2017-18 Around the League

[S E P H]

2010-on was that part of the discussion. The Avs struck gold in 2009... beyond that, it gets pretty rough with what they have been able to accomplish since 2004. 07 had Galiardi and 06 had Stastny. That is really about it.



By no means am I saying the Oilers are great at producing later picks... they aren't. Outside of 2009 (which seems to be a fluke as much as anything), the Avs have flat out sucked at it since 04. A few hits and some of them great (ROR, Stastny and Barrie)... but no real quality either. Outside the top 10, the Avs haven't produced passable NHLers on a consistent basis. The Oilers have at least produced some NHLers and at a higher rate than the Avs. They haven't had the ROR or Barrie hits, but the Oilers have the Eberle and Klefbom late 1st that the Avs can't hit on. 6 of one, half dozen of another. I think you could argue either one as better or worse and it really doesn't matter because both suck.

I don't think Avs have been in that position enough to judge them. Yes, the only two later rounds turned out to be Bleackley and Hishon, however, under Hepple we simply do not have the history or information to know if he's Pracey bad or if he's better (do think Hishon's injury eventually made him a bust IMO). At least Avs fired their head scout, if I remember all the Oilers did was demote their ex-head scout and promoted somebody else while keeping their ex-head scout (lateral move at best). Maple Leafs if I remember fired like 15 or so of their scouts.

So far, we can only conclude with non-1st round picks and thus far they've been different and more across the globe. Not a fan of all of them, but definitely an upgrade to what Pracey was giving us.

Elite Prospects - Players drafted by Colorado Avalanche
Just compare 2014 and 2015 and see the contrast in quality (disregard Rantanen) even if majority of them won't become NHLers.

 

[dahrougem2]

Zdeno Chara re-ups in Boston. 1 year, 5M. I thought he was finished, but he's looked fantastic this season.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Zdeno Chara re-ups in Boston. 1 year, 5M. I thought he was finished, but he's looked fantastic this season.

I remember the last couple seasons his skating was pretty bad, coupled with being hurt. But this year, the little I’ve seen of him, his skating looks waayyyy better plus he’s still incredible on the PK.

 

[henchman21]

I don't think Avs have been in that position enough to judge them. Yes, the only two later rounds turned out to be Bleackley and Hishon, however, under Hepple we simply do not have the history or information to know if he's Pracey bad or if he's better (do think Hishon's injury eventually made him a bust IMO). At least Avs fired their head scout, if I remember all the Oilers did was demote their ex-head scout and promoted somebody else while keeping their ex-head scout (lateral move at best). Maple Leafs if I remember fired like 15 or so of their scouts.

So far, we can only conclude with non-1st round picks and thus far they've been different and more across the globe. Not a fan of all of them, but definitely an upgrade to what Pracey was giving us.

Elite Prospects - Players drafted by Colorado Avalanche
Just compare 2014 and 2015 and see the contrast in quality (disregard Rantanen) even if majority of them won't become NHLers.

And I think it is pretty unfair to judge drafts until 3-5 years after (with some obvious exceptions). Yeah, the Avs have taken steps to correct the issue, but the grade is still very incomplete on what has been happening since 2015. What we can say is that Avs hit a home run in 2009, and beyond that results since 2003 have been very similar, if not worse than Edmonton.

Edmonton since 2015 has gathered some decent prospects too... 2015 they got Jones and Bear who look good. In 2016 I have grown to like Benson a good amount. In 2017 I really like Skinner, Safin, and Maksimov... They look to have as much promise as the Avs later round crew.

All I am saying is that Avs fans should look in the mirror before railing on Edmonton's scouting. They have both been bad and need improvement. Both have shown some signs, but have to prove a lot still.

 

[Foppberg]

I remember the last couple seasons his skating was pretty bad, coupled with being hurt. But this year, the little I’ve seen of him, his skating looks waayyyy better plus he’s still incredible on the PK.

I think I read an article on The Athletic about how he revamped his diet and he feels 100x times better.

Er no, the Boston Globe.

Zdeno Chara’s new plant-based diet is paying off on the ice - The Boston Globe

 

[Tommy Shelby]

I'm probably in the minority here but I couldn't give less of a damn about McDavid's late-season surge.

I'd be more impressed if it wasn't in meaningless garbage time games.

