Around the League Thread | November Rain
- Thread starter Mr. Canucklehead
- Start date
Bedard is really the first of the prospects upfront. With vlasic as the first on the backend. Going to have to endure most of the losing until the other pieces develop.
TT, Hall, Bertuzzi are not what they once were.
Not unlike guys like Larkin in Det. Bo here. Zegras in Ana. Takes its toll mentally over time.
Szechwan
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- Sep 13, 2006
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Chicago is a desirable city, so they shouldn't have too much trouble attracting support for Bedard and Co as they age. Unfortunately their targets to date have been a pretty big flop.
Ufa is a hard sell. They went hard after Guentzal but he opted for TB? Can you blame him? Weather , taxes, good team.
Guys are not going to sign to lose for the next 2-3 seasons when they have options.
Top line guys are rare like a Panarin, Tavares, to hit ufa. And those guys had their destination in mind.
Bedard is going to have to deal with missing the PO for his first 4 pro years. Only way they get to the PO in 27 is for something outside their organization to land on their doorsteps or someone hits right away in a big way.
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Last rebuild, when Chicago got Kane 1st OA, he was the final piece of the puzzle.
They'd already pulled a ton of pieces out of the draft or via trade that would form the core of their dynasty: Toews, Sharpe, Seabrook, Keith, Byfuglian, Hjalmarsson, Bolland, Crawford....
Bedard isn't going to be so lucky.....drafting now appears mediocre at best.
Szechwan
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True enough, they'll likely be limited to the B tier guys like a Toffoli until their homegrown talent begins to show something.
Any one know how Levshunov had looked? He's in Rockford this year isn't he?
Bedard, Nazar, Moore were 3 first round C all sub 6 feet. It’s going to just take some time. Unlike Ana I think they get more aggressive sooner than later.
Missed PO for 4 straight seasons now. Were still trying to win with Bowman and that Jones move in 2021.
theguardianII
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The big Chicago rebuild they aimed for the bottom, planned for it. The GM at the time stated "You HAVE to be bad before you can be good" That was Tallon. He also did that in Florida and then they made some massive trades and signed some hellish good FA's. In Florida apart from taxes they are pretty much outside of the media and public eye on a personal level.
Star level players are mostly achieved through the draft, Pittsburgh's core for the last 12+years and they could have still had Fleury, was drafted in a 4 year period of bottom feeding, Letang, Fleury, Crosby and Malkin, Staal, they went through 5 coaches during that time. They went from losing in the conference finals, 3 years on the bottom then back to conference finals again.
The Canucks are stuck in the mushy almost middle with not quite the right mix to become contenders for a cup. Making the playoffs should be easy, half the teams in the league do but to be "that" team that goes there or has a reasonable expectation for an extended time takes pain and a firm plan. Not just a "we will see how it goes" or re-signing the same core players over and over again because they are known in the market and then wondering if they will get a different outcome is ....just going to cost more.
The picture of the empty seats in Pittsburgh tells observers what is going to happen very soon. The same thing Pittsburgh has done successfully twice, dive to the bottom for a few years then back to the top. They might have waited too long though this time because before they had some pretty good veterans to mentor players. Tampa did this twice as well, Chicago, Colorado, TO once,
NHL’s setting things up for them to draft Landon DuPont in 2027 as we speak.
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I think its fair to question whether any of those three are going to be NHL centres. Nazar is playing well in the AHL, but he is tiny, Bedard (who is going to be a great plyer) has put up points but he's been absolutely awful defensively and should not be playing C. Moore is not tracking well at all.
The Hawks of yesteryear did what they did because their Norris Trophy caliber defender, Selke caliber Centre and hart/lindsay/ross /smythe caliber winger hit more or less immediately and so did their "close to core" supporting cast.
The current edition has been throwing spaghetti on the wall since 2018 and don't have a ton to show for it. Two top 10 picks in their first wave of "retool picks" busted (Dach, Boqvist). Bedard was massively overhyped as "the savior" and if there are future norris/selke trophy winners in their pool, it sure isn't obvious yet.
Just A Bit Outside
Playoffs??!
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Pens needed to move on from the old core and they didn’t.
This is what happens when you hold on for too long.
This is what happens when you hold on for too long.
Haven't tracked their prospects, but even if Nazar and Moore were going well, they would have 3 sub 6 foot skilled C. Need some girth down the middle at some point, plus some bigger wingers who can play in the top 6 if you go that small.
Bedard and Vlasic are the only 2 roster players I would put money on to be there when they return to the PO.
If losing is already getting to Bedard in year 2, he's in for a rough ride for another 2-3 years or longer, unless Chicago makes a move to sign guys, makes a trade, or a kid or two hits big early in their career.
vadim sharifijanov
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hopefully to make up for that bs willie and ferland 2015 series where nobody made the finals
Of the big 4 sports, NFL is the one where you can turn it around the fastest since the draft is 21 years old and older. But, that's mainly dependent on the QB. Chi, Was, NE have a chance to turn it around with their QBs. Denver, have the right HC to work with a tier 2 QB. Penix and McCarthy TBD.
That and drafting well for 2 drafts can really change your roster. Seattle hit on Cross, Mafe, Walker, Lucas, Woolen, Bryant in 2022 class, though most haven't played as well since rookie year save for Mafe and Walker, then Cross. But, if you stack a couple of classes like that, you can really turn it around fast.
MLB, lots of time as even an elite hitter only gets 4-5 chances to hit a game. And you need starters and relievers for P.
NBA, star driven. Most teenagers need time to find their game, so don't expect immediate turnarounds with a couple of top draft picks.
NHL. Like MLB, NBA, drafting teenagers and their development over the next 2-3 years is out of your control as they play for their club teams until they arrive in the A or NHL.
Thus teams are more likely to ride their top guys until the very end. Before you even think rebuild and selling off your top guys, have you done a full evaluation of your scouting dept? What have they done for the team over the past 3 drafts? Make sure you build up that group because if they've added little to the organization in recent years, not suddenly going to turn it around moving forward.
Just A Bit Outside
Playoffs??!
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Dubas made a massive mistake trading for EK65. Just horrendous.
To a certain degree I can understand bringing back Letang and Malkin.
But they needed to start making other moves away from the original core to start focusing on the transition and next iteration of the team.
Starts with the draft and it’s been nonexistent for the Pens for quite sometime.
Dallas is an example of an incredible transition from one core to another. And that started with their drafting. Some of it was luck, absolutely. But I don’t think you hit on as many young players as they have without a legitimate foundation for drafting/drafting strategy.
Pitt with EK, Chi with Jones, Ott with Duchene. Seen clubs make big moves to then go into the toilet thinking they had a runway.
Billy Kvcmu
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He’s also like 19
Give it time
If they are tearing it down and tank then he’s retiring
He’s not playing for other team
Pens remind me of the 2014–2017 Canucks with the whole 2 aging stars thing and the need to commit to a rebuild.
