Draft 2020 Draft & Undrafted Free Agent Thread: Part VI

[Joey Bones]

Guhle and Jarvis are two guys that really fascinate me. It doesn’t seem likely that either would last to the Carolina pick, but if either are present in the mid-late teens then I would certainly be interested in moving up at the right price. A big two way Canadian defenseman like Guhle does seem like a guy that is way more likely to get drafted sooner than expected rather than later...

Guhle can get way ahead of himself, though. There are times he'll take himself out of plays to lay a big hit or try for the odd man rush. He gets caught on some of those chances. I'd like for him to be more aware in that regard, otherwise he's another Brendan Smith. I wouldn't move up for Guhle, but I wouldn't mind him at No. 20-24.

Jarvis, on the other hand, is worth the hype and I don't think he falls to the 20's.

 

[Joey Bones]

With all the talk about the Rangers needing centers on this board i am surprised Zary's name isn't being thrown around more for the target with the Carolina pick. On paper at least he seems like exactly the type of player that our system can use.

Zary has noted skating issues, but at No. 20-24 it isn't a bad pick. Just hope he can work on that extra gear.

 

[Joey Bones]

Just curious. Is there a big difference from 20-24 compared to say 28-31 in this draft? Should NYR consider trying to move back to later in the 1st round whiling also grabbing a 2nd/3rd round pick or is sticking in that 20-24 range the best option at this point the build?

I'll put it this way....

Think the Ranger's best bet is to move the pick for a younger, more accomplished center that can push to be in the lineup now.

 

[Joey Bones]

Assuming that Carolina takes Askarov, I like the idea of attaching Geo to the Carolina pick to get the Edmonton pick.

Someone will be there who has no business being there.

This would be great, but it'll depend who is there. I, also, think that the Rangers could squeak a little more out of a deal involving Georgiev.

 

[Joey Bones]

In theory, at least one of Lundell, Mercer or Jarvis should be on the board at that spot.

And a Rossi or Holtz/Raymond.

 

[Joey Bones]

without Junior, Euro and NCAA playoffs, and no Combines,
yeah some teams may be making less informed decsions.
As noted around here a few months back,
this could create some unanticipated opportunities for NYR's 3 7th round picks ...

I think most teams have done their homework on some of these prospects, but it is still wide open.

However, I feel next year and possibly the season after could affect things a whole lot differently. Summer training/tournaments and most NCAA feeder teams aren't playing yet.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

And a Rossi or Holtz/Raymond.

If Rossi drops that far...

 

[Joey Bones]

I have to say, Peterka is just — really — underrated this draft from my POV. There is some systematic error behind not one of the scouting services listed at EP having him higher than 17 and most in the mid 20s.

I am watching Canada-Germany in the U20 WJC right now. His ranking is odd.

Peterka can move. It's hard to say how offensive he'd be in the NHL, but if you could get a kid who can PK and have breakaways up the wazoo then I'm all for it.

Reminds me of Grabner, a bit....

 

[Joey Bones]

Idk I think him knowing that these are his final 30 or so games for the Rangers. He might rise to the occasion and play well consistently
It's just that damn 8,5 for 25 or 30 games. Itll work itself out
That's what Davidson and Gorton get paid the big bucks for

Itd be mint if he retired but that's a whole other conversation

That would be a sad, but ceremonious day. I'm interested to see what management can agree upon with him.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Do you know how the reasoning goes there?

Like Reichel, sure, there are some projecting there. He is a typical D-1 prospect. Can skate, stick handle and everything, but the explosiveness and stamina isn’t quite there. Peterka is definitely really good already.

DEL is a weak league, and while some use the emergence of Seider, Schulz, Stutzle, Reichel and Peterka as a sign of DEL improving, most scouts consider it an anomaly. We always talk about strength of schedule. DEL is probably the 6th best league in Europe behind the KHL, SHL, NL, Liiga and ELH.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Not really relevant to us but I dug through a ton of Quentin Byfield video and the more I watched, the less I liked.

