Around the League Thread | Holiday Season!

[supercanuck]

To be fair, that extra 500k is 3 million dollars. Also, I don't know that Zadorov is necessarily in a better situation if he signs here anyway. He's a somewhat erratic, albeit very likeable, player who had a run in the playoffs, but was a pretty good candidate to have the shine come off of him, IMO.

To bring the discussion back to young players - sometimes we forget that a career can be over in an instant, and it is probably a prudent move to advise a talented young player that guaranteed money now is probably not a bad priority when a lot of these guys are one bad break away from being dropped into the world as a barely high-school educated dude who has always been the top of the pecking order with a blown out knee and the maturity of a 14 year old at 22. (yes, I know that's not the case for everyone, but a lot of young ultra-high-performance athletes in all sports have basically been required to be professionally selfish since childhood and are borderline useless outside of their niche.)

If my kid was ever in this situation, I would 100% advise him to guarantee himself the most money he can right after the entry level expires. You just never know what can happen.

 

[RobertKron]

If my kid was ever in this situation, I would 100% advise him to guarantee himself the most money he can right after the entry level expires. You just never know what can happen.

Yeah, like it's one thing if it's a young mid/low roster player opting for a good situation to establish a long-term career and the alternative is only going to be a slightly higher total anyway, but for a player like Bedard where the difference between an 8yr deal and a 3 year deal will be an absolutely humongous amount of money, it's kind of a no brainer.

 

[StreetHawk]

Yeah, like it's one thing if it's a young mid/low roster player opting for a good situation to establish a long-term career and the alternative is only going to be a slightly higher total anyway, but for a player like Bedard where the difference between an 8yr deal and a 3 year deal will be an absolutely humongous amount of money, it's kind of a no brainer.

You just need to look at Stamkos and the difference in leverage he has between how his 4 contracts went. ELC at 18. 5 year deal at 21. 8 year max deal at 26. 4 year deal at 34. At 34, TB was ready to move on.

But, if you do like McDavid and do ELC at 18, max at 21, then at 29, you can max again to 37, which ends 1 year before the 4 contracts that Stamkos signed. And at 29, you're getting the max term as the team will pay to keep you through your likely declining years.

 

[Rowlet]

Hughes is within 2 of Makar in 3 less games

 

[Szechwan]

Laughton with the Brian Rolston breakaway slapper earlier today, you love to see it

https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/rJ1VYdzJPj

 

[The Stig]

Calgary, Minnesota and Montreal had themselves a night. Dan The Man Vladar had the greatest game in the history of mankind.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Oilers looking like they’re getting their stride again (just like last season).



Sigh..

 

[IComeInPeace]

Shane Wright has 6 goals and 11 points in his last 10 games.

He had 2 points in 18 games to start the season.

Good for him for hopefully finding his game.

 

[F A N]

The primary job of an agent is to get the best combination of situation and financial compensation for their client. But they aren't a neutral party and I think too often they push the player into solely a 'most $$$' position which also benefits the agent.

Zadorov loved Vancouver, the team loved Zadorov, Zadorov had been a guy who bounced around 5 or 6 teams in the last 6 or 8 years and *finally* found a fit for himself. And then he bolts over an extra $500k and is now in a situation that isn't great again. His agent should have been pushing hard to take a little less in order to stay in a better, known situation.

You say tomato, I say tomato.

Nobody is saying the top agents aren't properly advising their clients here. I'm surely not suggesting that Zadorov's agent, for example, didn't advise Zadorov of the value of "fit". Obviously players have different needs. A younger player without a famous hockey dad should value guidance and long term development. That's why big agencies sell a holistic approach that includes player development. But my guess is that most players don't pay a % of what they earned for a Jerry McGuire relationship if it means a whole less money. 9+ times out of 10 it's about the money no matter what the player and the player's agent says so ya the primary job of an agent is to get the most money for the client whether that is signing a long term contract or short term contracts like Matthews but obviousl before you get there the player has to be confident in his agent's competency and care and good communications help. Anyone who negotiates on behalf of a client and takes pride in their work should advise their client on fit as well as whether the deal is good money wise.

