Value of: Carson Soucy to Toronto

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Seattle has firmly established itself as seller and Toronto will ne looking to upgrade the roster.

Kyle Dubas has said he would prefer to acquire a player with term, which has always been his preference.

Carson Soucy fits that bill, he has a year left beyond this one and so he's a player I could see Dubas targeting.

In fact Seattle in general is a team I could see Toronto targeting, not just for Carson Soucy but also for Girodano, Jarnkrok, Johansson, and maybe even McCann.

I do think a deal is coming between these 2 teams

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[Vitto79]

He’s a good target of Seattle chooses to move some non UFAs

they likely would want Dermott and a 2nd

 

[KevinRedkey]

Why would Seattle trade him?

 

[RainyCityHockey]

Why would Seattle trade him?

To get something really nice.
If no one's offering that I don't think he'll be traded during the season.

BTW:
How about Ritchie, 1st round pick for Soucy?

Toronto gets their defensmen, who can play both sides, with term left and a solid cap hit while also moving out Ritchie, who they need to get rid off anyways.

 

[KevinRedkey]

To get something really nice.
If no one's offering that I don't think he'll be traded during the season.

BTW:
How about Ritchie, 1st round pick for Soucy?

Toronto gets their defensmen, who can play both sides, with term left and a solid cap hit while also moving out Ritchie, who they need to get rid off anyways.

Soucy alone is probably worth very close to a late 1st round pick, no?
Adding in Ritchie lowers the value meaning Toronto adds IMO.

Note: I wonder how much more expensive Gavrikov would be?

 

[RainyCityHockey]

Soucy alone is probably worth very close to a late 1st round pick, no?
Adding in Ritchie lowers the value meaning Toronto adds IMO.

Sure, as a Kraken fan I'd take more.

 

[Roof Daddy]

If Soucy is on the market, I would hope the Oil are in on it. Maybe expand the deal a bit:

To EDM: Soucy, Jarnkrok

To SEA: 2022 1st, choice of Savoie/Lavoie, Barrie, cond 2023 2nd (if Oil make final 4)

 

[RainyCityHockey]

If Soucy is on the market, I would hope the Oil are in on it. Maybe expand the deal a bit:

To EDM: Soucy, Jarnkrok

To SEA: 2022 1st, choice of Savoie/Lavoie, Barrie, cond 2023 2nd (if Oil make final 4)

The Kraken won't take back that contract of Barrie.
Jarnkrok alone should be worth a 2nd rounder around the TDL, especially with the way he's been playing for the past two months.

 

[Akrapovince]

Soucy alone is probably worth very close to a late 1st round pick, no?
Adding in Ritchie lowers the value meaning Toronto adds IMO.

Note: I wonder how much more expensive Gavrikov would be?

I see Gavrikov as the same as Zub for us, even more valuable. You won’t get the same value as he’s worth back to you, so unless he’s forcing a trade it won’t happen.

If Ottawa were acquiring him I think it would have to be a 1st + Pinto situation. Too rich for my blood.

 

[KevinRedkey]

I see Gavrikov as the same as Zub for us, even more valuable. You won’t get the same value as he’s worth back to you, so unless he’s forcing a trade it won’t happen.

If Ottawa were acquiring him I think it would have to be a 1st + Pinto situation. Too rich for my blood.

You're probably right.

 

[Roof Daddy]

The Kraken won't take back that contract of Barrie.
Jarnkrok alone should be worth a 2nd rounder around the TDL, especially with the way he's been playing for the past two months.

Why wouldn’t they take back Barrie? Couldn’t they use a bit of help on the PP? I don’t see Barrie as holding any value in this equation, but if you think he’s a negative/cap dump, I think you’re selling him short (especially looking at the Kraken roster the next 2 years).

And I agree, Jarnkrok is worth a 2nd, which is where the choice between Lavoie/Savoie comes in. Lavoie was an early 2nd in 2019 who’s played up to expectation; Savoie has improved his stock/draft position to the value of a 2nd. Would think Seattle would prefer prospects vs picks considering their pool started from scratch just last year.

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

He’s a good target of Seattle chooses to move some non UFAs

they likely would want Dermott and a 2nd

a #7 dman and a ~50ish pick?

I wouldn't think so

 

[Mike Jones]

The Kraken won't take back that contract of Barrie.

Why not? Throw in another pick and remove the condition off that '23 2nd round pick and that wouldn't be a bad package for those two. Seattle definitely has the cap space to bring Barrie into the fold. It looks like he could still contribute for the next season or two.

 

[RainyCityHockey]

Why wouldn’t they take back Barrie? Couldn’t they use a bit of help on the PP? I don’t see Barrie as holding any value in this equation, but if you think he’s a negative/cap dump, I think you’re selling him short (especially looking at the Kraken roster the next 2 years).

And I agree, Jarnkrok is worth a 2nd, which is where the choice between Lavoie/Savoie comes in. Lavoie was an early 2nd in 2019 who’s played up to expectation; Savoie has improved his stock/draft position to the value of a 2nd. Would think Seattle would prefer prospects vs picks considering their pool started from scratch just last year.

Because Barrie's a non defensive defensmen that has two more years at $4.5 mil left on his contract.

The Kraken also have a solid pp option on the blue line in Vince Dunn(if Hakstol would ever stop playing Giordano on pp1), who's young and has shown defensive improvement this season.

Barrie would be a cap dump for two more seasons and would eat $4.5M of our cap space even though you've basically have to shelter him on the 3rd pair(with a defensive defensmen on his side) so you can roll him out during the pp.

On top of it, Francis stayed away from those kind of contracts during the expansion draft and won't start doing so now.

Why not? Throw in another pick and remove the condition off that '23 2nd round pick and that wouldn't be a bad package for those two. Seattle definitely has the cap space to bring Barrie into the fold. It looks like he could still contribute for the next season or two.

