Crosby vs Ovechkin

[Lomez]

Who are the better fanboys? Crosby fanboys or Ovi fanboys?

 

[Dominance]

So factual statments are misleading ,are you CNN and like it has been said missed games are not rewarded lol if so Lindros is way better than Crosby , Crosby also had a whopping 2 more points this season than Ovie ,and 20 less goals so at that rate Sid might tie him in points in 20/21

No, that’s a mathematical prediction based on their aggregate offensive production over the course of their careers coupled with the expected rate by which production slows as players grow older - Ovi is, after all, almost 2 years older than Crosby. It’s by no means a given, but it’s a statement based on statistical analysis, and therefore one I’d put my money behind.

 

[StoneHands]

Tbf Sid would have many more MVPs if it wasn't for his injuries.

As for the Rockets, I mean yeah Ovi is a better goal scorer so it's not surprising.

TBF that's purely speculation and staying healthy is a pretty important attribute in a player. You can't take an injury prone player and spin it to make him actually sound better the same way you can't assume Ovechkin would have won another Cup and Smythe in 2009 if his teammates didn't poop the bed. It didn't happen and Crosby did get hurt so he didn't win more MVPs, it's really that simple. You could also say the same about Ovechkin who would have won the Hart in 2010 if he didn't miss 10 games. In 10 less games, he had 21 more goals and 3 less points than Sedin who barely beat him for the Hart.

As for the points per game, I mean yeah Sid is a better playmaker so it's not surprising.

 

[VainGretzky]

Well Ovechkin scores more than McDavid. Therefore Ovi > McBasement

Yes right now Ovie carrer has been better than McDavids , why would you think otherwise

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

TBF that's purely speculation and staying healthy is a pretty important attribute in a player. You can't take an injury prone player and spin it to make him actually sound better the same way you can't assume Ovechkin would have won another Cup and Smythe in 2009 if his teammates didn't poop the bed. It didn't happen and Crosby did get hurt so he didn't win more MVPs, it's really that simple. You could also say the same about Ovechkin who would have won the Hart in 2010 if he didn't miss 10 games. In 10 less games, he had 21 more goals and 3 less points than Sedin who barely beat him for the Hart.

As for the points per game, I mean yeah Sid is a better playmaker so it's not surprising.

You're right. Shoulda coulda woulda don't matter. But to suggest that Sid isn't the most complete player in the NHL today would be false. OV's a better goal scorer. Sid's a better playmaker. Sid's the more complete of the two. Doesn't mean Ovi is bad, just a different type of player.

 

[CokenoPepsi]

He would have 2 more art Ross trophies.

If we are going games missed count Ovechkin would have another Hart and Rocket trophy as well.

 

[SEALBound]

If we are going games missed count Ovechkin would have another Hart and Rocket trophy as well.

How many more would Crosby have?

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

Yes right now Ovie carrer has been better than McDavids , why would you think otherwise

I'm not talking about their careers, I'm talking about the last two seasons. 82 goals > 71 goals. Well according to you anyway.

 

[CokenoPepsi]

How many more would Crosby have?

1...MAYBE 2 for the lockout year

 

[StoneHands]

You're right. Shoulda coulda woulda don't matter. But to suggest that Sid isn't the most complete player in the NHL today would be false. OV's a better goal scorer. Sid's a better playmaker. Sid's the more complete of the two. Doesn't mean Ovi is bad, just a different type of player.

I don't disagree, in fact I never have! I simply said I didn't like that the guy started his post by sarcastically saying "real impressive Ovi" and then went on to name all of Crosby's awards while completely ignoring Ovechkins.

 

[VainGretzky]

No, that’s a mathematical prediction based on their aggregate offensive production over the course of their careers coupled with the expected rate by which production slows as players grow older - Ovi is, after all, almost 2 years older than Crosby. It’s by no means a given, but it’s a statement based on statistical analysis, and therefore one I’d put my money behind.

Wow you keep adding your physics equation , and I will stick to the ones in reality Ovie 1122 Crosby 1116 Ovie NHL individual awards 16 Crosby 12 I know how facts can be disturbing to some people , and no type of physics or what ifs change them

 

[SEALBound]

1...MAYBE 2 for the lockout year

2011 and 2013 I'd say, at least.

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

I don't disagree, in fact I never have! I simply said I didn't like that the guy started his post by sarcastically saying "real impressive Ovi" and then went on to name all of Crosby's awards while completely ignoring Ovechkins.

My bad then.

 

[BlueBull]

Ovechkin over Crosby kinda feels like saying Yzerman over Lemieux. It just does not sound right imo.
However, I don't really like saying who is the GOAT and all that. So I always think by era.
"And your point is..."
Well, That is just me talking a bit. I think by the time both of these players careers are over, the Crosby or Ovechkin Debate will be somewhat of a Stalemate.
Right now my rank of Top 5 Players of the New Millennium is this:
1/2. Crosby/Ovechkin (It's getting really close, so I can't pick just one of them.)
3. Thornton (Most points since 2000.)
4. Jagr (His dominant years were the late 90s.)
5. Malkin (Getting there. Might be 4th by the end of his career.)

