Player Discussion Alexis Lafrenière

[True Blue]

A Rangers problem? So Fox should be better than he is? Miller? Buchnevich has improved greatly from 22-25. Chytil was on the cusp of becoming the 2nd line center before getting hurt. A reminder that he's only 21. How about Lindgren? Overachiever or due to the coaches/system/franchise? I don't buy it.

For reference, people should see how the first 10 or so games went for Joe Thorton, Lecavalier, Mark Messier. Heck, Rick friggin' Nash.

 

[NYR3]

For reference, people should see how the first 10 or so games went for Joe Thorton, Lecavalier, Mark Messier. Heck, Rick friggin' Nash.

Plenty of great players struggle young but you can't get on people for wanting to see top picks perform in a league where lots of 1st and 2nd overalls perform right out of the gate.

 

[True Blue]

Plenty of great players struggle young but you can't get on people for wanting to see top picks perform in a league where lots of 1st and 2nd overalls perform right out of the gate.

I am not. But said people need to understand that the teenagers that came in and set the NHL on fire are few and far between.

 

[NYR3]

I am not. But said people need to understand that the teenagers that came in and set the NHL on fire are few and far between.

Who is asking them to be setting the world on fire though? Just a few goals and a few shifts where they control the play is what people want to see

 

[True Blue]

Who is asking them to be setting the world on fire though? Just a few goals and a few shifts where they control the play is what people want to see

That is still the exception and not the rule when it comes to teenagers.

Also, with Lafreniere it is entirely disengenous to judge him by the same exact standards that other teen 1OA players. Until camp, he has not played hockey in 10 months. He then had all of a two week training camp. Oh, and there were no exhibition games to be seen. Welcome to the NHL, kid. How many others have had the same experience? The answer is not a single one. He would basically be barely finishing the exhibition games at this point.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Who is asking them to be setting the world on fire though? Just a few goals and a few shifts where they control the play is what people want to see

Is it the system? Is there a system? The NHL game is faster and he had many months off yet a pass is a pass. If you have a system and you know where the teammates goes, make the pass.

Imo, it looks a bit like pond hockey. Relying on individual skill and hoping for the best.

The only time they look organized is when the skate up to center ice and then drop the puck to a trailer which i hate lol.

 

[NYR3]

Is it the system? Is there a system? The NHL game is faster and he had many months off yet a pass is a pass. If you have a system and you know where the teammates goes, make the pass.

Imo, it looks a bit like pond hockey. Relying on individual skill and hoping for the best.

The only time they look organized is when the skate up to center ice and then drop the puck to a trailer which i hate lol.

It's whatever at this point. I'll keep hoping for the best for this team and that's all i can do.

 

[NYSPORTS]

It's whatever at this point. I'll keep hoping for the best for this team and that's all i can do.

i think we’re in for a long year. Haven’t even played Boston yet. Philly is apparently not playing well yet keep winning. That outta be fun.

 

[EdJovanovski]

So I guess he’s gonna be the target for the Deangelo fan boys who need someone to direct their anger at all to try and piss everyone off?

C’mon man I predicted he’d score 15,090 goals last night

 

[NYR3]

i think we’re in for a long year. Haven’t even played Boston yet. Philly is apparently not playing well yet keep winning. That outta be fun.

I wasn't expecting much from this team this year anyway. Everything seems like a struggle with this team

 

[NYSPORTS]

I wasn't expecting much from this team this year anyway. Everything seems like a struggle with this team

i thought they would be more entertaining. I agree, “everything seems like a struggle”

 

[CasusBelli]

I can't figure it out why the rangers have such huge problems developing forwards... Chytil is on the right track, he's got the tools, but too early to tell. Kreider is Kreider. Kakko, Laf, Howden are really ugh... yeah, "played well and created chances"... for how long now, 10 games? Time to produce. The scoreboard doesn't reflect "tried hard", only the score.

On the other hand... Miller and Fox... are flourishing and it is a pure joy to watch them both develop. Why can't it be like that up front?

We seem to do well with Americans. Callahan, Kreider, Miller, Fox ... it’s almost uncanny. At least when you compare to our fortunes with other nationalities and given that about 50% of the league is Canadian.

