Canucks News, Rumours, & Fantasy GM

[rypper]

You have to wonder how much of this is canucks centric (potentially going back to Benning or further) despite it keeping a very broad approach.

https://thehockeynews.com/news/when-an-nhl-gm-becomes-a-dartboard

 

[JohnHodgson]

Maybe cancer isn't the right term for OEL, but it's certainly not ideal to have one of the highest-paid members of the team provide so little value. From a human standpoint if you are working next to a guy making 6 or 7 times what he should be there's sure to be some resentment in the building.

I feel like half the people on this forum have never actually played a game of hockey in their lives.

Nobody wants to play with trash players - especially when they're making $7M and actively being a detriment to your team.

It's like nobody wants to pair up with the dummies in school for a group project. It's the same concept.

 

[sting101]

I like how the dude says I didn't give OEL an honest assessment but then doesn't provide any evidence or detail to support his claim.

It's hard to have valuable hockey discussions these days...

He was our 2nd best D in 21/22 and injured this year?

You never even replied to the fact that OEL made Myers have his best year as a Canuck and decent in a shut down heavy lifting role.

I wonder if the 8 rinks system they employed with our Captain flying the zone to get paid and the worst goaltending i can ever remember in my long fandom of the Canucks has any bearing on results?

Or the fact he came back from a bad ankle injury and then was re injured while all this was collapsing down around him. Quinn Hughes looked bad for 20-25 games. We all knew he was banged up. DOES THAT MATTER or no?

 

[JohnHodgson]

You have to wonder how much of this is canucks centric (potentially going back to Benning or further) despite it keeping a very broad approach.

https://thehockeynews.com/news/when-an-nhl-gm-becomes-a-dartboard

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Second paragraph seems like a direct call-out to OEL.

Interesting comments but doesn't really change my opinion.

If a GM is paid to be a punching bag for the owner, then that's the expected job description. The good and bad will be associated with you... that's what you signed up for as a GM.

 

[Nucker101]

Have you ever been in a group project where someone who does nothing gets the same grade as you?

It's that sort of thing. It doesn't mean he's a locker room cancer... he's a cancer to the cap sheet and the meritocracy culture that Toch is trying to build.

OEL is fine if he was making $2-3M. Him at $7M might actually be the difference of making/missing the playoffs.

Well it all depends on whether or not OEL is just broken or if effort is also an issue. If he's just broken then as a teammate I wouldn't hold any ill will toward him, once players start obsessing over those things, it's a slippery slope.

But if there's a question about the effort he's putting in on and off the ice, then I'd say he's more of a leech who demoralizes and drains the energy out of his team, like Lou Eriksson did. And by that logic, Brock Boeser should be dumped asap because I think you can definitely question his effort level at times this year.

 

[ohnoeszz]

Honest assessment of OEL's performance?

What are you talking about?

He was trash this year. Absolutely horrendous.

He's being outplayed by Wolanin and Briesbois... guys that are making minimum deals this year.

Where have I not been honest with OEL's performance? Can you please point out where I have been incorrect about OEL's performance? I honestly would like to see where you disagree.

My post was addressing you not OEL.

We aren't having a conversation about OEL because you don't have conversations with people - you simply parse their words towards the conclusion you want, all the while framing the conversation as a vehicle to drive home your points.

Here for instance, I was pointing out how you shouldn't be such an ass to people but you've replied OEL, OEL, I wasn't lying, OEL.

 

[JohnHodgson]

He was our 2nd best D in 21/22 and injured this year?

You never even replied to the fact that OEL made Myers have his best year as a Canuck and decent in a shut down heavy lifting role.

I wonder if the 8 rinks system they employed with our Captain flying the zone to get paid and the worst goaltending i can ever remember in my long fandom of the Canucks has any bearing on results?

Or the fact he came back from a bad ankle injury and then was re injured while all this was collapsing down around him. Quinn Hughes looked bad for 20-25 games. We all knew he was banged up. DOES THAT MATTER or no?

Being our 2nd best D means absolutely nothing when the entirety of the D is atrocious outside of Hughes.

OEL was OK last year. He wasn't a godsend like many make him out to be. He had a hot start to the year but faded down the stretch.

OEL was bad all year this year. Bad as in probably one of the worst NHL dman in the league this year. If his body is breaking down, I can't imagine it will hold up any better in future years. He was also pretty bad in Arizona in his last two years. There's not much evidence or history that suggests OEL will be worth anything close to his contract for the next four years.

