Could the NHL survive without Canadian markets?

[Kadoosh*]

I've seen several Hfboards posters claim that the league would collapse without its Canadian markets and thought it was a good hypothetical

What would the NHL look like if all it's Canadian teams were suddenly annexed by Bettman tomorrow? It should be noted that the NHL has a big fat TV deal in Canada that provides it with a lot of revenue. It's also a hotbed of talent for the time being and the one region where Hockey is treated as something more than a niche sport

 

[Mayor Bee]

No.

Nor could it succeed without American markets, including "non-traditional" American markets.

 

[MrFunnyWobbl]

No.

Nor could it succeed without American markets, including "non-traditional" American markets.

Survive? Probably

Prosper? Unlikely

 

[Clamshells]

It would definitely survive, but it would be a struggle... I'd imagine the 7 Canadian teams would instantly form their own professional league (adding QC, Toronto 2, and possibly a third team almost instantly.) You'd see a lot of european/russian players go play back home because the cap would drop considerably along with player salaries.

Cutting out Canadian teams would instantly create three strong competitors to siphon talent away, and interest.

 

[hatterson]

Depends on what you mean as survive.

Is it possible for a professional hockey league to exist with only American markets? Sure, but its stars wouldn't be making 10+M a season and it won't have the best players in the world. The same would hold true for a league with only Canadian markets.

 

[Dogewow]

Survive? Probably

Prosper? Unlikely

This right here.

It could definitely survive. But it definitely would not be as well off financially as it would be with the big Canadian markets making tons of money for the league.

 

[Ducks in a row]

Without the Canadian markets it would survive but things would be a lot different. Players would make a lot less money for example and tickets would be cheaper as well.

 

[Dogewow]

Without the Canadian markets it would survive but things would be a lot different. Players would make a lot less money for example and tickets would be cheaper as well.

That and you gotta wonder how franchises like Arizona would fare without teams in Canada making tons of money for the league revenue sharing policy. Though, I'm not an expert on the business/financial side of things, maybe someone with more expertise on this could chime in?

 

[dubey]

Yes but just not on the scale it does today

 

[Crede777]

If the Canadian cities were cut out, I think they would start their own league and incorporate some of the smaller Canadian cities as well as 2 or 3 teams in the GTA. Due to profitability of the larger Canadian markets, the league would offer similar if only slightly smaller salaries to players.

This would fragment the talent in the NHL. As a result, the two leagues would coexist for a while before one incorporates the other similar to the IHL NHL merger. The smaller Canadian cities would lose their franchises as well as one or two of the GTA teams. It is possible that some of the US franchises would also be dropped.

The result would be a league of 28-32 teams very similar to the NHL today.

 

[FLYLine27*]

Survive? Sure I guess. But it wouldn't do well. Canada would end up making their own league which would rival the "American" NHL and cause a big mess with both leagues trying to get the better players.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I think the league could survive without the 7 Canadian teams but salaries would have to be severely diminished.

If the O6 teams were removed though, the league would collapse. The most valuable franchise would be Vancouver.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Maybe, but no Canadian revenue would mean contraction for cash strapped teams in less than ideal markets.

It would be a 10-12 team league.

 

[Rebuilt]

I dunno. I doubt the NHL survives as a major league if someone like Donald Trump decided to buy up all the American teams and start his own 'WHA' leaving the NHL with 7 teams.

 

[Lomez]

No offense, but not a terribly provocative or thoughtful question as there is really only one answer (yes, but in a diminished state), so...are we done here?

 

[Rebuilt]

No offense, but not a terribly provocative or thoughtful question as there is really only one answer (yes, but in a diminished state), so...are we done here?

I think you are vastly over estimating how much Americans care what the Canadian teams are doing just because they are in Canada nor if the trophy they get is called the Stanley Cup as opposed to the AVCO cup.

It wouldnt take very long until the Canadian component was forgotten. Its about economics and the NHL would turn into a CFL equivalent to the NFL.