 

[Mikos87]

Thought he played very well last night. The way he showed up Dobson, that brings back memories from the Q. I like that he's playing with a couple of grinders. You can see Alexis as the primary playmaker on a line with a couple of hustlers that provide some real good puck support and crash the net. It's one of those things where the Rangers have a lot of talent, and a number of guys who are great playmakers. Add Fox to the list, and you have one puck and not enough touches.

With the grinders, you can get Alexis the type of touches he has been used to. Really thought Digi, and Rooney played well off of Alexis. Getting a right shot with Alexis should open up more passing lanes, especially if this style of play continues. Digi is playing like he wants a multi-year contract. I think the offense will come, you saw the group great some good looks. Alexis is starting to get some good shots on net.

No one feels good after a loss, but these guys played the right way with their effort and puck support.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Laf lead all players in last nights game with FIVE hits
Also 2 takeaways

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Laf lead all players in last nights game with FIVE hits
Also 2 takeaways

Are we still considering hits a positive stat regardless of outcome?

 

[EdJovanovski]

Are we still considering hits a positive stat regardless of outcome?

Yes, you soft Euro!
The idea that hits aren't a positive is that you don't have possession, his line rarely has the puck anyways, so it's a good thing that he's getting more physically involved

 

[LiveLongandProspal]

I hope we can look back on these days and laugh

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

I'm not too concerned about a lack of ice time for them -- except on the PP where IMO at least one of them should be a staple. As much as I like Buchnevich, he's not done much on the PP in his career.

TBH, I don't have the answers. Moreover, I'm usually of the wait and see type, especially with prospects. All season I was among the few fighting uphill to defend Kakko as hopes plummeted to despair about his potential last year.

But as I watch Alexis this year struggle almost identically to Kakko, and as I watch the 'improvement' of Kakko, I have to admit I get worried.

Personally, I just think our offense is very overrated. We don't really generate much as a team and last year we scored so much because DeAngelo, Panarin, and Zibanejad were finishing plays at absurd rates--rates that were always going to slow. This is why I worry about Quinn--not because he's bad at developing solid, dependable forwards, but because he's not proven himself very good at developing any other type of forward... Kids with scoring upside... I don't see the way we play or the way our lineup is constructed as conducive to scoring forwards. Panarin was a PPG player on a Torterella team...

Even Buchnevich (his star protégé apparently) has hardly been lighting the world on fire. He's followed a pretty steady trajectory. Last year he paced for 55 points, this year in his big breakout he's pacing for 59.

Fair enough - I wonder how Lafreniere would be if was injected into the lineup last season when the Rangers were cookin' offensively.

I'd be lying if I wasn't suppressing some impatience with those two myself, but I have to keep reminding myself that it is an unprecedented time in regards to Lafreniere. Very short camp, no preseason, no games for months leading up to the season.

I understand your feeling though. The top PP unit, as good as it has looked at times, is 25th in the NHL. So maybe it wouldn't hurt to give Laf or Kakko a shot on the right side on that unit. It is rare that they even have a full minute to operate on the 2nd unit since the 1st unit milks all the time they can get. Throw in the putrid faceoff success rate and they are usually having to retrieve the puck in their own zone first. Which leads to all of 15-30 seconds of actual PP time in the zone.

I don't know what the answers is either. I look at each player and I dont think they are playing badly and are improving. But the production isnt there and neither is the sustained success of the team offensively as a whole.

So I feel like it comes down to patience. I cant make a snap judgement about the Rangers killing elite talent, especially when they are still teenagers.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

1. Alexis Lafreniere, LW, 19 (New York Rangers)
Let’s face it: This probably isn’t the start to his career that Lafreniere envisioned for himself. But there’s also a lot at play in his low counting stats, including the second-worst PDO (.933) among all Rangers forwards so far this season (only Chris Kreider has had worse on-ice luck than Lafreniere at 5-on-5).

I wouldn’t worry. Jack Hughes and Andrei Svechnikov didn’t have picture-perfect rookie seasons either and I’m extremely confident Lafreniere ends up closer to their stratosphere than to the level that top picks like Jesse Puljujarvi and Nail Yakupov settled into.

As I wrote after the draft, Lafreniere was always going to be a little slower to that top-of-the-lineup role he’ll need to really thrive because of the Rangers’ organizational depth at left wing. Lafreniere was the best player in the CHL at 17 and 18 (on a bum ankle). His age-adjusted track record to this point places him in truly elite NHL company.