If he was so hurt, he should have been on the IR. Playing hurt as a detriment to the team isn't as noble as you think it is.

The TLDR is OEL was god awful this year and I don't think they have a good shot at the playoffs if he is still on the roster next year.

 

[andora]

Well it all depends on whether or not OEL is just broken or if effort is also an issue. If he's just broken then as a teammate I wouldn't hold any ill will toward him, once players start obsessing over those things, it's a slippery slope.

But if there's a question about the effort he's putting in on and off the ice, then I'd say he's more of a leech who demoralizes and drains the energy out of his team, like Lou Eriksson did. And by that logic, Brock Boeser should be dumped asap because I think you can definitely question his effort level at times this year.

Stole my words.. so much at play here

When i played years and years ago.. effort trumps all

 

[sting101]

I feel like half the people on this forum have never actually played a game of hockey in their lives.

Nobody wants to play with trash players - especially when they're making $7M and actively being a detriment to your team.

It's like nobody wants to pair up with the dummies in school for a group project. It's the same concept.

Pretty arrogant and ignorant statement

Yes you and all your beer league hockey days have made you an expert on something you have no knowledge about?

It's like we dont have a coach GM and they have no idea whats going on in the room or on the ice?

 

[JohnHodgson]

My post was addressing you not OEL.

We aren't having a conversation about OEL because you don't have conversations with people - you simply parse their words towards the conclusion you want, all the while framing the conversation as a vehicle to drive home your points.

Here for instance, I was pointing out how you shouldn't be such an ass to people but you've replied OEL, OEL, I wasn't lying, OEL.

I'm confused bud.

This was your response:

Look Hodgson, it's clear you just don't understand the economic end, but if you can't give an honest assessment of OELs performance, why not just make a thread that says "I'm smarter than you" and you can masturbate in there?

I responded to the OEL section.

But now you're saying it's not related to OEL?

I'm happy to have a conversation if you want to start making some sense.

Pretty arrogant and ignorant statement

Yes you and all your beer league hockey days have made you an expert on something you have no knowledge about?

It's like we dont have a coach GM and they have no idea whats going on in the room or on the ice?

If you don't think a major cap liability doesn't have potential to be a cancer to the team...

Agree to disagree - let's just leave it at that.

 

[andora]

Being our 2nd best D means absolutely nothing when the entirety of the D is atrocious outside of Hughes.

OEL was OK last year. He wasn't a godsend like many make him out to be. He had a hot start to the year but faded down the stretch.

OEL was bad all year this year. Bad as in probably one of the worst NHL dman in the league this year. If his body is breaking down, I can't imagine it will hold up any better in future years. He was also pretty bad in Arizona in his last two years. There's not much evidence or history that suggests OEL will be worth anything close to his contract for the next four years.

If he was so hurt, he should have been on the IR. Playing hurt as a detriment to the team isn't as noble as you think it is.

The TLDR is OEL was god awful this year and I don't think they have a good shot at the playoffs if he is still on the roster next year.

I havent seen one person ever act like he was a godsend

One of the worst? I mean come on.. we had one of the worst in stillman...

 

[JohnHodgson]

Well it all depends on whether or not OEL is just broken or if effort is also an issue. If he's just broken then as a teammate I wouldn't hold any ill will toward him, once players start obsessing over those things, it's a slippery slope.

But if there's a question about the effort he's putting in on and off the ice, then I'd say he's more of a leech who demoralizes and drains the energy out of his team, like Lou Eriksson did. And by that logic, Brock Boeser should be dumped asap because I think you can definitely question his effort level at times this year.

That's a fair comment... but did it seem like his effort level was acceptable this year?

It seemed like OEL did not give an F all year. His effort level was PUTRID. Didn't show any emotion or take accountability for his play.

How many times did this guy get walked/or turned around all year and just acted like nothing happened? He's supposed to be part of this leadership group, but I don't remember him stepping up to talk to the media or provide any leadership qualities that the public can see. Maybe he's a big vocal leader in the locker room but I don't think so.

OEL was the most undertalked aspect of this team's performance this year. I feel like a lot of people have been giving him a free pass this year. -24 in 54 games is insane. Stillman had -14 in 32 games and everyone hates him.

I havent seen one person ever act like he was a godsend

One of the worst? I mean come on.. we had one of the worst in stillman...

You should have seen CDC after OEL's first year here.

