WJC: 2017 Canada Roster Talk - Part 1

[HasbeenHallzy]

Jost - Strome - Gauthier
Steel - Barzal - Speers
Dubois - Nolan - Stephens
Cirelli - McLeod - Roy
Raddish

Chabot - Juulsen
Bean - Myers
Lauzon - Fabbro
Girard

please no Cirelli...

 

[JackSlater]

Yeah, I find that league chemistry never works well when one of the pair is a decent league player but is not a WORLD class player. International play just features more talent on a compressed amount of teams and one of the duo is just clearly in over his head on the world tournament stage and it does not end well at all usually . Hopefully this time it could be a case of both players being capable though.

We'll find out soon enough what Raddysh is. If the chemistry is there with Strome and they can carry it over, then go with that, if not, then leave him behind. Hs only other international experience at u17 wasn't anything to write home about, but you're right, 9 out of 10 times it doesn't work...this could be the 1 instance in which it does.

Yeah, I remember Mackinnon and Drouin being on separate lines (or in Mackinnon's case used as a 13th forward at points). I think it should be accounted for, but Raddysh has clearly earned an invite to this camp on his own merit. The fact he has a teammate at the camp who is a lock to make it, is an added bonus.

I agree with you all. If the chemistry is there, great. Raddysh also deserves an invite as an individual anyway, so it's not a Kunitz situation. My hope is that the management and coaching staff don't pursue and try to force chemistry when there really isn't any. These league pairings often don't work internationally, and as noted above in many cases the players are separated anyway.

 

[SNMU]

bobby macs team

Jost - Strome - Gauthier
Dubois - Barzal - Stephens
? - Roy - Joseph
? - ? - ?
?

Chabot - Juulsen
? - Myers
? - ?
?

Hart
?

 

[JT63]

Jost - Strome - Raddysh
Dubois - Barzal - Stephens
Steel - Patrick - Gauthier
Cirelli - McLeod - Merkley​

If Crouse is loaned, I'd want him with McLeod on the 4th.

 

[86Habs]

I agree with you all. If the chemistry is there, great. Raddysh also deserves an invite as an individual anyway, so it's not a Kunitz situation. My hope is that the management and coaching staff don't pursue and try to force chemistry when there really isn't any. These league pairings often don't work internationally, and as noted above in many cases the players are separated anyway.

I think in this case (Strome + Raddysh) there's a good chance it will work out. The NHL-sized ice surface, the age and experience level of the players, their style of play, and the amount of time spent together at the junior level....this all suggests to me that this could/should be a successful pairing, even though we can all agree that success at the CHL level doesn't always translate to the WJHCs. Raddysh is a player deserving of an invitation in his own right, and him and Strome play complimentary styles - both big bodies for junior (both 6'2", Strome @ ~190 and Raddysh @ ~ 200), both really good possession players, both can find the back of net with Strome obviously the higher-end elite offensive talent. I'd certainly give them a shot together at camp, and I'd try Dubois at LW who fits the size/strength/possession game profile and that adds a good defensive dimension to the line.

Last year Virtanen largely played on Strome's RW and to me there was an obvious mismatch in skillsets between those two players...Virtanen being better off the rush, but impatient and undisciplined in the offensive zone, not really good at cycling despite his size/strength, not really a high-IQ player who can play well off of someone like Strome. I kind of see Julien Gauthier as more of a Virtanen-type of player than a Raddysh-type of player, and I'd be personally prefer to go into camp with Strome + Raddysh as my top line pairing (although, of course at camp all sorts of permutations and combinations can be looked at).

 

[biturbo19]

Guaranteed They aren't going to take both Girard and Mete.

They are battling with each other for a spot.

It'll be interesting to see how that shakes out. I'd agree those two are pretty much going head to head for a spot.

My question though, is whether there even is a real "need" for an offensive/PP specialist if Bean is healthy and on the team.

Between Bean, Chabot, Fabbro being penciled in...you've got 3/4 good PP Defencemen already. Even if they don't opt to go with a 4-Forward set for either PP Unit, there's really still only 1 more spot up for grabs. I think there's a reasonable chance that if they want a LH-RH on each unit, Myers is plenty capable of playing on the PP in that last spot. Clague/Lauzon aren't offensively inept either if one or more of them sticks on the roster.

It's not exactly heavy on shutdown D though.