 

[Rebuilt]

Maybe, but no Canadian revenue would mean contraction for cash strapped teams in less than ideal markets.

It would be a 10-12 team league.

The Canadian dollar is falling and there are only realistically 3 canadian teams to feed the cash cow and there are several American ones who feed it.

New York
Detroit
Chicago
Philadelphia

vs

Toronto
Montreal
Vancouver

and 4 lesser markets who are in no position to feed anyone

Edmonton
Calgary
Winnipeg
Ottawa

 

[Lomez]

I think you are vastly over estimating how much Americans care what the Canadian teams are doing just because they are in Canada nor if the trophy they get is called the Stanley Cup as opposed to the AVCO cup.

It wouldnt take very long until the Canadian component was forgotten. Its about economics and the NHL would turn into a CFL equivalent to the NFL.

This has to be one of the most ridiculous posts ever on these boards--and that's saying something. I am "vastly overestimating" the importance of Canadian markets and the NHL would not be diminished in marketability, earnings, talent, influence, profitability, etc. given their absence. Good lord, that's just stupid.

 

[Machinehead]

Survive, yes. But you're taking a lot of money out of the game.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Yes.

Thanks to the salary cap, losing 4 teams that make a small profit and 3 that literally print money will reduce the cap, thereby lowering the cap and allowing the small markets in America to prosper.

 

[Kuhta]

I think a competitive 20 team league would be the way to go from that point.

I guess that it would remain as the No1 league in the world. Then tied at second would be´Canadian Hockey League' and KHL.

 

[onlyalad]

That and you gotta wonder how franchises like Arizona would fare without teams in Canada making tons of money for the league revenue sharing policy. Though, I'm not an expert on the business/financial side of things, maybe someone with more expertise on this could chime in?

They might do better. The cap floor would be much lower so they might be able to afford a team.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I think a competitive 20 team league would be the way to go from that point.

I guess that it would remain as the No1 league in the world. Then tied at second would be´Canadian Hockey League' and KHL.

I'm sure the 7 Canadian teams would fare better on their own than the 23 American teams. The teams like Toronto and Montreal help the teams like Arizona, Carolina and Florida to stay afloat.

 

[sully1410]

The Canadian dollar is falling and there are only realistically 3 canadian teams to feed the cash cow and there are several American ones who feed it.

New York
Detroit
Chicago
Philadelphia

vs

Toronto
Montreal
Vancouver

and 4 lesser markets who are in no position to feed anyone

Edmonton
Calgary
Winnipeg
Ottawa

Ummm...no.

Ottawa is the only franchise that doesn't.make a **** tonne of money. Edmonton, Calgary and Winnipeg are on par with more successful franchises.

 

[Rebuilt]

This has to be one of the most ridiculous posts ever on these boards--and that's saying something. I am "vastly overestimating" the importance of Canadian markets and the NHL would not be diminished in marketability, earnings, talent, influence, profitability, etc. given their absence. Good lord, that's just stupid.

I said you are vastly over estimating how much Americans care about the Canadian markets. Try to re read it.

The Canadian markets do matter but only 3 do really. I dont think the other 4 are giving away money in transfer payments. In fact I believe 2 or 3 are recipients.

Your post makes it seem like you are INSULTED by these facts but it is the truth. There is some kind of myth that American Hockey fans would cry a river and not watch hockey games anymore if the Canadian teams left and took the Stanley Cup with it.

Most americans cant even point out Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver on a map. They only know it exists because their team comes across them.

The Canadian players being fed from the CHL is still dominant, but I doubt these players snub the new American NHL and all its money to stay in Canada and compete against 6 other teams.

So the question was would the NHL survive without the Canadian teams and yes, they would. You are right it wouldnt be as rich but it would survive.

The Canadian teams would NOT survive without the American market. Not in the same financial form anyways. In my opinion it would become a CFL due to the best players fleeing to the United States NHL.