Are you on board with a For Realbuild?

[shuchukfan]

How about we all just put our resources into building a time machine? What part of the Kings timeline do we go back to, though? Easy enough to say the PLD trade or even the Fiala/Faber one, but how about far back enough to some of Lombardi's desperation moves near the end of his tenure (or even before that)?

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

How about we all just put our resources into building a time machine? What part of the Kings timeline do we go back to, though? Easy enough to say the PLD trade or even the Fiala/Faber one, but how about far back enough to some of Lombardi's desperation moves near the end of his tenure (or even before that)?

Probably right before the Lucic trade

 

[DAkings20]

 

[ru4reals]

Get rid of the Front office, Blake, Luc, Bergevin, whomever else there is. Players I want to get rid of - Lizotte, LEWIS, Grundstrom, Arvy and anyway possible get rid of PLD(probably impossible) unless there's a buyout. That's what I'd start with. This team needs to get bigger and tougher.

 

[Schmooley]

Get rid of the Front office, Blake, Luc, Bergevin, whomever else there is. Players I want to get rid of - Lizotte, LEWIS, Grundstrom, Arvy and anyway possible get rid of PLD(probably impossible) unless there's a buyout. That's what I'd start with. This team needs to get bigger and tougher.

Guys like Lizotte Lewis and Grundstrom are not the problem. How many times does the supporting cast have to change before you realize its the core?
They have shuffled around these types of players for what 8 years now? It the guys above them that are not holding up compared to other teams top guys.

 

[Reaper45]

Roy, yes, Gavrikov, at the TDL if you can,

No chance are you moving Doughty.....not because of any perceived cap issues, it's because you have no one to replace him with, not even close to his level, even at his age.

The problem with that is the Kings may never have a Doughty replacement.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

The problem with that is the Kings may never have a Doughty replacement.

True, most teams won't....

 

[The Butcher]

Entire staff is gone if it were up to me.

I think ya gotta ditch anyone over 28 and scorch it for a few years. Make PLD play out that monstrosity of a contact on a lottery team full of kids and bury him on the 3rd line.

It seems like the only way to aquire generational players is to get in that lottery 3 or 4 years in a row.

Who AEG brings in is my main concern.

 

[Omni Owl]

Scorched earth has such a small chance of a successful outcome in terms of cups.

It’s still better than the zero we’re currently looking at.

Agreed. If you don't have a GM with a solid plan and complete vision you're f***ed. Blowing it up just for the sake of explosions won't work without a competent GM at the helm. Imagine if Bergevin were to somehow snake his way in? He'd make Blake look like Lombardi...

 

[Telos]

It is a tough choice and I don't really know if all options are on the table. Is AEG down for anything after enduring the recent "rebuild"? In all likeliness, they aren't. But I think you have to commit to one or the other, there is no middle ground retool here. The best approach is probably scorched earth and eject everyone right now not named Byfield and Clarke. I don't think that is going to happen, but hopefully some major changes come from this offseason. At the very least, they need to hire a competent GM and coach hopefully.

 

[ru4reals]

Guys like Lizotte Lewis and Grundstrom are not the problem. How many times does the supporting cast have to change before you realize its the core?
They have shuffled around these types of players for what 8 years now? It the guys above them that are not holding up compared to other teams top guys.

So, you don't mind Lewis back? He should have never been added in the first place. And Lizotte gets eatin up every year during the playoffs and Grundstrom has had his time. Of course, who doesn't want a better top 6 but this team is soft as sh*t and getting players that can bang set a tone when needed is exactly what Lizotte, Lewis cannot provide. I'm down for a rebuild of some sort but this team still have Kempe, Fiala, Byfield, Danault and Moore to build around. Akil has shown in his brief time on the big club he can play. How long are the kings going to bury these players in the A. You're right 8 years of softness, time for a change.