Back to Zadorov, before he demanded a trade out of Calgary there were reportedly some contract negotiations and he was certainly willing to sign. Reportedly, what Zadorov wanted was 5-6 years and Calgary wasn't even close. AAV was reported not to be the issue. Before the playoffs started Zadorov was certainly willing to sign. What he wanted was a 5 year term instead of the 4 the Canucks offered. AAV was reportedly not the issue. Clearly there is a theme here. He then put himself in a position to demand a bigger contract after the playoffs. Now at this point, there's no indication that Zadorov's agent didn't advise Zadorov of the importance of fit. I assume he advised Zadorov that he could get more on the open market. Ultimately that is Zadorov's decision to make. I think that his agent advised him that Vancouver is a good fit and he's likely to play a top 4 role. I think he advised him that he can get more term/money from another team but the fit might not be as good as they don't know which teams would have him as their #1 target. At the end of the day, Zadorov got more than what we offered. His agent did his job.

 

[F A N]

Bridge deals can work but in the right circumstances. Bedard is like the first wave of prospects. So eating up all his elc years while they rebuild still. Probably eating into new deal as well as they try to turn the corner early on in it. If that doesn’t go smoothly could end up like Ott and be 4/5 years into the 2nd contract before finally getting to the PO. And OtT still not there yet at 8 ywars out of it.
Bridge has its risks too as with all that losing the player may not want to sign another deal. Ideally, if you can show that you are turning the corner then you’ve extended the window of having the guy in his prime.

I don't mind bridge deals as there are pros and cons. The big pro is that walking away from a 29/30 year old star player is usually difficult but re-signing that player would require a 7-8 year deal vs 33/34 year old who was bridged.

But I think from the team's perspective, it's dangerous to bridge your franchise player that you are 100% sure about unless you don't have the cap space. The whole point of RFA years is team control. If you let a player like Bedard dictate completely then he signs a 1 year deal so he gets arbitration rights.

I would be shocked if Bedard only did a bridge to remain a rfa after it expires.

Same. But technically, would a 4 year deal that takes him straight to UFA be considered a bridge deal? I don't think so.

 

[Diversification]

Lane Hutson is the definition of all buzz for nothing

He's the dman equivalent of Trevor Zegras.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

He's the dman equivalent of Trevor Zegras.

Damn

Go hide from all the angry Habs mob

Also I’m stealing this take to the main board

 

[StreetHawk]

I don't mind bridge deals as there are pros and cons. The big pro is that walking away from a 29/30 year old star player is usually difficult but re-signing that player would require a 7-8 year deal vs 33/34 year old who was bridged.

But I think from the team's perspective, it's dangerous to bridge your franchise player that you are 100% sure about unless you don't have the cap space. The whole point of RFA years is team control. If you let a player like Bedard dictate completely then he signs a 1 year deal so he gets arbitration rights.


Same. But technically, would a 4 year deal that takes him straight to UFA be considered a bridge deal? I don't think so.

Well, I don’t know if any highly regarded player does a deal right to ufa. Jason Robertson of Dallas did 4 years but he spent his first year pro in the A and had a post July 1 birthday thus did not accrue his first season as a pro towards ufa. Have to be on an nhl roster for just over half a season to qualify for it. So he would have a the required 4 years of nhl exp but doesn’t turn 27 by July 1, thus his ufa was pushed back a year. And would also only have 6 accrued nhl seasons.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

6 point night for Kucherov, hat trick for Guentzel. Best line in NHL right now?

He’s on pace for 144 points again. Dude is the least talked top player in the league. He should have won the Hart last year in my opinion. Over 60 more points than his closest teammate. I think he gets underrated a bit because he plays for Tampa and played with a past superstar in Stamkos. When really has been the one lifting Stamkos and others. Up for a long time now. Kucherov is the answer to who is the best player behind McDavid in my opinion.

 

[tantalum]

Calgary, Minnesota and Montreal had themselves a night. Dan The Man Vladar had the greatest game in the history of mankind.

I watched some of the Minnesota game. The Wild were terrible. They couldn't complete an open pass. And I don't mean the guy bobbles it or it's in the skates. I'm talking passes that aren't within 6 feet of the receiver with zero pressure. They looked as bad as I've ever seen a team the last few years. Obviously one game among many good ones but the Washington Generals could have beat them last night.