 

[Pokecheque]

The crazy thing about Edmonton's poor drafting is, you'd think maybe they would've parlayed some of their high-end talent into depth/futures, which the Avalanche have attempted with both the Duchene and O'Reilly deals. Nope. They have a guy in charge who, despite his Harvard Law education, prefers to just do 1-for-1 deals, and so traded away two former first rounders who happened to be their two best scoring wingers for two mediocre players.

So yes, the Avs drafting up until recently was a tire fire, but at least they have made efforts to rectify that. Edmonton seems to think they can fix the issue internally. So the criticism isn't too off-base. They dr

The one draft that sticks in my craw is 2014. For them to come out with absolutely NOTHING from that first Roy-era draft is just inexcusable. They'll be paying for that one for years to come.

My view is that if you come out with one good player in a draft that doesn't include a lottery pick, that's bare minimum, if you get two, that's good, anything beyond that is just gravy. I guess the good news is that his first draft (2015) we can likely write off only two players thus far (Mironov and Olhaver). Only time will tell if those drafts pan out, there's reason to be optimistic at least.

 

[Avs_19]

It must be really tough for Coyotes fans to watch Marner and probably another 10+ guys from the 2015 draft.

Cool story on Sportsnet about the Sakic curve and how many players still use it today.

 

[dahrougem2]

The crazy thing about Edmonton's poor drafting is, you'd think maybe they would've parlayed some of their high-end talent into depth/futures, which the Avalanche have attempted with both the Duchene and O'Reilly deals. Nope. They have a guy in charge who, despite his Harvard Law education, prefers to just do 1-for-1 deals, and so traded away two former first rounders who happened to be their two best scoring wingers for two mediocre players.

So yes, the Avs drafting up until recently was a tire fire, but at least they have made efforts to rectify that. Edmonton seems to think they can fix the issue internally. So the criticism isn't too off-base. They dr

The one draft that sticks in my craw is 2014. For them to come out with absolutely NOTHING from that first Roy-era draft is just inexcusable. They'll be paying for that one for years to come.

My view is that if you come out with one good player in a draft that doesn't include a lottery pick, that's bare minimum, if you get two, that's good, anything beyond that is just gravy. I guess the good news is that his first draft (2015) we can likely write off only two players thus far (Mironov and Olhaver). Only time will tell if those drafts pan out, there's reason to be optimistic at least.

Saw a list of players on television earlier today that showed the list of good-to-great players Chiarelli has traded away since becoming a GM:

Phil Kessel, Tyler Seguin, Taylor Hall, Jordan Eberle, Johnny Boychuk, and Justin Schultz. He also traded away picks that turned into Rickard Rakell and Mathew Barzal.

He'll probably try to trade Oscar Klefbom this summer for some shot blocking defensemen lol.

 

[cgf]

He'll probably try to trade Oscar Klefbom this summer for some shot blocking defensemen lol.

I think we've got one of those laying around somewhere...

 

[Tommy Shelby]

I think we've got one of those laying around somewhere...

Honestly I wouldn't even be surprised to see him make that swap, and justify it based on Nemeth's +/- and shot blocks stats.

 

[dahrougem2]

Markus Nutivaara signed a 4 year, 10.8M extension with Columbus. That would have been a real nice contract to give to Zadorov but I don't know if he would have accepted that length.

 

[Foppberg]

I still prefer his 2 year contract. At the end of his current deal there's still potential for getting a solid long term contract for him, at the end of a 4 year deal that's much less so.

 

[S E P H]

And I think it is pretty unfair to judge drafts until 3-5 years after (with some obvious exceptions). Yeah, the Avs have taken steps to correct the issue, but the grade is still very incomplete on what has been happening since 2015. What we can say is that Avs hit a home run in 2009, and beyond that results since 2003 have been very similar, if not worse than Edmonton.

Edmonton since 2015 has gathered some decent prospects too... 2015 they got Jones and Bear who look good. In 2016 I have grown to like Benson a good amount. In 2017 I really like Skinner, Safin, and Maksimov... They look to have as much promise as the Avs later round crew.

All I am saying is that Avs fans should look in the mirror before railing on Edmonton's scouting. They have both been bad and need improvement. Both have shown some signs, but have to prove a lot still.

The entire exchange I am trying to present here is that the Avs were appalling to the same level of the Oilers and made corrections such as firing their head scout. As I've said in the past, that could have been the best move Roy did under his tenure here. What have the Oilers done since us firing Pracey? Only readjusting the chairs even...