It almost makes me think they might look at taking more of a defensive/shutdown and PK specialist type - a la Heatherington a while back. Or even just a more all-around jack of all trades type, instead of an offensive specialist this year. At least, that makes sense to me.

Kinda depends on Bean though, as if he's there i think he's the de facto "PP Specialist". But if he's not there...that would obviously open up a need for one.

 

[biturbo19]

I think in this case (Strome + Raddysh) there's a good chance it will work out. The NHL-sized ice surface, the age and experience level of the players, their style of play, and the amount of time spent together at the junior level....this all suggests to me that this could/should be a successful pairing, even though we can all agree that success at the CHL level doesn't always translate to the WJHCs. Raddysh is a player deserving of an invitation in his own right, and him and Strome play complimentary styles - both big bodies for junior (both 6'2", Strome @ ~190 and Raddysh @ ~ 200), both really good possession players, both can find the back of net with Strome obviously the higher-end elite offensive talent. I'd certainly give them a shot together at camp, and I'd try Dubois at LW who fits the size/strength/possession game profile and that adds a good defensive dimension to the line.

Last year Virtanen largely played on Strome's RW and to me there was an obvious mismatch in skillsets between those two players...Virtanen being better off the rush, but impatient and undisciplined in the offensive zone, not really good at cycling despite his size/strength, not really a high-IQ player who can play well off of someone like Strome. I kind of see Julien Gauthier as more of a Virtanen-type of player than a Raddysh-type of player, and I'd be personally prefer to go into camp with Strome + Raddysh as my top line pairing (although, of course at camp all sorts of permutations and combinations can be looked at).

Yeah. I think that's really the strongest argument for Raddysh being on this team. Not only is there some familiarity there...but it also seems to be a skillset/playstyle that meshes with Strome's game. More methodical pace, and a guy who can also play well without the puck on his stick a lot if the offense is going to go through Strome on that line.

Raddysh has also shown that he can work with other skilled players as well, so it's really not just playing with Strome or bust. That's important...other players could have chemistry with Strome as well, so i don't think you can bring a guy just to play with one other guy. There has to be flexibility there.

It's tough though, with all the quality RH shooters and guys who like to play RW in the mix. Taking Raddysh probably means you're not taking a guy like Speers/Merkley/Patrick...who are all very good players and offensive catalysts in their own right and i think could also all fit in well there. Though some injury concerns could make that easier anyway.

Guys like Dubois and Joseph are already going to likely end up playing LW by default as it is. Raddysh playing a top-line RW role just fills up one of the already pretty crowded RW spots...so if he's there, he'd better be worth it. But if it works...it works, and it'd be hard to argue with if the chemistry really is there.


Tough choices to make.

 

[JackSlater]

I think in this case (Strome + Raddysh) there's a good chance it will work out. The NHL-sized ice surface, the age and experience level of the players, their style of play, and the amount of time spent together at the junior level....this all suggests to me that this could/should be a successful pairing, even though we can all agree that success at the CHL level doesn't always translate to the WJHCs. Raddysh is a player deserving of an invitation in his own right, and him and Strome play complimentary styles - both big bodies for junior (both 6'2", Strome @ ~190 and Raddysh @ ~ 200), both really good possession players, both can find the back of net with Strome obviously the higher-end elite offensive talent. I'd certainly give them a shot together at camp, and I'd try Dubois at LW who fits the size/strength/possession game profile and that adds a good defensive dimension to the line.

Last year Virtanen largely played on Strome's RW and to me there was an obvious mismatch in skillsets between those two players...Virtanen being better off the rush, but impatient and undisciplined in the offensive zone, not really good at cycling despite his size/strength, not really a high-IQ player who can play well off of someone like Strome. I kind of see Julien Gauthier as more of a Virtanen-type of player than a Raddysh-type of player, and I'd be personally prefer to go into camp with Strome + Raddysh as my top line pairing (although, of course at camp all sorts of permutations and combinations can be looked at).

I have no problem with Raddysh being considered (or eventually making the team) because he has made his case basically independent of Strome. I am just hoping that the coaching staff doesn't staple them together even if things don't work out early. It's good if their styles mesh, but things still don't always work out internationally. Too many recent examples. If they do work out in terms of chemistry, that should be viewed as a bonus.

It'll be interesting to see how that shakes out. I'd agree those two are pretty much going head to head for a spot.

My question though, is whether there even is a real "need" for an offensive/PP specialist if Bean is healthy and on the team.

