Blue Jays Discussion: Blue Jays fire manager Montoyo, Schneider takes over

[Eyedea]

I don’t pretend to know baseball operations BUT why do we keep bringing up Beasley? He gets battered every time. Do we not have capable relievers in the farm that are MUCH better or just better. He is awful. Why keep bringing him up.

He’s been good in Buffalo, has decent stuff, and can go multiple innings. Sometimes it doesn’t click right away but he’s seen a major uptick in his stuff since moving to the pen and I’m sure the Jays don’t want to move away from him just yet.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Ummmm What? That's pretty much the exact opposite of what happened last year, and you were the one talking about how much he sucked after his terrible start got hurt came back and then he regressed positively to the mean.

Nice revisionist history. Notice that in none of those posts do I say anything like you said. I never said he sucks. I was just busting the chops of Jansen stans who were already getting erect off his hot spring that maybe they should relax a bit.

They immediately shut up after his slow start, only to get vocal again around Sept when he got hot again.

I'll post the receipts once I'm on a PC. Why don't you include the thread links so people can access the thread in context? lol

I can't even count how many posts in August/September were saying "see, if you take out the first month Jansen had an amazing year." Here's a tip, if you have to keep taking out a player's worst month to make the argument that they're good, you're not making a very good argument.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Good thing we have Jansen taking up the slack for that fat slug Kirk who keeps getting worn out. Without Jansen taking 3 starts a week who knows what Kirk would be hitting. lol

Kirk since Jansen's injury on June 7th:

4hr .358/.452/.623

 

[Maestro84]

Unbelievable, just our luck. We have a legit World Series contender in Toronto for the first time in years and the Yankees decided to have an historically great season. f***. Will the Yanks luck run out at some point?

2015/16 can't be considered "first time in years" is it? Wasn't that long ago lol

 

[Discoverer]

Nice revisionist history. Notice that in none of those posts do I say anything like you said. I never said he sucks. I was just busting the chops of Jansen stans who were already getting erect off his hot spring that maybe they should relax a bit.

They immediately shut up after his slow start, only to get vocal again around Sept when he got hot again.

I'll post the receipts once I'm on a PC. Why don't you include the thread links so people can access the thread in context? lol

I can't even count how many posts in August/September were saying "see, if you take out the first month Jansen had an amazing year." Here's a tip, if you have to keep taking out a player's worst month to make the argument that they're good, you're not making a very good argument.

No need to remove his worst month. Jansen had a 105 wRC+ last year. That's really good.

 

[Scotianhab]

Jansen needs to be traded to help upgrade other areas. I’m perfectly fine with a Kirk/Moreno combo going forward.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Jansen needs to be traded to help upgrade other areas. I’m perfectly fine with a Kirk/Moreno combo going forward.

Yep hard to send Moreno down so far in his first MLB opportunity

Jansen in a deal for a starter would be nice

 

[TGB]

Yep hard to send Moreno down so far in his first MLB opportunity

Jansen in a deal for a starter would be nice

I actually prefer the idea of having all three playing, with one catching, one DH'ing, and one in the outfield (since apparently Moreno is actually a very fast runner). Jansen will be looking at a new contract soon anyway, so this could work just fine for a couple of years and Gurriel is wildly inconsistent. Hernandez can ease into a full time DH role...assuming Springer doesn't get there first.

Of course, if someone is willing to throw a guaranteed stud our way...yeah, sure. Pitching is always good to have.

Hey, now that Jose Ramirez is extended...can we revisit a trade for him? Maybe now we can toss Gurriel and Chapman and Biggio their way...yeah, probably not, heh.

 

[Scotianhab]

I actually prefer the idea of having all three playing, with one catching, one DH'ing, and one in the outfield (since apparently Moreno is actually a very fast runner). Jansen will be looking at a new contract soon anyway, so this could work just fine for a couple of years and Gurriel is wildly inconsistent. Hernandez can ease into a full time DH role...assuming Springer doesn't get there first.

Of course, if someone is willing to throw a guaranteed stud our way...yeah, sure. Pitching is always good to have.

Hey, now that Jose Ramirez is extended...can we revisit a trade for him? Maybe now we can toss Gurriel and Chapman and Biggio their way...yeah, probably not, heh.

Cleveland won’t be trading Ramirez now. We could use an upgrade in the outfield. One more starter and about 4 hard throwing bullpen arms

 

[Seath The Scaleless]

Cleveland won’t be trading Ramirez now. We could use an upgrade in the outfield. One more starter and about 4 hard throwing bullpen arms

Maybe we can buy low on Soto

 

[canucksfan]

 

[phillipmike]

Minimum 100 PAs on the team, Biggio is 4th in OPS+, behind only Kirk, Vladdy and Springer. 2nd highest OBP behind only Kirk.

Nice little comeback for him. Keep it up and play him as much as you can in CF. Could be the lefty bat we need. Makes cutting Tapia or Zimmer easier.

