Legit. As in produces top line production. That is pretty legit. As in no matter how you slice and dice it, top line production. Debated where in the bell curve, sure. But non-debateable that it is top line production.
Isn't that what he is for the Rangers? Seems to be there is another left wing that is ahead of him on the depth charts.
Maybe. But if he slides down to the third line in the last several years of his deal, then it is money well spent. And if circumstances cause him to slide down earlier and he is still productive (being the best net front presence in the NHL means something) then it is still money well spent.
But can he first step a toe onto NHL ice before this is being discussed as an issue?
I didn't say that. But first of all, the length of time that they can spend here can vary. They may well be here for far longer than you believe.
No, but between the various insiders here and folks that know prospects far, far better than you and I, my suspicion is that they view it far differently than you .
Feels way closer than most years. I wonder if that is just this draft class has or hasn’t lived up to expectations in equal parts towards the top of it or if it has something to do with the season ending early, or maybe bits of both"With that said my way too early top 10 of 2020....
1. LW: Alexis Lafreniere
2. C/LW: Anton Lundell
3. RW: Lucas Raymond
4. C: Quinton Byfield
5. LW/RW: Alexander Holtz
6. C: Cole Perfetti
7. D: Jamie Drysdale
8. LW/RW: Noel Gunler
9. C: Marco Rossi
10. C: Dylan Holloway
Best goalie is Yaroslav Askarov!!"
I love to bring this up usually a week before the draft to compare and contrast with what I predicted a year ago (always for fun). Crazy to think last year this was my preliminary guess for the top 10. I have to say, I didn't do too bad. The only thing I missed on big was Stutzle, but I forgot Stutzle was ranked in the early teens before the season started. Lundell and Raymond fell, but I do think Lundell could still sneak into that top 5 somehow (depending on team's lists).
Any thoughts?
Feels way closer than most years. I wonder if that is just this draft class has or hasn’t lived up to expectations in equal parts towards the top of it or if it has something to do with the season ending early, or maybe bits of both
First of all a first liner is a first liner. Second of all, he is faaaaar from being the worst top line left wing in the NHL.Well that's kind of the thing of it, isn't it? Being the worst first liner in the league wouldn't be a good thing necessarily, if that's where you were slotted.
Wow. We have now gone to Kreider being a "decent" option on a second line. #KreiderDerangementSyndromeSure. My problem is not with Kreider being our second best left wing if that was the clear path forward. I think Kreider as your second line left winger is probably a decent option for a contending team, though I'd also bet that most of the very best teams have more than 2 wingers better than Kreider (and I'm hoping the Rangers are aspiring to build one of the "very best teams," and not settle for second round playoff exits).
Sp your problem is a first line player playing on the first line? Or is this a case where it is not enough to simply be a top line player, you now need to be a super top line player to play on the top line?My problem would be Kreider being our best left wing (a 52 point first liner is sub optimal and I've already seen the version of the Rangers where their best scorers get 50-something points, I'm not interested in that again). Luckily he's not that anymore.
No one is burying anything in the sand. If you look back at when the contract was signed, I stated multiple times that chances are the last several years he will probably slide down to the third line. I was fine with that then and I am more than fine with that now.But what he is, is likely to be very expensive for being our THIRD best left wing. And unless you are burying your head in the sand in deliberate ignorance, you are forced to acknowledge that this is about to happen and you should plan all your moves around it.... that Lafreniere and Panarin are about to be your two best LWs.
First you want depth. Then you complain about having to pay for depth. Can't really have it both ways.And on top of that, he's also likely to be very expensive for being our 5th or 6th scorer in general (because despite your insistence that we only count the left wings ahead of him, salary cap management insists that we count all the wingers and forwards who are better than him, since they will also have to be paid).
There are three players on your list that have never played one second of NHL time, one is not even in North America. There are also 4 players still on ECLs. There is another who played center who has really yet to show anything material at the NHL level. You have another that has not even been drafted yet. Sounds to me like this worry is a bit of St. Elmo's fire.It's money well spent if it doesn't prohibit us from obtaining or retaining someone else we need more. In a limitless cap universe obviously having Kreider on your third line is an amazing value.
In a world where we are paying Panarin and Trouba big dollars already, and will have to during the life of Kreider's 7 year deal pay also: Lafreniere, Kakko, Shesterkin, Fox, Zibanejad, and probably also a few of Miller, Kravtsov, Chytil, Lindgren, DeAngelo, a second line center to be named, Lundkvist, and others, well, that might be money better spent elsewhere.
One of DeAngelo, Strome or Buchnevich will get a long term contract. One will get a medium term contract. One will not be around for long. Does not seem like an issue to me. Nor does it seem like all are being locked into long term deals.The contract is probably survivable if he's the only third liner locked up long term for that money. Giving Strome or Buch that money only to see them also relegated to third line status would not be wise for the long term cap finances of the team (which is why they should be traded sooner rather than later, since they aren't going to want to take short term discounts, but the team would be foolish to give them 4-5-6 year deals for big money that cannot be moved when they are surpassed).
Then don't forget to devise a way to pay for the 2025 first rounder as you are planning for quite a ways down the line. Make sure you figure out who you are trading to make room for said 2025 first rounder and when.No, it can't. Planning ahead is important.
My feelings on Strome and what it will take are well known. I can't regurgitate that again. Pretty much ditto with Buchnevich.Buch and Strome are not going to want to continue to take short term deals coming off 60 and 70 point paces. If we can re-up them for easily movable short term deals, fine, but I do not think that's the wisest course of asset management. I do note obviously that Buch has one more year on his deal.