Between Bean, Chabot, Fabbro being penciled in...you've got 3/4 good PP Defencemen already. Even if they don't opt to go with a 4-Forward set for either PP Unit, there's really still only 1 more spot up for grabs. I think there's a reasonable chance that if they want a LH-RH on each unit, Myers is plenty capable of playing on the PP in that last spot. Clague/Lauzon aren't offensively inept either if one or more of them sticks on the roster.

It's not exactly heavy on shutdown D though.

It almost makes me think they might look at taking more of a defensive/shutdown and PK specialist type - a la Heatherington a while back. Or even just a more all-around jack of all trades type, instead of an offensive specialist this year. At least, that makes sense to me.

Kinda depends on Bean though, as if he's there i think he's the de facto "PP Specialist". But if he's not there...that would obviously open up a need for one.

Once again I am confused about Bean. I don't see why he is a given after only three games this year and not sniffing the team last year. Girard seems like a better offensive player, though Girard isn't all that special on the PP. Dominant on breakout and in the neutral zone and a great passer, but not a huge shot.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Dubois - Strome - Raddysh
Jost - Barzal - Gauthier
Steel - Roy - Patrick/Senyshyn/Speers
Joseph - McLeod - Stephens
Cirelli

Chabot - Juulsen
Lauzon - Myers
Girard - Fabbro
Clague/Bean

Hart
Ingram

 

[covfefe]

I don't know a lot about the Q players admittedly, but I feel Lauzon has a step ahead just by making it far last year. But then you have 5 guys in Bean/Girard/Clague/Mete/Brisebois battling for just the 3LD spot, so Lauzon's going to feel the crunch from that..

Chabot-Juulsen
Lauzon-Myers
- Fabbro

Five '98 D-men invited to camp is also interesting and a bit out of character for Hockey Canada

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

Thought I would post this though. I personally think Joyce is one of the better-connected writers when it comes to covering the prospect beat, which has an overlap with the WJC. Here is a new piece by him focusing on the Canadian goaltending situations (with comments from an NHL goalie consultant/scout) and him tackling who could be made available from the NHL.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juniors/canadas-world-junior-goaltending-will-better-year/

I liked the goaltending bit and agree with it. I've been liking our goaltending since the season started. I feel Canada had some strong options even before the camp roster was named. I believe Hart will run with the starting job though. I was very impressed with him against Russia.

 

[1Gold Standard]

I think in this case (Strome + Raddysh) there's a good chance it will work out. The NHL-sized ice surface, the age and experience level of the players, their style of play, and the amount of time spent together at the junior level....this all suggests to me that this could/should be a successful pairing, even though we can all agree that success at the CHL level doesn't always translate to the WJHCs. Raddysh is a player deserving of an invitation in his own right, and him and Strome play complimentary styles - both big bodies for junior (both 6'2", Strome @ ~190 and Raddysh @ ~ 200), both really good possession players, both can find the back of net with Strome obviously the higher-end elite offensive talent. I'd certainly give them a shot together at camp, and I'd try Dubois at LW who fits the size/strength/possession game profile and that adds a good defensive dimension to the line.

Last year Virtanen largely played on Strome's RW and to me there was an obvious mismatch in skillsets between those two players...Virtanen being better off the rush, but impatient and undisciplined in the offensive zone, not really good at cycling despite his size/strength, not really a high-IQ player who can play well off of someone like Strome. I kind of see Julien Gauthier as more of a Virtanen-type of player than a Raddysh-type of player, and I'd be personally prefer to go into camp with Strome + Raddysh as my top line pairing (although, of course at camp all sorts of permutations and combinations can be looked at).

and with Dubois's game heating up, it has the potential to be a lethal 1st line. Hopefully they bring the goods, I really don't want to be ripping Strome in every post GDT. I'd like to see elite level tournament winning goaltending for a change...that and better coaching...

 

[JackSlater]

and with Dubois's game heating up, it has the potential to be a lethal 1st line. Hopefully they bring the goods, I really don't want to be ripping Strome in every post GDT. I'd like to see elite level tournament winning goaltending for a change...that and better coaching...

I've watched Dubois several times since he's returned o junior. He's been better than his numbers indicate. Not yet as good as he was during his best stretch last year, but he's not in a Dal Colle situation.

 

[86Habs]

I have no problem with Raddysh being considered (or eventually making the team) because he has made his case basically independent of Strome. I am just hoping that the coaching staff doesn't staple them together even if things don't work out early. It's good if their styles mesh, but things still don't always work out internationally. Too many recent examples. If they do work out in terms of chemistry, that should be viewed as a bonus.