 

[dredeye]

Minimum 100 PAs on the team, Biggio is 4th in OPS+, behind only Kirk, Vladdy and Springer. 2nd highest OBP behind only Kirk.

Nice little comeback for him. Keep it up and play him as much as you can in CF. Could be the lefty bat we need. Makes cutting Tapia or Zimmer easier.

Biggio doesn't really have an arm for centre

 

[hockeywiz542]

Blue Jays show no mercy to Brewers, Tellez, but injuries continue to weigh on bullpen

It was a bit of a reunion on Friday night in Milwaukee when the Jays faced the Brewers and former teammate Rowdy Tellez. But once acquaintances were renewed, the Jays got down to business.

www.sportsnet.ca

Toronto’s bullpen needed help even before Garcia joined Trevor Richards, Julian Merryweather, Tayler Saucedo, and Andrew Vasquez on the injured list. And Nate Pearson isn’t coming to help any time soon, as the 25-year-old’s rehab assignment with triple-A Buffalo came to an end last Sunday when he suffered a strained lat two pitches into an outing.

The club’s minor-league relief depth is similarly thin, with Adrian Hernandez and his screwball changeup likely the most interesting arm that could be called upon. The 22-year-old has a 1.80 ERA with Buffalo and has struck out 36.8 per cent of the batters he’s faced this season. Certainly, his opportunity will come. But there is some question as to how the 5-foot-8, 190-pounder’s low-90’s fastball will play at the big-league level. Of course, there’s only one way to find out.

All of that makes acquiring a reliever in the near to mid term a rather pressing concern for the Blue Jays. But you can’t force a trade if other clubs aren’t willing to deal. And the fact the Blue Jays let a seemingly serviceable relief arm in Roenis Elias pass through waivers untouched this week doesn’t project a sense of urgency. Veteran right-hander Sergio Romo also cleared waivers recently and was released by the Seattle Mariners. He’s only a phone call away if the Blue Jays feel there’s something left in his funky, sidewinding arm.

Of course, Tellez’s productive left-handed bat would look good in a right-handed heavy Blue Jays lineup, too. But the same issues that led to his trade persist today. Tellez can’t play anywhere other than first base, which is where Guerrero plays. And the Blue Jays need their DH spot open to get regular rest for Guerrero and Springer — the 32-year-old was out of the lineup Friday for a second consecutive game due to an elbow issue — while keeping Kirk’s prodigious bat in the lineup when he isn’t behind the plate.

There’s just nowhere to fit a player with a profile like Tellez’s in. If the Blue Jays are going to add an impact left-handed bat to their lineup ahead of the August 2 trade deadline, the cleanest way to do so would be in the outfield — ideally with someone who can play centre and spell Springer.

Andrew Benintendi is the name you’re going to hear plenty between now and the deadline, as the Royals flounder and the 27-year-old nears free agency this winter. Benintendi doesn’t barrel the ball much, but his contact-oriented approach has still produced a .295/.360/.390 line this season, good for 117 wRC+. David Peralta is another pending free agent on a team going nowhere and ought to interest a number of contenders thanks to his perennially strong exit velocities and defence. Even as he enters his mid-30’s, Peralta is still an above-average hitter and boasts a 91st percentile outs above average.

The Blue Jays had some interest in Robbie Grossman at last year’s deadline and could certainly revisit it with the 26-43 Tigers, who may look to clear playing time later this season for their glut of young outfielders. Grossman’s having a down year at the plate and striking out at a slightly alarming 30.7 per cent clip. But that performance stands in stark contrast to his track record, and getting him out of Comerica Park — one of MLB’s worst offensive environments this season — could help unlock what worked in the past.

Kole Calhoun, Ben Gamel, Ian Happ, Tyler Naquin — all candidates, as well. The work the Blue Jays are doing now is to determine who’s actually available and assign values to those players before testing the waters as to acquisition costs. All while simultaneously completing their draft preparations and considering day-to-day roster decisions. It’s a busy time, even if it doesn’t always seem like it on the transaction wire.

But last July’s Tellez deal — and the Adam Cimber acquisition the club made a week earlier — demonstrate it is possible to make moves at this time of year if you’re motivated to. As long as the Blue Jays are winning handily like they did Friday in Milwaukee, it won’t seem as pressing a concern. But next week the club hosts the Boston Red Sox for three and the Tampa Rays for five — not a typo — in what is lining up to be as critical a week as they get this early in the season.

Go look at the standings. Fewer than two games separated the Blue Jays, Red Sox, and Rays entering Friday’s play. With the club’s next off day not until July 11, Toronto’s depth is about to be tested. It’s urgency, too.

 

[Discoverer]

Minimum 100 PAs on the team, Biggio is 4th in OPS+, behind only Kirk, Vladdy and Springer. 2nd highest OBP behind only Kirk.