The skating, size, hands and compete are all great, but there are more green areas in his game than I'd feel comfortable with if Im LA and honestly, he doesn't do a good job hiding what he wants to do, he telegraphs his intentions way more often than a top guy should. It was obvious before doing a deep dive that his hockey sense lagged behind some of the other top guys, but I think the gap in that area is much bigger than its being discussed.

His ceiling is legitimate because of the tools, but the more boxes you need to check off during your development, the less likely you are of reaching said ceiling.

 

[Fireonk]

Zary has noted skating issues, but at No. 20-24 it isn't a bad pick. Just hope he can work on that extra gear.

Interesting. From what I have been reading most reports say his skating is generally fine. So wont necessarily be what keeps him back but also isn't going to be a tool that he can get by on in the NHL.

He's giving me a Derek Stepan vibe, not necessarily going to stand out but in the right situation can be a key cog in letting everyone else do their thing.

 

[Polar Bear]

Not really relevant to us but I dug through a ton of Quentin Byfield video and the more I watched, the less I liked.

The skating, size, hands and compete are all great, but there are more green areas in his game than I'd feel comfortable with if Im LA and honestly, he doesn't do a good job hiding what he wants to do, he telegraphs his intentions way more often than a top guy should. It was obvious before doing a deep dive that his hockey sense lagged behind some of the other top guys, but I think the gap in that area is much bigger than its being discussed.

His ceiling is legitimate because of the tools, but the more boxes you need to check off during your development, the less likely you are of reaching said ceiling.

All I got to say is thankfully it's not our problem that we'd have to choose between Byfield/Stutzle; that's going to be tough for LA. We should feel fortunate that we landed the 1st pick in a draft when there is a guy as clear as a number 1 as Laf is. The Knicks, for example, if they won the lottery tonight would have a massive decision on their hands since there is far from a consensus first overall pick.

 

[Ola]

DEL is a weak league, and while some use the emergence of Seider, Schulz, Stutzle, Reichel and Peterka as a sign of DEL improving, most scouts consider it an anomaly. We always talk about strength of schedule. DEL is probably the 6th best league in Europe behind the KHL, SHL, NL, Liiga and ELH.

OK, and I know it’s not your argument lol, but just to add my stance on the topic. It’s not the KHL/SHL. But I think a little variance of opponents can be really good. The DEL has some really strong lines but also some weaker depth.

But I do think it’s the league/country by far most committed to developing kids and promoting their national hockey program. That is a big plus. These guys get a shot to play and play a lot. Playing the D+1 season there is not something I would see as a negative.

 

[True Blue]

For about the fourteenth time, I didn't say the third best option on the left.

Go read the article, for one. If you can't, don't blame me.

I said the third best WINGER.

All that implies is that these teams have two top line wingers that are better than him? So friggin' what? Who cares? All that would mean is that said team would have fantastic depth as they would have a top line player on the second line? Isn't that a good thing?

That still does not change the fact that yes he is a top liner.

For a contending team, it's important to have good winger options, whether they be left or right wingers. You need to have good players on the wing. It doesn't matter that much whether the production is coming from right wingers or left wingers, as long as you have some quality scoring wingers, it can be either. I'm not arguing that one player is interchangeable between right and left, I'm arguing that you need a player of roughly Kreider's caliber on the second line on the right OR left at least to be a contender.

As to Kreider, on most of those teams, he'd be the third best winger. Not third best left wing. Third best winger.

Ok, isn't that what he is on the Rangers? If so, isn't that what you are arguing for? He is on the second line. That seems to me like fantastic depth. That seems to be what you are after. If so, then what is the debate about?

On some of those teams (I think 2 was the count), he would be worse than the third best winger.

There are two contenders who have 3 better wings? Two teams in the NHL have 3 better wings? Shame on Kreider.