He was being heralded as some savior on that forum - it was crazy. People were calling him an ELITE top level shutdown dman.

 

[sting101]

Being our 2nd best D means absolutely nothing when the entirety of the D is atrocious outside of Hughes.

OEL was OK last year. He wasn't a godsend like many make him out to be. He had a hot start to the year but faded down the stretch.

OEL was bad all year this year. Bad as in probably one of the worst NHL dman in the league this year. If his body is breaking down, I can't imagine it will hold up any better in future years. He was also pretty bad in Arizona in his last two years. There's not much evidence or history that suggests OEL will be worth anything close to his contract for the next four years.

If he was so hurt, he should have been on the IR. Playing hurt as a detriment to the team isn't as noble as you think it is.

The TLDR is OEL was god awful this year and I don't think they have a good shot at the playoffs if he is still on the roster next year.

Without knowing the extent of his injuries and likelihood to train and recover your being oddly dismissive of other possibilities and factors to make a rational decision

 

[JohnHodgson]

Without knowing the extent of his injuries and likelihood to train and recover your being oddly dismissive of other possibilities and factors to make a rational decision

I rather base my decisions on his actual gameplay than guess these external factors that the public are not privy to.

That's just my preference... I rather base my conclusions on stuff we can see, stuff we can understand.

There's definitely a chance that OEL can semi-rebound and be a useful defenseman worth 3/4M next year. I rather still buy him out given this possibility.

 

[andora]

That's a fair comment... but did it seem like his effort level was acceptable this year?

It seemed like OEL did not give an F all year. His effort level was PUTRID. Didn't show any emotion or take accountability for his play.

How many times did this guy get walked/or turned around all year and just acted like nothing happened? He's supposed to be part of this leadership group, but I don't remember him stepping up to talk to the media or provide any leadership qualities that the public can see. Maybe he's a big vocal leader in the locker room but I don't think so.

OEL was the most undertalked aspect of this team's performance this year. I feel like a lot of people have been giving him a free pass this year. -24 in 54 games is insane. Stillman had -14 in 32 games and everyone hates him.



You should have seen CDC after OEL's first year here.

He was being heralded as some savior on that forum - it was crazy. People were calling him an ELITE top level shutdown dman.

I dont know who that is

And outside of going to dinner with OEL and him being arrogant and laughing about his effort.. i mean... ?

 

[sting101]

I rather base my decisions on his actual gameplay than guess these external factors that the public are not privy to.

That's just my preference... I rather base my conclusions on stuff we can see, stuff we can understand.

There's definitely a chance that OEL can semi-rebound and be a useful defenseman worth 3/4M next year. I rather still buy him out given this possibility.

Ok so you dont care if his gameplay was good enough in year 1 to carry Tyler Myers to a decent shut down pairing at 22 minutes a night against the best forwards in the NHL and dont care if maybe that his ankle recovery and subsequent lower body injuries has anything to do with his play this year?

I mean obviously you can see by watching the game on TV or at the Rog whether or not there are external factors causing the dramatic swing in play from 1 year to another right?

So you admit there is a chance knowing nothing that our trainers doctors GM and coaches may be privy to info about a potential plaguing injury and you say he could be a 3-4 million dollar defenseman yet still want 20 million and 8 years attached to our Cap?

 

[rypper]

If anyone wants a chuckle check out this guy's tweets when it comes to OEL... or any Swedish player really.

Claims he was an NHL scout but can never name which team.

 

[sting101]

If anyone wants a chuckle check out this guy's tweets when it comes to OEL... or any Swedish player really.

Claims he was an NHL scout but can never name which team.

Patrik Petrin aka Kevin Epp

 

[JohnHodgson]

Ok so you dont care if his gameplay was good enough in year 1 to carry Tyler Myers to a decent shut down pairing at 22 minutes a night against the best forwards in the NHL and dont care if maybe that his ankle recovery and subsequent lower body injuries has anything to do with his play this year?

I mean obviously you can see by watching the game on TV or at the Rog whether or not there are external factors causing the dramatic swing in play from 1 year to another right?

So you admit there is a chance knowing nothing that our trainers doctors GM and coaches may be privy to info about a potential plaguing injury and you say he could be a 3-4 million dollar defenseman yet still want 20 million and 8 years attached to our Cap?

Myers had a better +/- than OEL last year.

He was +15 whereas OEL was +5. Not a great indicator but just to give some context.

Don't think it's a fair assessment to say OEL carried Myers at all.

