Prospect Info: 2015 Leafs Board Prospect Ranking #16

[LV*]

Korostelev, Timoshav, Dzeirkals all have 2nd line potential; more than Rupert, Bailey, Hyman, and backup goalies.

Even Verheaghe is projected as a 3rd line Center, which is higher than Bailey and Rupert.

Yeah I like all three of them but you've only seen one play so yea

 

[pedis]

Soshnikov here again, but it looks like its gonna be Finn, so hopefully him in the next poll

 

[Leafs at Knight]

Yeah I like all three of them but you've only seen one play so yea

So we only vote for players if we've seen them play ?

How many times have you seen Soshnikov ?

 

[TNCHL]

Voted Soshnikov but don't sleep on dzierkals .

 

[ATBLeafsTyler]

Voted Soshnikov but don't sleep on dzierkals .

Dzierkals should go soon. I have a feeling people will pick Timashov and Korostelev first. This because people haven't seen a lot of Dzierkals.

That aside, I have faith in the management in their decision to select him in the third round. They said his name was floating around at that point so they felt they had to select him. That and he is extremely skilled with top 6 potential.

 

[Moonman]

Sam Carrick.

 

[shelf]

Korostelev, Timoshav, Dzeirkals all have 2nd line potential; more than Rupert, Bailey, Hyman, and backup goalies.

Even Verheaghe is projected as a 3rd line Center, which is higher than Bailey and Rupert.

Id say Sparks still has #1 potential. Guy tore apart the ECHL and lots of good goalies have spent time in the ECHL. Dubnyk, Neuvirth, Khudobin, Scrivens, Hutchinson, Holtby, Talbot, Reimer, Stalock, Greiss, Quick, Kuemper, Montoya.

 

[NotSince67*]

I think it's obvious by now I voted Carrick.

 

[Rielly4]

I dont see how it can be Finn here...

I like Lindgren Soshnikov and Timashov a lot better potential wise. Wayy higher ceilings and its just as unlikely at this point Finn reaches his ceiling then they reach theres.

 

[mikebel111*]

I dont see how it can be Finn here...

I like Lindgren Soshnikov and Timashov a lot better potential wise. Wayy higher ceilings and its just as unlikely at this point Finn reaches his ceiling then they reach theres.

Okay which is why 2 of those players were late rounders, and Finn was a 2nd round pick.

So yes its easily Finn here

No scout would have those guys above Finn even with a bad pro year by Finn

 

[mikebel111*]

Finn winning this one easily as he should be

No contest at all

 

[WildcatMapleLeafs28]

Korostelev, Timoshav, Dzeirkals all have 2nd line potential; more than Rupert, Bailey, Hyman, and backup goalies.

Even Verheaghe is projected as a 3rd line Center, which is higher than Bailey and Rupert.

Why doesn't Hyman have second line potential ?

 

[Number13]

Finn winning this one easily as he should be

No contest at all

Why? Potential is there, but he hasn't proved anything against pros.

 

[Morgs]

Looks like Finn wins this with about 50%

1. Mitch Marner -- 81.22%
2. William Nylander -- 97.50%
3. Kasperi Kapanen -- 51.18%
4. Connor Brown -- 80.00%
5. Stuart Percy -- 28.67%
6. Frederick Gauthier -- 29.64%
7. Andreas Johnson -- 32.43%
8. Jeremy Bracco -- 37.30 %
9. Travis Dermott -- 37.69%
10. Brendan Leipsic -- 40.74%
11. Scott Harrington -- 65.07%
12. Victor Loov -- 46.67%
13. Josh Leivo -- 36.84%
14. Rinat Valiev -- 40.94%
15. Antoine Bibeau -- 31.49%
16 Matt Finn -- 50%-ish

They're sort of in tiers...

-- Potential Elite player
Mitch Marner
-- Potential 1st line player
William Nylander
-- Potential 2nd/3rd line core player
Kasperi Kapanen
Connor Brown
-- Potential depth players (4th-6th Defencemen, 3rd/4th liners)
Stuart Percy
Frederick Gauthier
Andreas Johnson
Jeremy Bracco
Travis Dermott
Brendan Leipsic
Scott Harrington
-- Potential low end NHL regulars
Victor Loov
Josh Leivo
Rinat Valiev
Antoine Bibeau
Matt Finn
--

Ends up looking like....

xxxx - Marner - Nylander
xxxx - xxxx - Kapanen/Connor
Johnson/Bracco - Gauthier - Kapanen/Connor
Leipsic - xxxx - xxxx

Rielly - xxxx
Percy/Dermott - xxxx
Dermott/Harrington - xxxx

xxxx
Bibeau


Obviously need help on RD and LW and need some C help

Personally think you're undervaluing these players

 

[Stringer Bell]

I'm not sure Finn would even go in the first five rounds of a redraft...maybe even go undrafted. There's a reason he's dropped so much in our rankings, and it isn't simply because of increased depth and a down year. It was more than a down year. Leivo's year was a down year. Finn's year exposed how far behind his skating really is. There's a huge gap between the CHL and the AHL, and just as big of a gap between the AHL and the NHL.

He has everything but skating, but skating is HUGE. This is why players who rip junior up should almost never be put ahead of a player in a prospect ranking before a player who has proven to be able to play in the AHL. Obviously there are extenuating circumstances like Marner, but it's a reason why so many people weren't ready to get excited about Brown for instance until they saw what he could do at the AHL level.

Until Finn can prove to be a capable player at the AHL level throughout an entire year, he doesn't belong anywhere near Carrick, Granberg, Soshnikov and even Ryan Rupert.