If there’s a tier between Yakupov and Hughes that includes names like Nico Hischier, Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, and Aaron Ekblad, Lafreniere’s career to this point has followed a better trajectory than theirs too. He had a better junior career than Nathan McKinnon. He was never going to be Connor McDavid or Auston Matthews, 10 games hasn’t changed his all-star level expectations.

That’s still the end game. He’s got the strength over pucks. He’s got the touch, and finesse, and stickhandling skill to play through layers. He’s got the power through his skating stride to play around them (though his acceleration will need to continue to improve, which it has). He understands spacing and how to use it to his advantage.

His wrister pops (he doesn’t really have a one-timer) and he makes his linemates better as a playmaker, the latter of which is a side of him we really haven’t seen blossom in the NHL just yet. He doesn’t panic under pressure and will learn to play with more poise as he gets more comfortable in the NHL. He’s going to be awesome.

Wheeler’s 2021 NHL prospect pool rankings: No. 2 New York Rangers

I think this is pretty fair assessment.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Fair enough - I wonder how Lafreniere would be if was injected into the lineup last season when the Rangers were cookin' offensively.

I'd be lying if I wasn't suppressing some impatience with those two myself, but I have to keep reminding myself that it is an unprecedented time in regards to Lafreniere. Very short camp, no preseason, no games for months leading up to the season.

I understand your feeling though. The top PP unit, as good as it has looked at times, is 25th in the NHL. So maybe it wouldn't hurt to give Laf or Kakko a shot on the right side on that unit. It is rare that they even have a full minute to operate on the 2nd unit since the 1st unit milks all the time they can get. Throw in the putrid faceoff success rate and they are usually having to retrieve the puck in their own zone first. Which leads to all of 15-30 seconds of actual PP time in the zone.

I don't know what the answers is either. I look at each player and I dont think they are playing badly and are improving. But the production isnt there and neither is the sustained success of the team offensively as a whole.

Yeah, and no one really is bothered by it when it happens to a Gauthier or an Andersson, and understandably so because they don't have the tools to be stars, but colored me unimpressed by the 'development' of forwards. If we're trying to clone Jesper Fast, we're moving in the right direction, but I'd rather clone Panarin...

 

[True Blue]

Yeah, and no one really is bothered by it when it happens to a Gauthier or an Andersson, and understandably so because they don't have the tools to be stars, but colored me unimpressed by the 'development' of forwards. If we're trying to clone Jesper Fast, we're moving in the right direction, but I'd rather clone Panarin...

Yeah. When I see Kakko or Lafreniere play, the first name that leaps to mind is Fast.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

For reference, people should see how the first 10 or so games went for Joe Thorton, Lecavalier, Mark Messier. Heck, Rick friggin' Nash.

Steve Stamkos.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

Yeah, and no one really is bothered by it when it happens to a Gauthier or an Andersson, and understandably so because they don't have the tools to be stars, but colored me unimpressed by the 'development' of forwards. If we're trying to clone Jesper Fast, we're moving in the right direction, but I'd rather clone Panarin...

Honestly I'd rather have young teenagers buying in and developing from a defensive standpoint first rather than tearing up the scoresheet and completely ignoring the other side of the ice, but thats me. Thats how you win down the line - getting into good habits.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Honestly I'd rather have young teenagers buying in and developing from a defensive standpoint first rather than tearing up the scoresheet and completely ignoring the other side of the ice, but thats me. Thats how you win down the line - getting into good habits.

I'm with you. We can only hope that's exactly what we're witnessing now.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

I'm with you. We can only hope that's exactly what we're witnessing now.

The Rangers offense as a whole has hit the skids. #5 in the NHL with 3 1/3 goals per game last season.

We take away Fast, McKegg, ADA, Staal & Skjei and add Lafreniere, a more developed Buch, Chytil & Kakko and Rooney/Blackwell and Miller.

Not much of a trade off there. Mika's slow start is really killing this team right now. He's a game driver. Hard to believe this will continue 5 on 5 and on the PP. Same PP unit of forwards goes from 7th in the NHL to 25th. And it has looked really good for the most part. It will turn around.

Mika is the catalyst. If your #1 center isnt producing the way he can (or at all) then the rest of the offense begins to shut down.