most basic plays and stick to the plan can't only be on the coach and/or management.

There's definitely something systemic within the organization that is leading to this cycle that seems to keep repeating.
It's like all the ingredients separately don't seem like a problem, but combined they equal a losing team.
The roster isn't lights out amazing, but it isn't that bad either.

Still feel that this team needs an outside audit. New perspective.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

The problem is, we keep trying to fit round pegs into square holes.

Look at the guys we have on this team. How many of these guys are legit 200-foot players? Maybe 3 or 4 guys? The rest are either defensive or offensive specialists. The idea of pounding the creativity out of all our guys to turn them into 200-players simply doesn't work.

We need a coach that will work to the players' strengths. We have a ton of 'specialists' who can do 1 or 2 things well. Pair these guys up with complimentary players, give players specific jobs, give everyone a basic offensive/defensive strategy (so guys aren't overwhelmed when tasked to complete a job in their weak area), and let the guys go to it on the ice. That's when the team shines...when the coach loosens the reins and lets them play. We always run into trouble when the coach tries to "over structure" the game.

 

[operasen]

The problem is, we keep trying to fit round pegs into square holes.

Look at the guys we have on this team. How many of these guys are legit 200-foot players? Maybe 3 or 4 guys? The rest are either defensive or offensive specialists. The idea of pounding the creativity out of all our guys to turn them into 200-players simply doesn't work.

We need a coach that will work to the players' strengths. We have a ton of 'specialists' who can do 1 or 2 things well. Pair these guys up with complimentary players, give players specific jobs, give everyone a basic offensive/defensive strategy (so guys aren't overwhelmed when tasked to complete a job in their weak area), and let the guys go to it on the ice. That's when the team shines...when the coach loosens the reins and lets them play. We always run into trouble when the coach tries to "over structure" the game.

Thank You. A coach has to be able to motivate his guys as well as coach them. We have never had one that can. Maybe Jacques Martin when things were still developing.

2 more games for Cameron and this staff and then it has to be over. Murray too.

 

[slamigo]

We need a coach that will work to the players' strengths. We have a ton of 'specialists' who can do 1 or 2 things well. Pair these guys up with complimentary players, give players specific jobs, give everyone a basic offensive/defensive strategy (so guys aren't overwhelmed when tasked to complete a job in their weak area), and let the guys go to it on the ice. That's when the team shines...when the coach loosens the reins and lets them play. We always run into trouble when the coach tries to "over structure" the game.

I remember back in the day, Spezza and Alfie used to switch roles often in the defensive zone. Alfie would often play the defensive 3rd dman role that the centre is supposed to play when the puck was in Ottawa's end. Spezza would troll up along the boards a bit and wait for Alfie to get him the puck and he'd take off to quarterback the offense. Spezza wasn't as good at Alfie on the defensive side so the team made adjustments and that line was ridiculous.

 

[Micklebot]

The problem is, we keep trying to fit round pegs into square holes.

Look at the guys we have on this team. How many of these guys are legit 200-foot players? Maybe 3 or 4 guys? The rest are either defensive or offensive specialists. The idea of pounding the creativity out of all our guys to turn them into 200-players simply doesn't work.

We need a coach that will work to the players' strengths. We have a ton of 'specialists' who can do 1 or 2 things well. Pair these guys up with complimentary players, give players specific jobs, give everyone a basic offensive/defensive strategy (so guys aren't overwhelmed when tasked to complete a job in their weak area), and let the guys go to it on the ice. That's when the team shines...when the coach loosens the reins and lets them play. We always run into trouble when the coach tries to "over structure" the game.

I think as far as 200 ft players, we have Turris, MacArthur, Stone as easily fitting in to the category. This year, Smith certainly fits, though it's hard to say if that will continue.

I think Pageau fits the bill, probably Zibanejad too (he's a bit more offensive, but I wouldn't call him one dimensional).

For what it's worth, I think both Cameron and McLean have a far looser struture than a lot of the coaching candidates being touted. Guys like Hitch, Julien, and Stephens aren't going to loosen up the reins, if anything the opposite.

One of the biggest problems with this team has been the PK, and the more I look at it, the more I believe it's an issue with the forwards. We lack experience big time, among our PK forwards, and on top of that we have them playing aggresively. That's going to lead to a lot of mistakes.

Looking at last year, our top 3 PK forwards in TOI were Condra, Legwand, and Michalek. All three are gone, and while Michalek was here, he was missing too much time to injury to play on our PK. Playing the PK is about working as a unit, and when you have that much turnover, replaced by that much inexperience, it's gonna result in growing pains.

