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Player Discussion Benoit Allaire

The New Russian Five

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May 27, 2019
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Was trying to search for a thread for him and surprisingly couldn't find him. This guy needs to be celebrated more. Literally the GOAT of goaltending coaches. Helped Lundqvist to be the best of his generation, helping Shesty to be one of the best in his, and helping them both win Vezinas. Making no names like Talbot, Georgiev, Valli into above-average backup goalies (two of which went on to be starting goalies on other teams). Resurrected Quick's career when he looked like he was absolutely toast. I don't know how he does it, but the guy is on another level when it comes to coaching goalies. I'm sure I am forgetting some backups that he made better as well.
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As a Rangers and Predators fan, I've had the luxury of seeing the two best goalie coaches perhaps ever do their thing: Allaire and Mitch Korn are otherworldly in what they were perceived to have in net and what those guys regularly became.

It's too bad neither team could replicate them for forwards... lol
 
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I don't know if I'd call him the goat of goaltending coaches. There's about 3 coaches/head directors I think have been a tier above
 
Dfence033 said:
As a Rangers and Predators fan, I've had the luxury of seeing the two best goalie coaches perhaps ever do their thing: Allaire and Mitch Korn are otherworldly in what they were perceived to have in net and what those guys regularly became.

It's too bad neither team could replicate them for forwards... lol
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If either team had an Allaire for forwards, both would probably have 3 Cups in the last 15 years.
 
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TGWL said:
I don't know if I'd call him the goat of goaltending coaches. There's about 3 coaches/head directors I think have been a tier above
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Curious as to whom you'd put on that top tier if neither Allaire nor Korn make your list.
 
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Dfence033 said:
Curious as to whom you'd put on that top tier if neither Allaire nor Korn make your list.
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Sorry, I meant 3 coaches that have been a tier above the rest. I didn't mean a tier above Allaire. I have Korn and Allaire in that tier above everybody else. I think you can make the case for 1-2 other goalie coaches.
 
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TGWL said:
Sorry, I meant 3 coaches that have been a tier above the rest. I didn't mean a tier above Allaire. I have Korn and Allaire in that tier above everybody else. I think you can make the case for 1-2 other goalie coaches.
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Ah, that's fair. No other names come immediately to mind for me that had the repeated successes, especially with goalies that weren't perceived to have the ability to become what they ultimately did.

Who else would you have in that tier? Not debating, just no one else is coming up for me.
 
Dfence033 said:
Ah, that's fair. No other names come immediately to mind for me that had the repeated successes, especially with goalies that weren't perceived to have the ability to become what they ultimately did.

Who else would you have in that tier? Not debating, just no one else is coming up for me.
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Maybe Ian Clark?
 
As good as Allaire is, he wasn't able to figure out Marty Biron's five hole. And that will be his legacy. How many other goalie coaches have had a goalie pretty much retire mid-game before?
 
I wouldn't try to argue that Allaire isn't good at what he does, because he clearly is.

Lundqvist and Shesterkin were both phenoms who were considered among the top handful of goaltenders outside the NHL before coming over, and walked into immediate superstardom. Allaire has helped both to varying degrees (Lundqvist, anyway, who always praised Allaire) but it's pretty likely that both would be perennial all stars without him.

It's the work with the other goaltenders that is probably more noteworthy in evaluating how good Allaire has been.
 
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Harbour Dog said:
Is this a serious post?
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One or two guys would be a fluke. But at this point, you have to assume it's not a coincidence and that he's the best goalie coach in the NHL.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
I wouldn't try to argue that Allaire isn't good at what he does, because he clearly is.

Lundqvist and Shesterkin were both phenoms who were considered among the top handful of goaltenders outside the NHL before coming over, and walked into immediate superstardom. Allaire has helped both to varying degrees (Lundqvist, anyway, who always praised Allaire) but it's pretty likely that both would be perennial all stars without him.

It's the work with the other goaltenders that is probably more noteworthy in evaluating how good Allaire has been.
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I kinda disagree about Lundqvist and Shesty for sure being who they are without Allaire. You only need to look back to the all star break and how Shesty looked before it, and how he never played a few games and worked with Allaire after it to know the guy knows his stuff. It's night and day the difference after only a few days working with him. Raanta, Quick, Georgiev they are all prime examples of what he can do, best in the league. There's no coincidence that he never gets canned with other coaching staffs
 
Shesterkybomb said:
I kinda disagree about Lundqvist and Shesty for sure being who they are without Allaire. You only need to look back to the all star break and how Shesty looked before it, and how he never played a few games and worked with Allaire after it to know the guy knows his stuff. It's night and day the difference after only a few days working with him. Raanta, Quick, Georgiev they are all prime examples of what he can do, best in the league. There's no coincidence that he never gets canned with other coaching staffs
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Don't put this POS's name in the same sentence as Quick and Raanta.
 
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Shesterkybomb said:
I kinda disagree about Lundqvist and Shesty for sure being who they are without Allaire. You only need to look back to the all star break and how Shesty looked before it, and how he never played a few games and worked with Allaire after it to know the guy knows his stuff. It's night and day the difference after only a few days working with him. Raanta, Quick, Georgiev they are all prime examples of what he can do, best in the league. There's no coincidence that he never gets canned with other coaching staffs
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I understand he's good at what he does and said as much.

Both Lundqvist and Shesterkin have amazing amounts of natural-born talent. Obviously we've seen having talent alone isn't good enough to stick in the league, but I still feel pretty confident that both would be terrific players with an "average" goaltending coach working with them.

But, either way, my point wasn't that Allaire was something other than good at what he does. The work he has done with the lesser-talented goaltenders is the best demonstration of that, is all. Not so much what he's done with two hall of fame talents.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
I understand he's good at what he does and said as much.

Both Lundqvist and Shesterkin have amazing amounts of natural-born talent. Obviously we've seen having talent alone isn't good enough to stick in the league, but I still feel pretty confident that both would be terrific players with an "average" goaltending coach working with them.

But, either way, my point wasn't that Allaire was something other than good at what he does. The work he has done with the lesser-talented goaltenders is the best demonstration of that, is all. Not so much what he's done with two hall of fame talents.
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It's a chicken and egg scenario though. We can't really know what Hank and Shesty would be at the NHL level without Allaire, so it's not really fair not to at least give him SOME credit. Even if they would have still been all stars without him, then Allaire still knew enough to not over-coach the talent out of them, and let them do their thing.

That alone can be credited as good coaching. So I don't agree that they shouldn't be part of the conversation in assessing Allaire's coaching record.

Also, most talented goal tenders have some down years, but Hank really didn't until his last season or so. That may be due to the player, but it may also be due to the people around him like Allaire.
 
nyr2k2 said:
I wouldn't try to argue that Allaire isn't good at what he does, because he clearly is.

Lundqvist and Shesterkin were both phenoms who were considered among the top handful of goaltenders outside the NHL before coming over, and walked into immediate superstardom. Allaire has helped both to varying degrees (Lundqvist, anyway, who always praised Allaire) but it's pretty likely that both would be perennial all stars without him.

It's the work with the other goaltenders that is probably more noteworthy in evaluating how good Allaire has been.
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I would argue that it's Allaire's consistency that best demonstrates how good he's been. He's worked well with world-class goalies, NHL starters, and NHL back-ups.

As a note: Lundqvist was amazing at Frölunda, the best goalie outside the NHL. Allaire still worked with him to change several aspects of his playing style to make him far less aggressive and far more compact in his movements. Hank stayed right on the goal line as a Ranger, but as I recall, at Frölunda he was making saves almost all the way out to the hash marks.
 
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