Myers is playing fine recently on his own... paired next to Briesbois (a #9/10 Dman).

I don't really understand why you're upset. You're basically saying "THERES UNKNOWN FACTORS OUT THERE THAT WE DONT KNOW TO MAKE THIS DECISION". I agree with you. I don't know said factors so I can't comment on it.

My personal view and opinion is only derived from watching him play this year - he was awful. No way to beat around the bush. He was great to start last year but tailed off in the second half. His last 90 games or so as a Canuck has been a poor to brutal.

 

[Aphid Attraction]

Ok so you dont care if his gameplay was good enough in year 1 to carry Tyler Myers to a decent shut down pairing at 22 minutes a night against the best forwards in the NHL and dont care if maybe that his ankle recovery and subsequent lower body injuries has anything to do with his play this year?

I mean obviously you can see by watching the game on TV or at the Rog whether or not there are external factors causing the dramatic swing in play from 1 year to another right?

So you admit there is a chance knowing nothing that our trainers doctors GM and coaches may be privy to info about a potential plaguing injury and you say he could be a 3-4 million dollar defenseman yet still want 20 million and 8 years attached to our Cap?

Do you have a counter position where you say how good you predict OEL to be next season?

 

[ohnoeszz]

I'm confused bud.

This was your response:

Look Hodgson, it's clear you just don't understand the economic end, but if you can't give an honest assessment of OELs performance, why not just make a thread that says "I'm smarter than you" and you can masturbate in there?

I responded to the OEL section.

But now you're saying it's not related to OEL?

I'm happy to have a conversation if you want to start making some sense.

Actually, even here you clipped off half what I wrote. My response was that plus the following:

"Do you enjoy being talked down to as much as you do it to everyone else? This is an open forum, not an ivy league debate where you need to paint your opposition as intellectually incompetent at the beginning of every post."


Your response ignored all of it except the single line about OEL, and this is pretty typical of your posts - for you to isolate the issue you want to harp on rather than address the full meat of another person's post.

I've made sense all along but as I mentioned I'm not interested in a conversation with you as I don't see you as capable of it based on your interactions here.

As you are having difficulty with reading comprehension, I will further spell it out for you. I wasn't addressing OEL. I was addressing your need to be condescending towards people here. You've spent pages suggesting people don't understand or don't get it or or are otherwise too stupid to understand.

This wasn't about you being right or wrong on OEL. This was about how you interact with people on a conversational level.

 

[mriswith]

Do you have a counter position where you say how good you predict OEL to be next season?

Two possibilities:

1) the problem was injuries this year so after a healthy offseason he starts off like he did in year 1 with us
2) his body is ruined so he sucks again next year like he did this year and will never improve

I kind of think buying him out is lose lose:

Option 1 is better than a buyout. He only needs to be a ~2M dman to not be worth buying out.

Option 2 would surely mean he's on the verge of retiring to ltir.

 

[Peen]

reminder that there is an ignore button bros and buds (condescendingly because i am smarter than you all)

 

[Hansen]

reminder that there is an ignore button bros and buds (condescendingly because i am smarter than you all)

Click to view ignored content

 

[JohnHodgson]

Actually, even here you clipped off half what I wrote. My response was that plus the following:

"Do you enjoy being talked down to as much as you do it to everyone else? This is an open forum, not an ivy league debate where you need to paint your opposition as intellectually incompetent at the beginning of every post."


Your response ignored all of it except the single line about OEL, and this is pretty typical of your posts - for you to isolate the issue you want to harp on rather than address the full meat of another person's post.

I've made sense all along but as I mentioned I'm not interested in a conversation with you as I don't see you as capable of it based on your interactions here.

As you are having difficulty with reading comprehension, I will further spell it out for you. I wasn't addressing OEL. I was addressing your need to be condescending towards people here. You've spent pages suggesting people don't understand or don't get it or or are otherwise too stupid to understand.

This wasn't about you being right or wrong on OEL. This was about how you interact with people on a conversational level.

Why do you keep claiming you don’t want to have a conversation with me but continually quote me and exchange paragraphs?

It’s not that deep man. I’ve had plenty of good conversations here with a variety of people. If you don’t want to engage - then don’t.

This white-knighting stuff is irrelevant and doesn’t and meaningful substance to the conversation. Have a good day bud.

reminder that there is an ignore button bros and buds (condescendingly because i am smarter than you all)

Agreed!