 

[Schmooley]

So, you don't mind Lewis back? He should have never been added in the first place. And Lizotte gets eatin up every year during the playoffs and Grundstrom has had his time. Of course, who doesn't want a better top 6 but this team is soft as sh*t and getting players that can bang set a tone when needed is exactly what Lizotte, Lewis cannot provide. I'm down for a rebuild of some sort but this team still have Kempe, Fiala, Byfield, Danault and Moore to build around. Akil has shown in his brief time on the big club he can play. How long are the kings going to bury these players in the A. You're right 8 years of softness, time for a change.

No I agree that those guys arent great. I wouldnt want Lewis back. But if you change them out yesterday for Duhaim Maroon etc. they still lose. Danault was out there for a lot of goals against not Lizotte.

 

[ru4reals]

No I agree that those guys arent great. I wouldnt want Lewis back. But if you change them out yesterday for Duhaim Maroon etc. they still lose. Danault was out there for a lot of goals against not Lizotte.

I get what your saying but Danault plays against top players on other teams. Mcdavid eats everyone up so saying Danault is out there for a lot of goals is pretty weak. I wanna see Lizotte go against top line players and see what happens. This team has been too soft for too long. As you mentioned 8 years and counting. Also sure we may be losing still but at least this team went down with a pair. Willing to bet Duhaim and Maroon wouldn't be tossed around like the guys we have. Not saying I want Duhaim or Maroon to be exact but those type of players are what this team needs.

 

[FrozenKing18]

Outside of cleansing the front office,

- Buyout, Trade and/or Retain PLD’s contract
- Trade Kaliyev, the poor kid.
- Add some size in the bottom lines. Take a chance on some washouts like J. Gauthier, or the 3rd Strome brother, Matthew. Stick those guys on the 4th line along with Helenius.
- See if you can pry a young goalie like Knight or Woll

 

[Surf Nutz]

Between game 1 and 2 of a first round playoff series is not the time to launch a whatever you want to call it - build.

 

[Kurrilino]

People pointed fingers at me laughing, when i suggested to put Kopitar and Doughty into the press box until they ask for a trade, years ago.

And here we are...

The problem with that is the Kings may never have a Doughty replacement.

I am curious how a #1 defender who can't shut down opposition top players can't be replaced?

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

Idk man - I think it's more about cleaning house in terms of the front office and less about gutting the entire roster.

Gutting the roster is just going to put us 5+ years from seeing the playoffs again and I believe there are some good pieces to work with here.

For me, it primarily comes down to the following:

• Trade PLD if you can (buy him out if you can't)
  • This is a huge one - Freeing up $8.5 million in cap space is so incredibly massive.. You can do a lot with that money - Even if it's used to bring in a single player (1st line forward or 1st pair LHD)
• Reduce roles for Kopitar and Doughty
  • Clarke consistent top 4 ice time and running PP1 instead of Drew
  • Byfield taking over as 1C
  • And you communicate this to 11 and 8
    • You sit them down with the new GM and front office and say "Look, our plan is to deploy you guys in reduced roles so we can evaluate younger players and give them a chance to thrive. This could mean missing the playoffs for the next couple years. If you have a problem with that, let us know and we can look into sending you guys to teams where you'll have a chance of winning another cup"
• PLAY the players you've drafted and taken years to develop - And let them make mistakes
  • This is where it becomes more of an organizational/mindset shift for the next year or two
  • You'd no longer be in "We need to try to win now with Kopi and Drew" mode. Instead you come to terms with the fact that the next season or two are building years
  • You use these years to legitimately play young players in prominent roles and you accept the fact that you likely won't make the playoffs as a result
• Don't overpay to try to keep UFAs (let Roy, Arvidsson, Lizotte, etc walk)
• Add toughness to the lineup (re-vamp the bottom 6 / in particular the 4th line)
• Ditch the 1-3-1
  • If you can't beat teams without needing to play the trap, you shouldn't be in the playoffs to begin with

If you can trade guys like Danault, Moore, and Gavrikov for really good returns, then I'm not opposed. But I feel trading players like Kempe and Fiala would be a mistake unless you're confident the return is absolutely amazing. Wingers like Kempe and Fiala don't grow on trees. That would leave the Kings with something like this going into next year:

Fiala - Byfield - Kempe (love this idea for a 1st line)
Moore - Kopitar - Fagemo
Turcotte - Danault - Laferriere
XX - XX - XX (grinders with size ideally)

XX - Doughty
Anderson - Clarke
XX (Moverare could be a good option IMO) - Spence

Rittich (re-signed)
Portillo (Let's see what this guy can do as a backup next year - Had a great AHL season)

 

[johnjm22]

If you can trade guys like Danault, Moore, and Gavrikov for really good returns, then I'm not opposed. But I feel trading players like Kempe and Fiala would be a mistake unless you're confident the return is absolutely amazing.

If you're trading away Danault, Moore, and Gavrikov, what would be the point of keeping Kempe?

He's only signed for 2 more seasons. When it's time for a new contract he'll be 30 years old and will probably want a huge long term deal.

Doughty should probably also be gone in that scenario. He's made it pretty clear he wants to win now.

 

[johnjm22]

Kempe

YEAR	CONTRACT	AGE	CLAUSE
23-24	5.5M	27​
24-25	5.5M	28​	M-NTC
26-27	5.5M	29​	M-NTC
27-28	UFA	30​

I love him, but it's pretty obvious he should be traded ASAP if you're rebuilding.

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

If you're trading away Danault, Moore, and Gavrikov, what would be the point of keeping Kempe?

He's only signed for 2 more seasons. When it's time for a new contract he'll be 30 years old and will probably want a huge long term deal.

Doughty should probably also be gone in that scenario. He's made it pretty clear he wants to win now.

I'm not really proposing they gut the roster and launch into a full rebuild. IMO - You only trade Kempe if you're truly gutting the roster and starting a full rebuild or if someone makes you an offer that is so absurd you have no choice but to take it.

Personally, I don't really think a complete and total rebuild is needed. Instead, I think the Kings need significant front office changes, a couple big roster moves (like trading PLD), and a change in mindset away from this "we have to win while we have Drew and Kopi" philosophy.

If Drew wants to win now, then you say "totally understandable, you're an absolute legend and we want to give you a chance to do that with another team since we can't guarantee you'll have a chance to do that with the Kings in the next 2-3 years." And you trade him - Hopefully without needing to retain salary / add too much as a sweetener in the deal. Same deal for Kopitar.

Also, trading away Danault, Moore, and Gavrikov wouldn't be a priority - I was more just saying that I'd listen to offers on those players and would agree to a deal if the return was awesome. Maybe Gavrikov I'd look into trading a bit.

You also leave Byfield on an island if you completely gut this roster and sell everyone with value as some are proposing. Yes, ideally they'd be giving young players more opportunity at prominent roles - But you still want to surround those young players with strong NHL talent.

 

[Surf Nutz]

Idk man - I think it's more about cleaning house in terms of the front office and less about gutting the entire roster.

Gutting the roster is just going to put us 5+ years from seeing the playoffs again and I believe there are some good pieces to work with here.

For me, it primarily comes down to the following:

• Trade PLD if you can (buy him out if you can't)
  • This is a huge one - Freeing up $8.5 million in cap space is so incredibly massive.. You can do a lot with that money - Even if it's used to bring in a single player (1st line forward or 1st pair LHD)
• Reduce roles for Kopitar and Doughty
  • Clarke consistent top 4 ice time and running PP1 instead of Drew
  • Byfield taking over as 1C
  • And you communicate this to 11 and 8
    • You sit them down with the new GM and front office and say "Look, our plan is to deploy you guys in reduced roles so we can evaluate younger players and give them a chance to thrive. This could mean missing the playoffs for the next couple years. If you have a problem with that, let us know and we can look into sending you guys to teams where you'll have a chance of winning another cup"
• PLAY the players you've drafted and taken years to develop - And let them make mistakes
  • This is where it becomes more of an organizational/mindset shift for the next year or two
  • You'd no longer be in "We need to try to win now with Kopi and Drew" mode. Instead you come to terms with the fact that the next season or two are building years
  • You use these years to legitimately play young players in prominent roles and you accept the fact that you likely won't make the playoffs as a result
• Don't overpay to try to keep UFAs (let Roy, Arvidsson, Lizotte, etc walk)
• Add toughness to the lineup (re-vamp the bottom 6 / in particular the 4th line)
• Ditch the 1-3-1
  • If you can't beat teams without needing to play the trap, you shouldn't be in the playoffs to begin with