A good start would be giving Strome + Raddysh an opportunity to demonstrate chemistry in the pre-tournament exhibition games. What really irked me last year was Lowry making Strome and Marner healthy scratches for most of the pre-tournament games, which I'm sure contributed to a sense of entitlement amongst a handful of players that unfortunately showed throughout the tournament (ridiculous shift lengths for Marner and Hicketts, undisciplined play from Strome, Virtanen, etc, etc).

Regardless, Raddysh should be able to contribute whether its on Strome's RW or elsewhere in the lineup.

Yeah. I think that's really the strongest argument for Raddysh being on this team. Not only is there some familiarity there...but it also seems to be a skillset/playstyle that meshes with Strome's game. More methodical pace, and a guy who can also play well without the puck on his stick a lot if the offense is going to go through Strome on that line.

Raddysh has also shown that he can work with other skilled players as well, so it's really not just playing with Strome or bust. That's important...other players could have chemistry with Strome as well, so i don't think you can bring a guy just to play with one other guy. There has to be flexibility there.

It's tough though, with all the quality RH shooters and guys who like to play RW in the mix. Taking Raddysh probably means you're not taking a guy like Speers/Merkley/Patrick...who are all very good players and offensive catalysts in their own right and i think could also all fit in well there. Though some injury concerns could make that easier anyway.

Guys like Dubois and Joseph are already going to likely end up playing LW by default as it is. Raddysh playing a top-line RW role just fills up one of the already pretty crowded RW spots...so if he's there, he'd better be worth it. But if it works...it works, and it'd be hard to argue with if the chemistry really is there.

Tough choices to make.

No, Raddysh is certainly no Kunitz-type of player who is riding someone else's coattails onto the big boy team. I actually don't think the risk/reward on Raddysh is all that high, if he doesn't work out with Strome for whatever reason (or if a better option arises) he could easily drop down to the bottom six and play with a Roy, McLeod, or Joseph. I'd be a little more concerned on the international ice, but I actually think he's a safe bet for this year's tournament. Safer than a guy like Perlini last year, who had some elite-level tools but lacked consistency and wasn't playing up to snuff at the time. For that reason I'd give him the edge over someone like Merkley going in, and of course performance at camp will dictate what happens with Speers and Patrick who would, in normal cases, be strong bets to crack the roster.

 

[Mr Sniper]

Goalie

How do you rate your Goalies this year? Better or worse than a normal year, if you understand what i mean?
I noticed that both Ingman and Hart has some great numbers in the junior League, but I`m from sweden and I have never watch any of these goalies, so I think its very hard for me to rate your goalies, even if the stats is great. So it would be very nice if someone with good knowledge about this guys just can wrote I quick opinion.

Thank you, / A Swedish reader.

 

[biturbo19]

Once again I am confused about Bean. I don't see why he is a given after only three games this year and not sniffing the team last year. Girard seems like a better offensive player, though Girard isn't all that special on the PP. Dominant on breakout and in the neutral zone and a great passer, but not a huge shot.

For me...Bean, if he's actually fully healthy and on top of his game is a guy who is not only a wizard on the PP and moves the puck extremely well, but has more of the all-around chops to play a real "top-4" role.

Whereas Girard, they'd be taking as more of a bottom-pairing, or spare D "specialist" type.

Just makes more sense to me if you can, to take a guy in your Top-4 who can fill that offensive/powerplay D niche as well.

 

[JackSlater]

For me...Bean, if he's actually fully healthy and on top of his game is a guy who is not only a wizard on the PP and moves the puck extremely well, but has more of the all-around chops to play a real "top-4" role.

Whereas Girard, they'd be taking as more of a bottom-pairing, or spare D "specialist" type.

Just makes more sense to me if you can, to take a guy in your Top-4 who can fill that offensive/powerplay D niche as well.

That makes sense, and I agree that Girard would likely be utilized in a seventh defenceman role. With regard to Bean, I'm just generally confused as to why so many view him as a likely top four player when he has been injured essentially all year. It's an opinion held by most people, so I'm thinking that there is something to it. I suppose I can just wait until the camp and see how things shake out then.

 

[covfefe]

For me...Bean, if he's actually fully healthy and on top of his game is a guy who is not only a wizard on the PP and moves the puck extremely well, but has more of the all-around chops to play a real "top-4" role.