 

[bossram]

He’s on pace for 144 points again. Dude is the least talked top player in the league. He should have won the Hart last year in my opinion. Over 60 more points than his closest teammate. I think he gets underrated a bit because he plays for Tampa and played with a past superstar in Stamkos. When really has been the one lifting Stamkos and others. Up for a long time now. Kucherov is the answer to who is the best player behind McDavid in my opinion.

Kucherov was very impressive and should legitimately be in the Hart race.

But last season, his stats were padded with a ton of EN points. It has to factor in.

 

[Nick Lang]

The primary job of an agent is to get the best combination of situation and financial compensation for their client. But they aren't a neutral party and I think too often they push the player into solely a 'most $$$' position which also benefits the agent.

Zadorov loved Vancouver, the team loved Zadorov, Zadorov had been a guy who bounced around 5 or 6 teams in the last 6 or 8 years and *finally* found a fit for himself. And then he bolts over an extra $500k and is now in a situation that isn't great again. His agent should have been pushing hard to take a little less in order to stay in a better, known situation.

Personally I think this falls mostly (90%) on Zadorov. He has a brain (although sometimes I wonder when he's on the ice). He's a grown man, he should be able to make these decisions on his own just like everyone else. I'm sure his agent laid out the possibilities of what was important to Nikita. He's likely just greedy. He definitely has a fairly huge ego. He's the one responsible for sacrificing a great situation for a couple bucks and his pride.

How much extra does his agent even get out of that, like $10,000? That's peanuts. I don't think every agent's priority is just pushing for top dollar. They also have other responsibilities. **EDIT** As @StreetHawk pointed out more like $60-90 K.

 

[StreetHawk]

Personally I think this falls mostly (90%) on Zadorov. He has a brain (although sometimes I wonder when he's on the ice). He's a grown man, he should be able to make these decisions on his own just like everyone else. I'm sure his agent laid out the possibilities of what was important to Nikita. He's likely just greedy. He definitely has a fairly huge ego. He's the one responsible for sacrificing a great situation for a couple bucks and his pride.

How much extra does his agent even get out of that, like $10,000? That's peanuts. I don't think every agent's priority is just pushing for top dollar. They also have other responsibilities.

Agent fees typically 2-3%. at $500K per year over 6 that is $3 mill, thus $60-90K extra for the Agent.

 

[credulous]

Personally I think this falls mostly (90%) on Zadorov. He has a brain (although sometimes I wonder when he's on the ice). He's a grown man, he should be able to make these decisions on his own just like everyone else. I'm sure his agent laid out the possibilities of what was important to Nikita. He's likely just greedy. He definitely has a fairly huge ego. He's the one responsible for sacrificing a great situation for a couple bucks and his pride.

How much extra does his agent even get out of that, like $10,000? That's peanuts. I don't think every agent's priority is just pushing for top dollar. They also have other responsibilities.

zadorov's teammates couldn't wait to drive him to the airport in colorado and calgary. i think he's just a guy who is a little too full of himself. he was never going to take less money for a good situation

 

[Nick Lang]

Agent fees typically 2-3%. at $500K per year over 6 that is $3 mill, thus $60-90K extra for the Agent.

Yeah I realized my math was a bit off. I was focusing on just one extra year of $500,000. It's more significant but I still think the point is valid. I was going to update but you beat me to it. Zadorov is also 29 years old and not some rookie going through this for the first time. He should know what's important to himself.

zadorov's teammates couldn't wait to drive him to the airport in colorado and calgary. i think he's just a guy who is a little too full of himself. he was never going to take less money for a good situation

Yeah I get the sense he's fun to have around if you're winning but his loud mouth and inflated sense of self is not appreciated when the chips are down. He doesn't seem to be the player who gets committed to better defence and responsibility on the ice. Yapping, fighting, and thunderous hits sure, but dedication, responsibility, and hard work I don't know. Otherwise why would any of the clubs have let him go so easily, like you said with both sides critical of each other?

 

[Vector]

 

[Bobby9]

What are your thoughts on this play? I think it’s dirty from Hartman