So he's kinda the mendoza line on what a second line winger option would be on a contender. There are two teams who have better winger options, so I'm not gonna say he's a great option. But there is also a contender with worse wingers, so I'm not gonna say he's a terrible winger option on a contender either. Hence, decent option on a contender. Maybe he's a great option on a second line for a team that's a bubble team, but I'm not interested in measuring against those teams.

You said there are two teams that have 3 better options at wings. Two. That makes him far better than "decent". In fact, that seems like odds are far greater than not, that there are very, very few like the one you describe. As such, I am again not sure what you are banging your head about.

You clamor for "depth". And then when presented with facts, you bemoan what you are seeing.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

OK, and I know it’s not your argument lol, but just to add my stance on the topic. It’s not the KHL/SHL. But I think a little variance of opponents can be really good. The DEL has some really strong lines but also some weaker depth.

But I do think it’s the league/country by far most committed to developing kids and promoting their national hockey program. That is a big plus. These guys get a shot to play and play a lot. Playing the D+1 season there is not something I would see as a negative.

No, but it's the DEL, not Liiga or the SHL. If these kids were in the SHL like for instance Dominik Bokk, there wouldn't be as much debate about their performance. There's a risk that their performance is inflated by having weaker opposition.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

All I got to say is thankfully it's not our problem that we'd have to choose between Byfield/Stutzle; that's going to be tough for LA. We should feel fortunate that we landed the 1st pick in a draft when there is a guy as clear as a number 1 as Laf is. The Knicks, for example, if they won the lottery tonight would have a massive decision on their hands since there is far from a consensus first overall pick.

LA should take Stutzle.

 

[Edge]

Not really relevant to us but I dug through a ton of Quentin Byfield video and the more I watched, the less I liked.

The skating, size, hands and compete are all great, but there are more green areas in his game than I'd feel comfortable with if Im LA and honestly, he doesn't do a good job hiding what he wants to do, he telegraphs his intentions way more often than a top guy should. It was obvious before doing a deep dive that his hockey sense lagged behind some of the other top guys, but I think the gap in that area is much bigger than its being discussed.

His ceiling is legitimate because of the tools, but the more boxes you need to check off during your development, the less likely you are of reaching said ceiling.

If the second spot was the easiest spot in last year's draft, it might be the hardest in this year's draft.

Really, for many of the exact reasons you just outlined.

Now, one thing I would caution with Byfield is that you're looking at a player who is 8 months to almost a full year younger than his two main rivals at the top of this class. And that's on top of him already being a bigger kid who is still learning and growing into his body.

In many ways, the team that drafts Byfield is really drafting a man-child. I don't mean that as an insult. It's just you're dealing with a kid who is still developing all of his tools, but doing it inside a larger, plus man-sized body.

You're also not necessarily drafting Byfield because you think he's clearly the second best player in 2020. You're drafting him with the belief, or the acceptance of risk that he's the second best player in 2025.

Yes, there's more moving parts at work, and that increases the gamble. But it also gives him a chance to do what very few people in NHL are capable of doing.

 

[Ola]

All I got to say is thankfully it's not our problem that we'd have to choose between Byfield/Stutzle; that's going to be tough for LA. We should feel fortunate that we landed the 1st pick in a draft when there is a guy as clear as a number 1 as Laf is. The Knicks, for example, if they won the lottery tonight would have a massive decision on their hands since there is far from a consensus first overall pick.

My best guess is that it wouldn’t be a very hard decision.

Stutzle is from my POV closer to Laf than Byfield is to Stutzle. 2 of 10 teams interviewed by McKenzie had Byfield outside the top 5. Byfield hasn’t taken those final steps in his development. He is a big kid, they won’t start to play hockey in the junior leagues until they can get 50% of the spectators in. He has no organized practices to take part in right now as far as I know. It’s important time for these kids to develop during.

Byfield is an amazing package. But at the same time, it’s a huge challenge for him to take those last steps to become a top NHL player. You must be able to skate as well as anyone.

Stutzle is special IMO. I like him a lot more than Hirscher to be honest. You have to bet on someone and I can’t argue against that we have to bet on Laf against the information we have to predict the future on. But to put it like this, I don’t mind that NJD don’t have No 2 in this draft...