Whereas Girard, they'd be taking as more of a bottom-pairing, or spare D "specialist" type.

Just makes more sense to me if you can, to take a guy in your Top-4 who can fill that offensive/powerplay D niche as well.

I think it's fair to say that Bean isn't much to write home about in his own zone. I see him and Girard and Mete in the same vein in terms of this camp. Extremely talented player but he has lots of work to do before being considered much of an all around player

edit: this isn't to group the three in as the 'same' players, just that I see them being in direct competition to one another

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

How do you rate your Goalies this year? Better or worse than a normal year, if you understand what i mean?
I noticed that both Ingman and Hart has some great numbers in the junior League, but I`m from sweden and I have never watch any of these goalies, so I think its very hard for me to rate your goalies, even if the stats is great. So it would be very nice if someone with good knowledge about this guys just can wrote I quick opinion.

Thank you, / A Swedish reader.

Hart is more consistent and cool headed then Blackwood. Last year Blackwood had the potential to steal games but couldn't handle the pressure whereas Carter Hart is more put together mentally. So we'll see a consistent game from Hart beginning to end and usually all on the high end as well. I'm confident in this years goaltending compared to last WJC.

 

[Mr Sniper]

Hart is more consistent and cool headed then Blackwood. Last year Blackwood had the potential to steal games but couldn't handle the pressure whereas Carter Hart is more put together mentally. So we'll see a consistent game from Hart beginning to end and usually all on the high end as well. I'm confident in this years goaltending compared to last WJC.

Thank you mate.

 

[4thline]

I think it's fair to say that Bean isn't much to write home about in his own zone. I see him and Girard and Mete in the same vein in terms of this camp. Extremely talented player but he has lots of work to do before being considered much of an all around player

edit: this isn't to group the three in as the 'same' players, just that I see them being in direct competition to one another

Eh, I've always had a bit of a love on for Mete but I think he gets unfairly judged as small and fast = bad in his own zone. he's surprisingly good in the corners and has a decent stick to go with his mobility.

 

[covfefe]

Eh, I've always had a bit of a love on for Mete but I think he gets unfairly judged as small and fast = bad in his own zone. he's surprisingly good in the corners and has a decent stick to go with his mobility.

That's why I edited my post. Didn't mean to imply that since Mete is small, he is by extension bad in his own zone (and hope not as I'm a Habs fan). I see them in direct competition to one another for 3LD in this camp with Chabot a lock and Lauzon likely penciled in.

 

[Canada4Gold]

That's why I edited my post. Didn't mean to imply that since Mete is small, he is by extension bad in his own zone (and hope not as I'm a Habs fan). I see them in direct competition to one another for 3LD in this camp with Chabot a lock and Lauzon likely penciled in.

You can have 1 as a 3rd pairing LD and the other(Girard) as the 7th defenseman in an Ellis type of role on the PP. They aren't necessarily fighting for the same spot even if you slot other guys on the first 2 pairings.

and even then there's only 3 RD at camp, so in the case all 3 doesn't make it there's probably a spot on the right side for a LD as well.

 

[biturbo19]

That makes sense, and I agree that Girard would likely be utilized in a seventh defenceman role. With regard to Bean, I'm just generally confused as to why so many view him as a likely top four player when he has been injured essentially all year. It's an opinion held by most people, so I'm thinking that there is something to it. I suppose I can just wait until the camp and see how things shake out then.

Yeah. I think it's fair to wonder a bit with Bean having missed so much time this year, if he's going to be in top form or not. But if he is, i think he has to be there...and most likely in the Top-4.

 

[covfefe]

You can have 1 as a 3rd pairing LD and the other(Girard) as the 7th defenseman in an Ellis type of role on the PP. They aren't necessarily fighting for the same spot even if you slot other guys on the first 2 pairings.

and even then there's only 3 RD at camp, so in the case all 3 doesn't make it there's probably a spot on the right side for a LD as well.

Entirely possible that it plays out that way as well.

I do think that HC is increasingly tending to balance their D according to handedness so I think, barring meltdown, it's Juulsen-Myers/Fabbro on the right.

It would also be unlike HC to have 50% of their D as 98 birth-years with another year of eligibility. By the same token, there are 5 of each year in camp, so maybe they are trying a new direction this year..

Will be interesting to see how the team plays out, one bonus is that we actually have a premier goalie for the first time in a while