Finn would have to jump about 3 years development in a one year time to look like he could even play an NHL game in his career.

You guys seem to be really underestimating how serious of an issue and hurdle this is for him. He didn't simply have a down year...he got exposed for how weak of a prospect he really is (at this current time at least).

 

[Bullseye]

He has everything but skating

I don't think anyone who has watched Finn would disagree with you but he did not have everything last year - by his own admission he lacked physical fitness and health. He was injured significantly twice - and I remember him leaving Rookie Camp after scrimmage after Broll hit him. I think it was a groin or a knee issue last summer.

He also battled mono for a significant part of his post draft year in Guelph. His skating was horrible but he's been working at it and his performance will be a litmus for all those that claim 'skating can be fixed by working more with Barb'

Finn deserves a proper retry this season before being thrown under the bus.

 

[Morgs]

I'm not sure Finn would even go in the first five rounds of a redraft...maybe even go undrafted. There's a reason he's dropped so much in our rankings, and it isn't simply because of increased depth and a down year. It was more than a down year. Leivo's year was a down year. Finn's year exposed how far behind his skating really is. There's a huge gap between the CHL and the AHL, and just as big of a gap between the AHL and the NHL.

He has everything but skating, but skating is HUGE. This is why players who rip junior up should almost never be put ahead of a player in a prospect ranking before a player who has proven to be able to play in the AHL. Obviously there are extenuating circumstances like Marner, but it's a reason why so many people weren't ready to get excited about Brown for instance until they saw what he could do at the AHL level.

Until Finn can prove to be a capable player at the AHL level throughout an entire year, he doesn't belong anywhere near Carrick, Granberg, Soshnikov and even Ryan Rupert.

Finn would have to jump about 3 years development in a one year time to look like he could even play an NHL game in his career.

You guys seem to be really underestimating how serious of an issue and hurdle this is for him. He didn't simply have a down year...he got exposed for how weak of a prospect he really is (at this current time at least).

I'm not ready to give up on him yet. Might be a hurdle, but it was also his first pro season. You think Detroit gave up on Mantha after his bad year? Give it time, he's only 21 years old. He has the hockey IQ in both ends of the ice to get through this with hard work.

 

[Stringer Bell]

I'm not ready to give up on him yet. Might be a hurdle, but it was also his first pro season. You think Detroit gave up on Mantha after his bad year? Give it time, he's only 21 years old. He has the hockey IQ in both ends of the ice to get through this with hard work.

See, Mantha's year wasn't very bad. It was just disappointing. His production wasn't as high as many thought it would be. But Finn looked like he didn't belong. There's a big difference.

And I'm not ready to give up on anyone. I'm just being realistic.

If Finn put up 0 points in 80 games with the Marlies but skated like he belonged, his future would look better than what it does right now. It's not about the points.

 

[Leaf Lander]

Granberg

 

[BertCorbeau]

See, Mantha's year wasn't very bad. It was just disappointing. His production wasn't as high as many thought it would be. But Finn looked like he didn't belong. There's a big difference.

And I'm not ready to give up on anyone. I'm just being realistic.

If Finn put up 0 points in 80 games with the Marlies but skated like he belonged, his future would look better than what it does right now. It's not about the points.

Finn dealt with injuries early in the year and after a shortened off-season (from his Mem Cup run with Guelph) he noted in rookie camp earlier this month that he didn't really put a lot of work in over last summer so he was already a bit behind.

IIRC he wasn't that bad after his ECHL stint.

Writing him off after his first pro season is premature, but it does shorten his leash a bit going forward. If he underwhelms again next year, there's merit to your argument. But there were some reasons for his poor first pro season, and he seems keen on redeeming himself.

Improve his skating will be pivotal in his development.

As far as prospect ranks go, he still has top 4 potential but a poor first pro season definitely drops him into the "second tier" of our defensive prospects behind the likes of Percy, Dermott, etc. A good season this year will vault his stock though.

 

[mikebel111*]

Finn skating is very average, its not even horrible as some people put it. He was the Marlies best d man when he returned from his ECHL stint and than got hurt. It was an unlucky season and lol at weak of a prospect.
Whatever, Finn is putting in a lot of work and I expect him to rebound

What people forget is, he has been a late bloomer at every level

 

[ATBLeafsTyler]

I'm not sure Finn would even go in the first five rounds of a redraft...maybe even go undrafted. There's a reason he's dropped so much in our rankings, and it isn't simply because of increased depth and a down year. It was more than a down year. Leivo's year was a down year. Finn's year exposed how far behind his skating really is. There's a huge gap between the CHL and the AHL, and just as big of a gap between the AHL and the NHL.

He has everything but skating, but skating is HUGE. This is why players who rip junior up should almost never be put ahead of a player in a prospect ranking before a player who has proven to be able to play in the AHL. Obviously there are extenuating circumstances like Marner, but it's a reason why so many people weren't ready to get excited about Brown for instance until they saw what he could do at the AHL level.

Until Finn can prove to be a capable player at the AHL level throughout an entire year, he doesn't belong anywhere near Carrick, Granberg, Soshnikov and even Ryan Rupert.

Finn would have to jump about 3 years development in a one year time to look like he could even play an NHL game in his career.

You guys seem to be really underestimating how serious of an issue and hurdle this is for him. He didn't simply have a down year...he got exposed for how weak of a prospect he really is (at this current time at least).

Basically sums up my thoughts. I know we can't give up just yet, but I'm not very hopeful. I didn't have him in my top 20 (I think top 25 even).