Now, the coaches aren't off scott free just because the personnel is part of the issue. Imo, they should have had the guys playing a much safer PK. We don't need to be going after short handed goals until we can sort out the defensive end of the PK first. Too many times I saw high risk low percentage plays on the PK instead of a simple clear or dump in to kill time off the clock. That's partially inexperience among the forwards, but coaches should have snuffed those tendencies out early until these guys got their stuff together in our own end.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I remember back in the day, Spezza and Alfie used to switch roles often in the defensive zone. Alfie would often play the defensive 3rd dman role that the centre is supposed to play when the puck was in Ottawa's end. Spezza would troll up along the boards a bit and wait for Alfie to get him the puck and he'd take off to quarterback the offense. Spezza wasn't as good at Alfie on the defensive side so the team made adjustments and that line was ridiculous.

Exactly!

The same way that Zibby isn't necessarily the "engine" of his line as a center. Well, have a high energy winger assume some of the playmaking duties. Just because the traditional lineup say position X has to do A, B and C....that doesn't mean you have to do it that way forever.

 

[jbeck5]

Ownership, management and the coaches can't play the game for the players.

My point is that the issues probably run deeper than just at the coaching level: it doesn't mean coaching cannot be improved to help address the issue but failure to execute the most basic plays and stick to the plan can't only be on the coach and/or management.

Honestly, over the last 9 years, we've overhauled our roster several times over...we've had several coaches...the only constants are Murray and melnyk.

 

[LevelingSolo]

I think trading for Phaneuf was management telling Cameron to make the playoffs

Like being told "Here's your top 4 defenseman now go win"

Team never took off even with the addition and now Cameron is on the hotseat

 

[Samsquanch]

I think trading for Phaneuf was management telling Cameron to make the playoffs

Like being told "Here's your top 4 defenseman now go win"

Team never took off even with the addition and now Cameron is on the hotseat

Agree with this. It basically mirrors how I've felt about the team and Cameron. I gave him the benefit of the doubt until this last 1/4 of the season.

And my god, the blown leads...it's just too much, and they all look frighteningly similar to his WJC meltdown.

Now it's clear he has to be let go in my mind, and this is coming from a pretty big supporter of his. I'm fairly sure there would be uproar of sorts if he was still the coach at the start of training camp.

 

[Super Cake]

Agree with this. It basically mirrors how I've felt about the team and Cameron. I gave him the benefit of the doubt until this last 1/4 of the season.

And my god, the blown leads...it's just too much, and they all look frighteningly similar to his WJC meltdown.

Now it's clear he has to be let go in my mind, and this is coming from a pretty big supporter of his. I'm fairly sure there would be uproar of sorts if he was still the coach at the start of training camp.

The blown leads drive me crazy. I knew the Sens were going to give up the 3 goal lead in both the Ducks game and the Pens game. You could sense it coming. The other team turns up the heat and the Sens just start making careless mistakes or don't even know what to do when they start to fee the pressure. Cameron has no clue how to calm these guys down when the pressure goes up.

 

[chipsens]

Idiocy =repeating same mistakes but expecting different results. Next year's forecast=showers of idiocy, followed by glimmers of hope...

 

[Mingus Dew]

I have a sinking feeling that Cameron will be here next year. I know Melnyk kind of went off on him, but I don't think Davey boy is getting fired.

 

[PatrickEaves]

Like Edmonton, it's organizational culture.

Also like Edmonton, it starts from the owner down.

 

[LevelingSolo]

Agree with this. It basically mirrors how I've felt about the team and Cameron. I gave him the benefit of the doubt until this last 1/4 of the season.

And my god, the blown leads...it's just too much, and they all look frighteningly similar to his WJC meltdown.

Now it's clear he has to be let go in my mind, and this is coming from a pretty big supporter of his. I'm fairly sure there would be uproar of sorts if he was still the coach at the start of training camp.

Yeah the blown leads are unreal, no lead under Cameron ever felt safe and the team always seemed to milk the clock everytime it took the lead in a game.

There was even a game last season where the team blew a 4 goal lead in one period!!! (I think it was against the flames)

 

[Back in Black]

I can’t believe you guys keep blaming the coaches because the players not wanting to play for them. How many coaches has Murray fired????????

 

[ChelFan31]

I can’t believe you guys keep blaming the coaches because the players not wanting to play for them. How many coaches has Murray fired????????

Because they're all so easily hogwashed with the constant PR spin the organization likes to use...

They'll catch on thou...when we end up in the same position next year