So you want two more years of a guy that can't do what his actualy job discription suggests and has two more years at $4.5 mil left on his deal?

 

[Hodge]

Why wouldn’t they take back Barrie? Couldn’t they use a bit of help on the PP? I don’t see Barrie as holding any value in this equation, but if you think he’s a negative/cap dump, I think you’re selling him short (especially looking at the Kraken roster the next 2 years).

And I agree, Jarnkrok is worth a 2nd, which is where the choice between Lavoie/Savoie comes in. Lavoie was an early 2nd in 2019 who’s played up to expectation; Savoie has improved his stock/draft position to the value of a 2nd. Would think Seattle would prefer prospects vs picks considering their pool started from scratch just last year.

Nobody wants Edmonton's trash. Dumping Barrie's contract alone should cost a 1st round pick. Dude is one of the worst defensemen in the league and owed $9.5M in salary over the remainder of his deal.

 

[Mike Jones]

So you want two more years of a guy that can't do what his actualy job discription suggests and has two more years at $4.5 mil left on his deal?

It's what 'weaponizing the available capspace' looks like in real time. I watch Oilers games - the guy can still play a role and can fill a roster spot for two more seasons. If Seattle misses the playoffs in '24 they can always flip him at that deadline.

 

[Roof Daddy]

Because Barrie's a non defensive defensmen that has two more years at $4.5 mil left on his contract.

Fair enough, if you consider him a dump then I won’t push the issue suggesting otherwise. He has definitely played poorly most of the year, but he’s looked better (much like all of our players) since the coaching change.

I’d be equally content keeping him and trying to land Soucy and Jarnkrok. So if it’s expiring contracts, is the 1st + choice of Savoie/Lavoie agreeable?

1st + Savoie/Lavoie + Turris + Russell for Soucy + Jarnkrok

 

[RainyCityHockey]

Fair enough, if you consider him a dump then I won’t push the issue suggesting otherwise. He has definitely played poorly most of the year, but he’s looked better (much like all of our players) since the coaching change.

I’d be equally content keeping him and trying to land Soucy and Jarnkrok. So if it’s expiring contracts, is the 1st + choice of Savoie/Lavoie agreeable?

1st + Savoie/Lavoie + Turris + Russell for Soucy + Jarnkrok

Fair enough.

How about

To Edmonton:
Soucy, Blackwell

To Seattle:
1st round pick, Munzenberger, Turris, Russell

It's what 'weaponizing the available capspace' looks like in real time. I watch Oilers games - the guy can still play a role and can fill a roster spot for two more seasons. If Seattle misses the playoffs in '24 they can always flip him at that deadline.

I just don't think you take on two more years at $4.5 mil and I just don't see it with Barrie.
Also, with the way Francis and Leiweke have talked about season three I doubt they'll take on a cap dump for two more seasons unless it's an overpay.

 

[Mike Jones]

I just don't think you take on two more years at $4.5 mil and I just don't see it with Barrie.
Also, with the way Francis and Leiweke have talked about season three I doubt they'll take on a cap dump for two more seasons unless it's an overpay.

I heard what Leiweke said and I agree with his timeline but year three will be iffy either way so the Kraken could probably still gamble on a cap dump or two. Plus Barrie could probably still produce in a third pairing/2nd PP unit type role.

I don't think a 1st ('22), 2nd ('23), Turris, and Barrie for Soucy and Jarnkrok is that bad a deal or that big of a risk. Edmonton could even throw in a 3rd round pick in '24.

 

[RainyCityHockey]

I heard what Leiweke said and I agree with his timeline but year three will be iffy either way so the Kraken could probably still gamble on a cap dump or two. Plus Barrie could probably still produce in a third pairing/2nd PP unit type role.

I don't think a 1st ('22), 2nd ('23), Turris, and Barrie for Soucy and Jarnkrok is that bad a deal or that big of a risk. Edmonton could even throw in a 3rd round pick in '24.

Fair points.

But I really doubt Francis would do that and I just don't see value in Barrie's contract.

BTW: I'd rather have Munzenberger instead of a 3rd round pick.

 

[Mike Jones]

BTW: I'd rather have Munzenberger instead of a 3rd round pick.

It would be a more balanced package for sure.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Fair points.

But I really doubt Francis would do that and I just don't see value in Barrie's contract.

BTW: I'd rather have Munzenberger instead of a 3rd round pick.

I would take a deal that has Savoie instead of Munzenberger. Seattle needs more gamebreakers which I think Savoie could be for them, Munzenberger is a meh prospect with a cool name. Savoie did 2 years in the NCAA already and looks like could jump into the lineup for a few games later in the year. Then next year compete for a top 9 spot.

As for taking on Barrie think it would have to be like Gostisbehere, so a 2nd round + 7th attached. So a 1st + 2nd + 2nd + Savoie + Barrie + 7th for Soucy + Jankrok. Take out a 2nd and 7th then make it a 3rd if it's Blackwell. Might be too much for Edmonton to do though.

 

[Mike Jones]

So a 1st + 2nd + 2nd + Savoie + Barrie + 7th for Soucy + Jankrok.

This looks like a good deal for where both teams are at. Edmonton may want to throw in a low tier roster player to balance out the number of bodies going back and forth. That's why I included Turris in my comments.

incidentally Barrie got an assist on the powerplay in today's game between Edmonton and Winnipeg.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

You guys do know this isn't about the Oilers right?

 

[57special]

Soucy is worth an early 2nd, probably, assuming that he is healthy. If non expiring salary is coming back, then that value changes, depending on whether it's good, or bad, salary. If it's Ritchie, maybe a 1st(likely to be very late) and a late round pick...something like that.