Nice little comeback for him. Keep it up and play him as much as you can in CF. Could be the lefty bat we need. Makes cutting Tapia or Zimmer easier.

He's been fantastic since coming back up. Despite a horrible start and then missing a month, his wRC+ on the season is currently a career best.

I think we'll start to see Espinal get a bit of time off over the next little while.

 

[Beaumaris]

Rewatching the video I don't even see any contact. Maybe Martinez puts his hand up to Eddings chest as if to say stop coming towards me(which Eddings edged forward as Martinez was getting tossed). But it was the most harmless thing I've ever seen. 5 games seems incredibly excessive.

Probably said a swear word.

 

[Blitzkrug]

Tapia can still around as a utility guy. As much as he annoys me, his spurts of hitting and speed have uses.

Zimmer on the other hand, can go. Absolutely useless outside of his speed.

 

[Discoverer]

Tapia can still around as a utility guy. As much as he annoys me, his spurts of hitting and speed have uses.

Zimmer on the other hand, can go. Absolutely useless outside of his speed.

It's tough to have him taking up a roster spot all season for such a niche role, but Zimmer is the kind of player teams try to make room for on their roster in the playoffs.

 

[Canada4Gold]

He's been fantastic since coming back up. Despite a horrible start and then missing a month, his wRC+ on the season is currently a career best.

I think we'll start to see Espinal get a bit of time off over the next little while.

Yeah but what about if I'm randomly claimed you were omitting Biggio's horrible start even though you weren't so I could claim you were selectively picking a sample to make him look good and then brought up some Espinal defensive stats to try to make Biggio look as bad as I possible could even though I definitely don't have an anti Biggio agenda

What then?

 

[Killer Orcas]

Tapia can still around as a utility guy. As much as he annoys me, his spurts of hitting and speed have uses.

Zimmer on the other hand, can go. Absolutely useless outside of his speed.

Honestly all he's there for is to let Springer sit in late innings when ahead. Long as that keeps Springer healthy I'll take it until we find someone that can also hit while providing same as that.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Irv Carter got hit around a lot today. At least he didn't walk anyone I guess

3.2 IP, 5 ER, 11 hits, 3 K's, 2 HR, 0 BB

Kind of funny looking back. He got a bigger bonus than Tiedemann when drafted, they're only 2 months apart in age. The discussion was more we can sign Carter, while Ricky was almost an afterthought until we started to hear reports of his velo bump after he had signed.

 

[as Pure as Evil]

if ben joyce is there at thr 3rd round pick(ranked 116 at the moment) do you snag him. could be another one we can rush up the ladder seems to be destined to be the next chapman. or he could just end up another hard thrower with no secondary(beyond a limited slider) pitches that fizzles

 

[Canada4Gold]

if ben joyce is there at thr 3rd round pick(ranked 116 at the moment) do you snag him. could be another one we can rush up the ladder seems to be destined to be the next chapman. or he could just end up another hard thrower with no secondary(beyond a limited slider) pitches that fizzles

I feel like someone else is going to take a flier on Joyce well before our 3rd rounder. Not even all that confident he'll be there at our 2nd rounder. Someone is going to be blinded by that velo and and hope he can put it together.

 

[The Nemesis]

I actually prefer the idea of having all three playing, with one catching, one DH'ing, and one in the outfield (since apparently Moreno is actually a very fast runner). Jansen will be looking at a new contract soon anyway, so this could work just fine for a couple of years and Gurriel is wildly inconsistent. Hernandez can ease into a full time DH role...assuming Springer doesn't get there first.

Of course, if someone is willing to throw a guaranteed stud our way...yeah, sure. Pitching is always good to have.

Hey, now that Jose Ramirez is extended...can we revisit a trade for him? Maybe now we can toss Gurriel and Chapman and Biggio their way...yeah, probably not, heh.

I don't like the idea of Moreno shifting to a position he hasn't really played before. I know they tried giving him some work at 1st and 3rd at one point in the minors to see if they could make him a Yan Gomes sort, but I'm pretty sure that stopped before Buffalo.

Besides, Kirk's physique likely means that his utility as a catcher probably breaks down earlier than most so I would keep Moreno as a full-time catcher with the expectation that he's going to take the lion's share of behind-the-plate reps away from Kirk at some point in the short-ish term future.

Keeping all 3 is a luxury I'd love to indulge in but I think they're probably better served trading Jansen before he needs a new contract and getting some solid help for him. No reason they couldn't package him with an upper-mid tier prospect for a solid mid-rotation starter, a decent pen arm, and maybe some high velo lottery ticket minor league depth guys who they can try to turn into serviceable relievers down the road. It would be sacrificing the potential to get peak value return out of Jansen but filling multiple holes in one shot would also be incredibly useful.

 

[dredeye]

So here's a question for you guys. They mentioned it on the fan of a possible trade scenario and suggested Bo as part of a package for Ohtani. I must say although his contract expires soon I'd certainly put a lot of thought into that and would be ok with it