 

[StoneHands]

How many more would Crosby have?

One more in the lockout year. It's impossible to speculate other years when he missed 30-50 games.

 

[Breakers]

If you look at there Careers, can one really say that Crosby has outperformed Ovechkin thus far? IMO, Ovechkin's 07-08' season was better than any of Crosby's seasons.

Oh, and, injuries play a big factor, the player who is less injured (IMO) and more durable should make that player advantageous to have.

Now, both their individual performances are on par together.
Can you really say that Crosby has had the better career than Ovechkin?
Hockey is a 20-man-game, Ovechkin finally won this year, but, the previous years he had no help from his team-mates.

This year, when OV's teammates finally decided to show up ---- the caps looked just as dangerous as the Pens ever did.

Remember, Crosby had superstars on his teams when he won the cup. It's not Ovechkin's fault that his teammates didn't show up.

Crosby, Malkin, Kessel, Neal, Hornquvist, Kunitz, Letang, Gonchar, Guentzel, etc.

Crosby's team was always loaded in the Playoffs. Meanwhile, OV's team never showed up.

So, can you make a justified argument, without using cups as a factor (since Hockey is a 20 man sport), about who is better?

STOP with this Ovi had no one to play with
Backstrom is one of the premier centers in this league, and he plays well in the playoffs.

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

Wow you keep adding your physics equation , and I will stick to the ones in reality Ovie 1122 Crosby 1116 Ovie NHL individual awards 16 Crosby 12 I know how facts can be disturbing to some people , and no type of physics or what ifs change them

Lemieux missed on a ton of awards due to injuries. Does that make him a worse player than if he would've been healthy?

 

[Dominance]

Wow you keep adding your physics equation , and I will stick to the ones in reality Ovie 1122 Crosby 1116 Ovie NHL individual awards 16 Crosby 12 I know how facts can be disturbing to some people , and no type of physics or what ifs change them

Yikes, McDavid is pretty bad at hockey by that logic. It’s sad that your ability to assess players is limited to the most basic of numbers, beyond which you seemingly have no ability to comprehend. I already firmly addressed the awards, but I’ll add now that 3 Cups vs 1 Cup and the World Cup of Hockey MVP - which was an NHL event - makes that pretty even. As for the points, Crosby has more as soon as you factor in playoff scoring, which should automatically make him better, full stop, in your eyes.

The stubborn repetition of the fact that Ovi has six - yes, such a small number that grammar dictates for it to be written - more points, despite playing in ~150 more games to get there and Crosby having lost those games while in his prime, is extraordinary.

Edit: And don’t even think of bringing up the quality of teams Crosby has played on after adamantly refusing to recognize any factor other than quantity of regular season points and number of awards.

 

[VainGretzky]

Lemieux missed on a ton of awards due to injuries. Does that make him a worse player than if he would've been healthy?

Individual awards are a pretty good indicator of a players career sepeaates the Oil from the water Lemieux is up their with the best they all trail the greatest player ever Gretzky who has FACTS to back this up

 

[VainGretzky]

Yikes, McDavid is pretty bad at hockey by that logic. It’s sad that your ability to assess players is limited to the most basic of numbers, beyond which you seemingly have no ability to comprehend. I already firmly addressed the awards, but I’ll add now that 3 Cups vs 1 Cup and the World Cup of Hockey MVP - which was an NHL event - makes that pretty even.

The stubborn repetition of the fact that Ovi has six - yes, such a small number that grammar dictates for it to be written - more points, despite playing in ~150 more games to get there and Crosby having lost those games while in his prime, is extraordinary.

Lol stop reaching were not comparing OVIE and Crosby after 3 years , both have had long careers 13 years longer than most players careers to guage , I simply state statistical facts as well as hardware facts , you're arguing with strawman .

 

[Dominance]

Lol stop reaching were not comparing OVIE and Crosby after 3 years , both have had long careers to guage , I simply state statistical facts as well as hardware facts , you're arguing with strawman .

My mistake for not understanding the limits of your logic. I edited my post with a few more tantalizing statements, namely total points; please address those as well.

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

Individual awards are a pretty good indicator

But that's just it. Awards are just an indicator like say PPG. Production counts just as much as hardware, if not more.

 

[Kasperi kapanen]

Pointless.

 

[VainGretzky]

My mistake for not understanding the limits of your logic. I edited my post with a few more tantalizing statements, namely total points; please address those as well.

I am sorry if my logic is reality based on factual concrete undisputable evidence of accomplishments instead of pro rated hypotheticals . Hard to be a realist these days

 

[Kasperi kapanen]

I am sorry if my logic is reality based on factual concrete undisputable evidence of accomplishments instead of pro rated hypotheticals . Hard to be a realist these days

Do you think Crosby would’ve scored at LEAST 6 points during his games missed?