If you can trade guys like Danault, Moore, and Gavrikov for really good returns, then I'm not opposed. But I feel trading players like Kempe and Fiala would be a mistake unless you're confident the return is absolutely amazing. Wingers like Kempe and Fiala don't grow on trees. That would leave the Kings with something like this going into next year:

Fiala - Byfield - Kempe (love this idea for a 1st line)
Moore - Kopitar - Fagemo
Turcotte - Danault - Laferriere
XX - XX - XX (grinders with size ideally)

XX - Doughty
Anderson - Clarke
XX (Moverare could be a good option IMO) - Spence

Rittich (re-signed)
Portillo (Let's see what this guy can do as a backup next year - Had a great AHL season)

Some good ideas here.
The timing is off for dumping PLD unless they plan on dumping Blake as well during the off season.
Blake can't do it because it would be admitting a major FUBAR and could trigger his dismissal.
I assume both are staying until sometime after next season starts.
I can see Blake fired during next season or allowed to expire at the end of it.
PLD needs to be top line wing just like in WPG.

PLD- Kopitar - Kempe

Kopitar will play out his contract here, per his wishes and then return to Slovenia if the geo-political situation is good.
Arvidson (or Fiala) - Danault-Moore

Arvidsson should be resigned , I don't think he gets that much anywhere else. Roy may walk for more money and that leaves funds to resign Arvidsson. My opinion on him changed since seeing how important he is upon his return from injury, a high winning percentage in tow.

Fiala(or Kaliyev)-Byfield-Laferriere (or Fagemo)

You don't put Byfield at 1c until he does well at 3c. The whole line could move up if producing and solid defensively.

Grundstrom - Lizotte -Lewis (or Kaliyev or Fagemo)

MA -DD (or Roy) Drew indeed may wish to go to a contender.
Gav -Roy -Roy may walk if the Kings can't offer enough and Gav is expiring so should resigned or traded.
Englund -Spence
Moverare -Clarke

Rittich - Copley

 

[Schmooley]

Some good ideas here.
The timing is off for dumping PLD unless they plan on dumping Blake as well during the off season.
Blake can't do it because it would be admitting a major FUBAR and could trigger his dismissal.
I assume both are staying until sometime after next season starts.
I can see Blake fired during next season or allowed to expire at the end of it.
PLD needs to be top line wing just like in WPG.

PLD- Kopitar - Kempe

Kopitar will play out his contract here, per his wishes and then return to Slovenia if the geo-political situation is good.
Arvidson (or Fiala) - Danault-Moore

Arvidsson should be resigned , I don't think he gets that much anywhere else. Roy may walk for more money and that leaves funds to resign Arvidsson. My opinion on him changed since seeing how important he is upon his return from injury, a high winning percentage in tow.

Fiala(or Kaliyev)-Byfield-Laferriere (or Fagemo)

You don't put Byfield at 1c until he does well at 3c. The whole line could move up if producing and solid defensively.

Grundstrom - Lizotte -Lewis (or Kaliyev or Fagemo)

MA -DD (or Roy) Drew indeed may wish to go to a contender.
Gav -Roy -Roy may walk if the Kings can't offer enough and Gav is expiring so should resigned or traded.
Englund -Spence
Moverare -Clarke

Rittich - Copley

This is the exact same team we are watching right now only with Dubois on 1st line wing and Byfield at 3c.