 

[Ola]

No, but it's the DEL, not Liiga or the SHL. If these kids were in the SHL like for instance Dominik Bokk, there wouldn't be as much debate about their performance. There's a risk that their performance is inflated by having weaker opposition.

Ah, ok, gotcha.

 

[Igor Shestyorkin]

Zary has noted skating issues, but at No. 20-24 it isn't a bad pick. Just hope he can work on that extra gear.

I've watched a decent bit of film on Zary and done some research on him lately and I'm admittedly not the biggest fan. His passing metrics also don't grade out well. Not sure if I personally see a very high upside with him.

 

[Ola]

Peterka can move. It's hard to say how offensive he'd be in the NHL, but if you could get a kid who can PK and have breakaways up the wazoo then I'm all for it.

Reminds me of Grabner, a bit....

Yeah, and not only does he have the top speed, he can get going really fast too. Just pick up the puck along the boards and turn it on to get it deep. He handles the puck well under pressure. He understands the offensive game. He can finish.

I don’t know a thing about the kid and I’ve only seen him in one environment. Maybe he got issues I am not aware of. But from my POV, you have to project — a lot — of weakness into his game that I can’t see any hints of when watching him in the WJC for example.

 

[Polar Bear]

My best guess is that it wouldn’t be a very hard decision.

Stutzle is from my POV closer to Laf than Byfield is to Stutzle. 2 of 10 teams interviewed by McKenzie had Byfield outside the top 5. Byfield hasn’t taken those final steps in his development. He is a big kid, they won’t start to play hockey in the junior leagues until they can get 50% of the spectators in. He has no organized practices to take part in right now as far as I know. It’s important time for these kids to develop during.

Byfield is an amazing package. But at the same time, it’s a huge challenge for him to take those last steps to become a top NHL player. You must be able to skate as well as anyone.

Stutzle is special IMO. I like him a lot more than Hirscher to be honest. You have to bet on someone and I can’t argue against that we have to bet on Laf against the information we have to predict the future on. But to put it like this, I don’t mind that NJD don’t have No 2 in this draft...

Like I said, all I got to say is thank God we're 1 in a draft where we will take someone like Laf and not have to argue for months like LA is doing (which isn't a bad thing, it just makes things much harder and stressful).

 

[Kovalev27]

If I’m LA I take Byfield. Worth the project. Already have skilled centers in Turcotte Vilardi Kupari what they don’t have is a horse with that upside. That’s a no brainer for me and I’m very high on Stutzle as many might recall. But for what LA has that would absolutely be my pick as green as he is

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

My best guess is that it wouldn’t be a very hard decision.

Stutzle is from my POV closer to Laf than Byfield is to Stutzle. 2 of 10 teams interviewed by McKenzie had Byfield outside the top 5. Byfield hasn’t taken those final steps in his development. He is a big kid, they won’t start to play hockey in the junior leagues until they can get 50% of the spectators in. He has no organized practices to take part in right now as far as I know. It’s important time for these kids to develop during.

Byfield is an amazing package. But at the same time, it’s a huge challenge for him to take those last steps to become a top NHL player. You must be able to skate as well as anyone.

Stutzle is special IMO. I like him a lot more than Hirscher to be honest. You have to bet on someone and I can’t argue against that we have to bet on Laf against the information we have to predict the future on. But to put it like this, I don’t mind that NJD don’t have No 2 in this draft...

Yeah me too.

Byfield will play as long as he stays healthy. Guys who are that big, fast and work as hard as he does will carve out a long career in this league one way or another. For the upside alone, I personally wouldn't rank him out side of the top 5 (or 4) but if you go back and look at these project picks who either don't pan out or don't completely put it together, the thing that holds them back is almost always hockey sense.

I would be mildly surprised if he became the best player to come out of this draft but I wouldn't be at all surprised if Perfetti and Rossi end up becoming better players than Byfield, if that makes sense.