Maybe khl is bad for russia. When a tiny country like sweden has more nhl players something is wrong.
WC: 2017 Team Russia
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Fantomas
Registered User
- Aug 7, 2012
- 13,810
- 7,665
Been staing away this forum fore some hours just to keep a litle distant from the game today and then take another look at it
Reading all the post now i have only one thing to say :
Come on guys it was 20 min and sadly we took yet again a lot of penalties that took out some energy as it does. Belov beeing out for 12 min did not help either..20 min... we should have won this and all the post would have been about Znarok got the best of them , the KHL won against the NHL and Vasi is the best goalie and so on....think about how different this post would have been
My last reply this year is this :
Russia played for the most part very good and to me our deffence showed huge improvment and also knowing there are young guys coming up the next years it looks very promising
Znarok did very vell with our checking line Telegin and he understand that type of a line is nessesary
The few players with took from NHL did very well Panarin and Kucherov and fitted perfect with the rest of the team
This loss feels really bad but not in the same way like the 2 prevois years...now you just feel that they was better and should have won while last years you just know they were not god enough espesially because of our deffence
I see som Russian posters show very respect for Canada beeing better but i dont see it that way...as said earlier today i am still surpriced to see this Russian team not beating them today. They did not scare me.
Have to say this and dont remember which players said it from Russia but some guys said that " we become nervouse in the 3 periode " If this is true there are som issues that need to be fixed because on this level you should not go out with a 2-0 lead having to play 20 min more and all of a sudden become nervouse..this is maybe on Znarok not doing the right think before the last periode i dont know...
I leave you guys with a good feeling maybe sounding a litle bit strange but i truly belive that Russia now after the Ovi area will do better and that we will win the Olympic and next WC beeing with Znarok or a new coach which maybe is a good thing bringing in something New
Russia will be back, there are positive things happening and there are just to much talent for this team to not come back even if its ofcourse very frustrating right now
Tomorow Sweden will win and it will feels good
Have a Nice summer everyone never give up
I agree with much of what you said, especially about the fact that the young KHL kids played much better than expected and really achieved a lot. Have a very nice summer!!
But it's obvious that KHL defensemen can't play vs big, fast and physical NHLers. As soon as Canadians start to push hard, our KHL defense colapses. They have a talent, they don't have enough experience. Soviet teams played vs NHL teams every year, and not just one game. And Soviet league was much better, than the KHL, where half teams aren't very good even for the AHL.
Alessandro Seren Rosso
Registered User
Were Provorov and Orlov better than others? Hardly. Gavrikov and Kiselevich played better. Orlov sure showed some flashes, but only while attacking.
Well earlier year i was thinking about this as well but like i said this team showed another deffense and it was our KHL players who played well. If we look at just one game yesterday i tought they played the most perfect hockey the first 2 periodes espesially the second and the swedish reporters said that finally Russia played their deffence tight against Canada and that one reporters said he had seen them practice on this the day before AND that if Russia shall get back to be number one again that is how they should play. So players like Gavrikov and Kiselevich and also Antipin was very good. Orlov is flashy and good to just did not played the whole tournament but i dont think he was bad in the last game and . But the point is Russia will have no problem using their KHL deffense against NHL players you could feel that they now understood that this with this team...but again looking just at this game you can not take 3 penalites after eachother in the last periode it will kill you. The only thing i was afraid if before the game against Canada was exactly that ..the penalties. Belov out a lot was devestating and everyting took out the energy. Canada smelled blood and was of course coming at full speed. If you look at the whole tournament Russia was very good and lots of Swedish reporters tought they were to one to win it all because first and foremost because they played so good in deffense. Offensive we are always good (look at the point race in this WC by players) and Russia keep producing talent year after year so dont blackmail everyting Russia did well. If Russia dit not take any penalties in the 3 we would win and EVERYBODY would now be talking about how Russia finally stepped up their deffence shotting out Canada. 20 min guys and that is hockey..
Dumb penalties and the stupid mentality to stop playing and protect a lead cost the team yesterday.
Russia's loss to the US played a key role for the outcome of the tournament, if not for that loss, Russia wouldn't have faced Canada in the semis.
But coach doesnt have to roll the 3rd and 4th line with < 5 minutes to play. Znarok has no idea what hes doing.
Provorov turned 20 in January, he played his first season in the NHL, which is huge jump for any player, let alone for 19/20 years old rookie. He played all 82 games on the Flyers top pairing with a lot of minutes 5on5 and on PK against top NHL players and he looked mostly fantastic.