And I think that Gorton and JD have very much said that and are in fact eyeing the present and the future. They are just not seeing it like you do. Which is where the issue comes in.Many GMs are overly concerned about the present, though, because their jobs depend on it more than the future, so what they would do is not always what should be done. A safer pick like Holloway might be more appealing to someone who needs to sneak into the playoffs to save their job rather than someone trying to build a legit cup contender. That is one of the things that has been so refreshing about the Gorton/JD post Sather era.
For once we were able to say "We don't care about the present, let's make the future the best it can be, and make that the #1 priority."
Are we back to this again? Playoff teams do not trade production for futures. Just not happening. Nor should it. Unless Gorton has no choice in the matter, those players are NOT getting for futures. This has been repeated over and over and over again.And trading out assets who are not all that appealing as top 6ers (like Strome, or like a projected to-be-surpassed Buchnevich, or Kreider before he got his long term deal; he's here to stay now) is how you smartly trade some of the present for a better future.
"With that said my way too early top 10 of 2020....
1. LW: Alexis Lafreniere
2. C/LW: Anton Lundell
3. RW: Lucas Raymond
4. C: Quinton Byfield
5. LW/RW: Alexander Holtz
6. C: Cole Perfetti
7. D: Jamie Drysdale
8. LW/RW: Noel Gunler
9. C: Marco Rossi
10. C: Dylan Holloway
Best goalie is Yaroslav Askarov!!"
I love to bring this up usually a week before the draft to compare and contrast with what I predicted a year ago (always for fun). Crazy to think last year this was my preliminary guess for the top 10. I have to say, I didn't do too bad. The only thing I missed on big was Stutzle, but I forgot Stutzle was ranked in the early teens before the season started. Lundell and Raymond fell, but I do think Lundell could still sneak into that top 5 somehow (depending on team's lists).
Any thoughts?
Pretty good, actually. Aside from Gunler and Holloway (and the omission of Steutzle), you pretty much nailed the general consensus top-10 players in this class.
But I don't think Lundell goes top-5. I can't see how he goes before Lafreniere, Byfield, Steutzle, Drysdale, Sanderson, Holtz, Raymond, Perfetti, Rossi, and possibly Jack Quinn and Askarov.
"With that said my way too early top 10 of 2020....
1. LW: Alexis Lafreniere
2. C/LW: Anton Lundell
3. RW: Lucas Raymond
4. C: Quinton Byfield
5. LW/RW: Alexander Holtz
6. C: Cole Perfetti
7. D: Jamie Drysdale
8. LW/RW: Noel Gunler
9. C: Marco Rossi
10. C: Dylan Holloway
Best goalie is Yaroslav Askarov!!"
I love to bring this up usually a week before the draft to compare and contrast with what I predicted a year ago (always for fun). Crazy to think last year this was my preliminary guess for the top 10. I have to say, I didn't do too bad. The only thing I missed on big was Stutzle, but I forgot Stutzle was ranked in the early teens before the season started. Lundell and Raymond fell, but I do think Lundell could still sneak into that top 5 somehow (depending on team's lists).
Any thoughts?
I would not be shocked if Lundell goes top-5, or 15th. This top of the draft can really go in 100 different directions.
I think the first round of this year's draft will have even more variance from the general consensus than it usually does. Getting to watch overseas draft eligibles start what would technically be their d+1 will sway some opinions, even if people say it shouldn't.
Seriously, outside of the top 3 picks, this thing is wide open.
I won't know for certain until post-draft, but I know of one team that has Lundell fifth/sixth and at least two more that have in him in the top 10.
I can also tell you that I know of one team that has Lundell 16th.
First of all a first liner is a first liner. Second of all, he is faaaaar from being the worst top line left wing in the NHL.
Wow. We have now gone to Kreider being a "decent" option on a second line. #KreiderDerangementSyndrome
Sp your problem is a first line player playing on the first line? Or is this a case where it is not enough to simply be a top line player, you now need to be a super top line player to play on the top line?
No one is burying anything in the sand. If you look back at when the contract was signed, I stated multiple times that chances are the last several years he will probably slide down to the third line. I was fine with that then and I am more than fine with that now.
First you want depth. Then you complain about having to pay for depth. Can't really have it both ways.
"With that said my way too early top 10 of 2020....
1. LW: Alexis Lafreniere
2. C/LW: Anton Lundell
3. RW: Lucas Raymond
4. C: Quinton Byfield
5. LW/RW: Alexander Holtz
6. C: Cole Perfetti
7. D: Jamie Drysdale
8. LW/RW: Noel Gunler
9. C: Marco Rossi
10. C: Dylan Holloway
Best goalie is Yaroslav Askarov!!"
I love to bring this up usually a week before the draft to compare and contrast with what I predicted a year ago (always for fun). Crazy to think last year this was my preliminary guess for the top 10. I have to say, I didn't do too bad. The only thing I missed on big was Stutzle, but I forgot Stutzle was ranked in the early teens before the season started. Lundell and Raymond fell, but I do think Lundell could still sneak into that top 5 somehow (depending on team's lists).
Any thoughts?
Aside from C, seems like the next position where we really lack depth in the farm is RD. Any guys you like in the later round? Maybe an over-ager like Alex Cotton or a POS like Mitch Miller? I assume guys like Barron and Niema will be gone in the first two rounds.
You should be Bob McKenzie's successor![]()
Honestly, if I could make what I'm earning, and do it talking hockey all day, there's part of me that would gladly do it.
But there's a reason why I never wanted to be a scout, and eventually moved on to do my own things in the business world.
Aside from C, seems like the next position where we really lack depth in the farm is RD. Any guys you like in the later round? Maybe an over-ager like Alex Cotton or a POS like Mitch Miller? I assume guys like Barron and Niema will be gone in the first two rounds.
Aside from C, seems like the next position where we really lack depth in the farm is RD...
Whaaaaaaaaaaa
Whaaaaaaaaaaa