 

[henchman21]

The entire exchange I am trying to present here is that the Avs were appalling to the same level of the Oilers and made corrections such as firing their head scout. As I've said in the past, that could have been the best move Roy did under his tenure here. What have the Oilers done since us firing Pracey? Only readjusting the chairs even...

I don't disagree that the Avs have tried to make changes, we don't know yet if they will work out. Though I think they at least got one gem of a scout.

The Oilers have made a lot more changes than you are giving them credit for. MacGregor (their head amateur scout from 2007 to 2015) was completely canned (he's currently the GM at Kamloops). Davis and Hawley (two guys that had a lot of power in their process) were also let go at the same time. They have brought in 9 new amatuer scouts since 2015... way more than the Avs. They even have a guy exclusively in Russia for them now (Sasha Naurov).

 

[S E P H]

I don't disagree that the Avs have tried to make changes, we don't know yet if they will work out. Though I think they at least got one gem of a scout.

The Oilers have made a lot more changes than you are giving them credit for. MacGregor (their head amateur scout from 2007 to 2015) was completely canned (he's currently the GM at Kamloops). Davis and Hawley (two guys that had a lot of power in their process) were also let go at the same time. They have brought in 9 new amatuer scouts since 2015... way more than the Avs. They even have a guy exclusively in Russia for them now (Sasha Naurov).

I wish you told me that sooner , I didn't know they got rid of MacGregor, I thought they just reshuffled him back into the pack. Ahhh it makes much more sense why I think their 2017 class is pretty good, it is the total opposite of what they were drafting.

Agreed with the Avs point though, that was one my main arguments that we can't really say if the Avs suck or not. We have definitely should have a pretty deep AHL squad next year with Av picks even though it still would lack a couple of top calibre forwards.

 

[Pokecheque]

I don't disagree that the Avs have tried to make changes, we don't know yet if they will work out. Though I think they at least got one gem of a scout.

The Oilers have made a lot more changes than you are giving them credit for. MacGregor (their head amateur scout from 2007 to 2015) was completely canned (he's currently the GM at Kamloops). Davis and Hawley (two guys that had a lot of power in their process) were also let go at the same time. They have brought in 9 new amatuer scouts since 2015... way more than the Avs. They even have a guy exclusively in Russia for them now (Sasha Naurov).

Deck chairs on the Titanic. They never completely shoved the guys out of the room they needed to (Lowe and MacTavish). And now that they have Gretzky in there, it's likely those two will just find their way back into positions of power.

They got a lot of praise for getting a guy who wasn't one of the "Boys on the Bus," but really, they just ended up hiring a guy who thinks exactly like they do. It doesn't matter who they hire to scout and evaluate talent so long as the guys making the big decisions are still stuck in the 1980s.

 

[Avs_19]

The best team in the NHL will be adding Eeli Tolvanen to their lineup this weekend. That's easily the bandwagon team for me if the Avs don't make it or once they're eliminated.

 

[henchman21]

Kind of crazy that a 30th pick gets a max ELC not even a year after he was drafted. Still shocked he dropped like he did.

 

[Pokecheque]

If the Avs are out I am fully on board for Team Vindication, Devils (Hall) and Subban (Predators). I want both players to absolutely stick it to their former clubs.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

Blackhawks lose A. Forsberg in warmups. Kid that was supposed to start tomorrow night vs. The Avs gets hurt in the 3rd, and they have to play their emergency goalie, Scott Foster. He goes 7 for 7, Hawks beat Jets 6-2, and Foster named 1st star. LOL.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Blackhawks lose A. Forsberg in warmups. Kid that was supposed to start tomorrow night vs. The Avs gets hurt in the 3rd, and they have to play their emergency goalie, Scott Foster. He goes 7 for 7, Hawks beat Jets 6-2, and Foster named 1st star. LOL.

God I hope that is Winnipeg putting up a stinker, and not Chicago heating up.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

Haven't had Towes for last four games, and are 2-1-1.

Lost to Vancouver 5-2, but then beat NYI 3-1, lost to SJ in a SO, 4-3, and hammered The Jets tonight 6-2.

 

[Balthazar]

Blackhawks lose A. Forsberg in warmups. Kid that was supposed to start tomorrow night vs. The Avs gets hurt in the 3rd, and they have to play their emergency goalie, Scott Foster. He goes 7 for 7, Hawks beat Jets 6-2, and Foster named 1st star. LOL.

Good stuff. Dude is a 36 year old accountant.

 

[landy92mack29]

Hatty for Dubois.