All other defencemen on Team Russia are older, some of them are significantly older and all of them played LESS games against LESSER competition in the KHL (if we discount Orlov who is also NHL player).
I think it is pretty clear, and understandable that Provorov and his body has to be immensely tired after this jump and amount of games/minutes.
Tkachyov and Plotnikov directly responsible for the loss. Not surprising as we were complaining about Plotnikov before the tournament. He is terrible offensively, terrible defensively. Having no skill is not an excuse to be a penalty killer, sick of hearing it. The 4th line costed Russia late twice, Znarok has no business puting these guys out.
I realize there were PKs in the 3rd but that rests your top lines which is why they should have been double shifted late in the third. If Russia would have kept pressing with Kuznetsov and Gusev line, they probably wouldnt have been pinned in their own end. Instead they go with tired guys like Plotnikov, who is garbage to begin with - predictable ending. You cant simply roll 4 lines late in a game like that. Znarok did a terrible job reacting to that situation.
I realize there were PKs in the 3rd but that rests your top lines which is why they should have been double shifted late in the third. If Russia would have kept pressing with Kuznetsov and Gusev line, they probably wouldnt have been pinned in their own end. Instead they go with tired guys like Plotnikov, who is garbage to begin with - predictable ending. You cant simply roll 4 lines late in a game like that. Znarok did a terrible job reacting to that situation.
Siberian
Registered User
Assuming Russia will finish the game with the win, this was almost perfect tournament for them outside of one period and perhaps a meaningless game against the US. I know Tkachyov made this mistake on goal 2 against Canada but I really liked the way he played the whole tournament. Plotnikov was good at times, I did not think he was that bad, but he could probably be replaced by a lot of players from Russia.
Siberian
Registered User
It is a true fact. I remember the number of Russians in the NHL was hovering around 38 in 15-12 years ago and team Russia had disastrous WC's.
I think Znarok was putting them out because they're more physical and you need such players vs. Canada. But I agree in that he just can't seem to crack Team Canada.
nhl
May be bud on the other hand,they did quite fine at Olympics. And Olympics were best on best tournaments from Nagano, where Russia took silver.
DoubleGold
X2
Our team sucks, why would we cry? Have fun with your Bronze medal.It's a lose-lose situation: if we lose the Bronze game it will be obviously bad, but if we will win it, Finland fans will be whining about corrupt referees like forever and making fake videos about it.
Telegin - really fast, Andronov - tough, strong on the puck. I get those guys. Tkachev and Plotnikov were incredibly soft on the puck and costed the team 2 goals. I dont think much more needs to be said.
Also the idea that you need physical players to play against them is false. Look who did the scoring against teams like US and Canada. It was Gusev-Sipachev line and Kuznetsov-Panarin line, all skill. The 3rd period when Russia collapsed is when we seen Plotnikov among leaders of the forwards in ice time while Sipachev line was mostly on the bench.
Siberian
Registered User
In 1998 Russia was riding on the shoulders of healthy and phenomenal Bure. 2002 was a team that played horrible hockey, just managed to get to bronze somehow, nothing to write home about. Is that what you call fine?
Alright, the Bronze Medal is ours in 2017.
Thoughts about this team? What can be done to improve?
Thoughts about this team? What can be done to improve?
Siberian
Registered User
Good tournament for team Russia, nevertheless. At times the team showed incredible possession and passing game. I was also impressed how the team defended in most of the games, it was really hard to get a good shot against Russia. I know I am in the minority, but I like a lot of newcomers to team Russia and specially loved Andronov's effort, he was irreplaceble on Russia's PK. I think our weakest link is our goaltending which is superbly scouted by NA teams. They know exactly how to score against our NHL goalies, so we also need to develop a depth at the goaltending position, specially to play against Canada and US.
Fantomas
Registered User
- Aug 7, 2012
- 13,810
- 7,665
They did well in Nagano because many of those players were still trained in the Soviet days. They didn't do well because of the NHL.
nhl
But I still think best Russian players should play at NHL to compete with best. Only that way they can improve, and be ready to play against best.
But I still think best Russian players should play at NHL to compete with best. Only that way they can improve, and be ready to play against best.
Alessandro Seren Rosso
Registered User
Well this tournament showed that if we take it with a grain of salt, NHL players can be a good reinforcement, especially if taken from the first game.
